7020 PTO noise and fluid loss.

7020 PTO rattle and oil loss. There's a fairly loud rattle from the rear end. It is mostly heard at low engine speed. It is there whether the tractor is moving, or stopped. It also doesn't matter whether the clutch is in or out. Throttling up, or putting a load on the PTO quiets it down.

I need to add about a gallon of oil to the PTO fill every 40 hours to keep it in the sight gauges. It's not leaking on to the ground. Today I noticed that the transmission oil is over full. It wasn't that far up the dipstick last time I checked.

gear noise is kind of normal, the oil transfer is either the pump drive shaft seal or the seal between the geroter pump (trans supply pump) and gear pump. I would pull the pumps and replace them all.

Ours was doing that so I changed the hydraulic pump shaft seal between the piston pump and gear pump and it fixed. If this doesn’t fix the oil migration then it’s a big job to fix.

Edited by fourthgeneration - 03 Apr 2018 at 10:12pm

For the power steering to be affected by low hydraulic oil levels on the SIGHT GLASSES, it has to be 10 or 12 gallons low on oil  !!!!!    So, I guess I'd start by letting the tractor sit on an absolutely level spot overnight and check the oil in both compartments when cold.  The dipstick in the cab is 7 1/2 gallons of oil and the rear end is about 18 gallons. Oil "transfer" between compartments can only be verified by proper and accurate oil level checking, not by "I think my power steering is acting up". I cannot stress enough the idea that the tractor has to be sitting on a LEVEL spot side-to-side and front-to-back.

I've worked on several hundred of those 7000 and 8000 series tractors with that pinion seal. I have never had a leaker. Not one.  That is not to say there hasn't been some, but it is not very common. When rating the failures in percentages, the transmission getting low and the rear end getting high, I'd say 90% of the time ( in my area) it is the dual pump seal, which may mean a different dual pump due to a spun bushing. It is clear to me that month after month on this website, there are people that don't even understand which dipstick or which sight glass holds what oil. And then they are trying to diagnose a problem, where there may not even be a problem. They really can't even tell you if the oil is transferring front to rear or front to on the ground underneath the tractor. They just think they are losing oil.  If there is really a transfer problem it has to be systematically diagnosed. That means you start with the tractor on a level surface and you use this same parking spot every time until you figure it out.  If the problem is a fast transfer, fine. Go operate for 2 or 3 hrs and park it on your test spot. Let it sit for at least 15 minutes and determine what the oil levels are. This also means 3 point hitch DOWN every time for consistency.  This checking the oil levels once a month and then claiming there's a problem isn't any way to diagnose a potential oil transfer issue. It needs to be daily and write down the hrs of use. You all realize if you have a new farm tractor that is in warranty and you claim the engine uses oil what you have to do to get it repaired????? You will be expected to provide dates, fuel fill gallons and engine oil added for at least 200 hrs. That means every time the tractor is refueled, the engine oil added (if any) and gallons of fuel burned have to be logged on a data sheet. So, you worked the tractor for a day and burned 100 gallons of fuel and added one QUART of eng oil.  AGCO, Cat, Deere, Cummins (with that info) isn't going to do anything. Now, you provide 30 days in a row of that exact same data, then maybe they'll do something. That all being said, when you think you have an oil transfer problem, you better have good "data" or no one will be able to help you.

Am I correct that when seal in the pump starts leaking that oil transfers from the reared to the transmission. I have been watching my 8050. I know the cylinder on my disk leaks a little and the couplers seap and I have to add a gallon of hydraulic oil about every 20hours of run time but the transmission is over full. It has been for several years but i think it’s getting higher. It gets parked in the same spot in the barn so I need to start writing it down how high over the marks it is as you suggest. I thought about pulling the pumps this winter and just resealing them. I know their original.

Edited by wekracer - 12 May 2018 at 6:42am

Thanks doc. I’ll quit worrying about it. Part of the problem is it’s so darned hard to tell just where the level is on those dip sticks.

Thanks,
All the oil transfer issues diagnostics from the forum are pointing to my hydraulic pump drive shaft.
1 from the diff. Housing and 2 in the pump shaft (gerotor and gear).

Thanks
Great inputs

I pulled off the pump, opened the gear pump

Edited by Patrick4316 - 30 May 2018 at 1:08pm

Is anyone still out there?

wekracer wrote: Thanks doc. I’ll quit worrying about it. Part of the problem is it’s so darned hard to tell just where the level is on those dip sticks.

Sometimes I think the dipstick should be black (shameless shut up ) so you can see the oil better. Maybe flat black.

I replace the pump drive shaft seal when ever the pumps are out. Made a driver to drive the new seal in straight.      MACK