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WD45 hydraulic pump

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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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    Posted: 23 Apr 2011 at 7:25pm
There was nothing better to to on a rainy day in southern Illinois so my brother and I began working on the pump. We adjusted all the linkage according to the manual and with plenty of fluid it would only put out about 1500 psi at the remote outlet instead of the 3500. We pulled the pump off. It took quite allot of wiggling and cussing to get it out from between the frame rail and the housing!!! Got it out and laid on the work bench. All four cam followers still seemed to be spring loaded. The adjusting screw seemed to still move the control valve but not certain. We got this far, can our orange friends guide us further into this project?? Thanks, Ryan
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MACK View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MACK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2011 at 9:50pm
To adj the pressure, remove the 4 -1/4 in bolts on front of pump holding plate on. There will be two valves exposed. Tap quick and lightly on the one closest to pumping plungers. It should bounce out farenough to get ahold of. Pull it out easy to keep every thing togather. There will be shims between spring and plunger. Add shims to increase pressure.
 On the top of pump there are 4 plugs and one on back, remove plugs and replace the 5 springs don't loose your 5 balls that are under springs.
 On spool opposite the pressure spool, drive the spool assy. to back of pump and replace the two orings along with two orings on pressure spool (unloading valve). 
 Re assembly. Good luck.    MACK
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 10:10am
I've been reading info on it this morning. Maybe I am over thinking and making it harder than it should be.
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Steve M C/IL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve M C/IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 7:02pm
Just take your time and pay attention to detail.It's not as intimidating as you think and you really can't mess up much.I'd say keeping track of the direction and order of the control vavles and sleeves would be the most critical if you remove them.Mack's advise had you leaving them in and alone.If it's pumping good they are are not your problem as far as pressure goes.Sometimes they can get tiny bits of FM in them that don't let them shift position which controls pump flow rate.Let's say you tear it all apart and don't have a clue how to put back.Put all the pieces in a box and take it to someone who knows these old units and they can whip it back together in short order.It ain't really that high tech. 
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 8:14pm
The big problem was slow lifting and a lack of pressure. The gauge would only read 1500 psi and would slowly fall. We plowed the garden afew weeks back and it wouldnt lift the plow up at the end of the garden if it had any dirt on it.
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Chris/CT View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chris/CT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 8:20pm
I do have the section outlining the repair of that pump, I can send you copy if needed.
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kffischer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kffischer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 9:13pm
couldn't the transport valve cause the same symptoms if it was stuck?
You should have tested at the pump outlet to the lift arm rams in addition to the remote for better diagnosis.  Unless you posted of this before...
karl f
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 9:16pm
Please do Chris!! It never hurts to see another manual. My Email is RjRenko@aol.com. Thanks very much Chris. Ryan
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CTuckerNWIL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 9:37pm
Ryan, if you hammer the pointy end of a seven penny nail down to look kinda like a thin spoon, you can insert nails to release pressure on the cam followers. It makes reassembly way easier. Seems like somebody used zip strips to do the same thing???
 Do you have a transport valve on that tractor? My pump quit suddenly one spring and wouldn't lift the disc. I found the shoulder on the relief spool had cracked and broke completely off letting the pump bypass continually. If you get a little piece of gunk on the ball or seat behind the relief spool it could be leaking by.
http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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Bill Long View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bill Long Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 9:46pm
Ryan,  Don't be intimidated by working on the hyd pump.  Just keep all the parts in order as they are removed.  Keep the parts in clean diesel oil so they will not enlarge.  Be sure to clean the pump.  As said above it does not take much to foul up action. 
Looks like you have gotten the pump working as suggested.  However you do not have pressure  Could be a leak somewhere.  O-rings ect.  Check spring pressure to be certain there are no broken springs.  Are all the plungers moving well.  Pull them out and see if there are any broken springs under them.  Look closely.
Charlie, we were told from the factor to batter the end of nails to make tools to hold the cam followers in.  If the pump does not come out easily then go to lunch. I did that came back and it almost fell out.
Remember, If I can take a pump appart and get it back together working I am certain you can.
Let us know how it goes. 
Good Luck!
Bill Long
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 9:57pm
If the transport valve was stuck, I'm thinking it wouldn't affect the lifting of the plow though which is done by the lift arms. Am I wrong?? I appreciate all your input and comments. Ryan
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Steve M C/IL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve M C/IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 10:37pm
All the plumbing comes off the hold valve.Remote and both lift arm cylinders so if your transport valve is not turned in tight it could be bypassing pressure there and dumping it back to sump.Do you for sure have a transport valve? It'd be on the end of the remote line with a return dumping back in at the fill cap.
   I'm thinking maybe all 45's had transports but not sure. On the "nail" tip,you'll see where to wedge them in the lever when you compress it down by hand.Once you've cleared the housing with the rollers and the pump is kinda hanging on the pickup tube,you can pull them out with pliers easily.Don't drop one inside housing!
  The thumbscrew on front adjusts amount of oil pumped.It should be out against the clutch hsg when pump is mounted.Some suggest screwing all in then out to fix a stuck valve if pump seems slow. Screw it in 1/2 for mounting pump then back it out(more clearence).Your pressure problem isn't affected by this side of pump.


Edited by Steve M C/IL - 24 Apr 2011 at 11:06pm
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Jim Hancock View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jim Hancock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2011 at 10:59pm
Hi Chris.
Would you mind shooting me a copy of the pump repair also? I think that I might be looking at a repair in the not too distant future. Thanks. Jim
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Chris/CT View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chris/CT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Apr 2011 at 8:05am
Getting copy's done today, will contact you folks for address.
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Roddo View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roddo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Apr 2011 at 9:20am
I'd love one as well!
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2011 at 9:17pm
It still aint right!! We took pump off and very carefully started our rebuild. Ordered a seal and plunger kit from Agco part#70255272. All control valves were not stuck and were oiled and correctly reinstalled. All springs were not broken but replaced anyway. The only issue was the unloading valve assembly which Agco told me was no longer available but had a outside supplier. After all linkage was adjusted the pump was just as weak as before we started. It only would put out 1500psi and would slowly drop!! What are we missing?? The unloading valve from the after market supplier or what?? I don't know whats left to work on. Ryan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MBWisc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 May 2011 at 8:13am
I'd appreciate a copy too!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Auntwayne Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 2:51pm
Bump
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CTuckerNWIL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 3:13pm
Did the pump work OK say last year? You could add about .020 inch of shim to add about 1400psi but if it worked before and has recently lost pressure or volume, there is something wrong with the pump.
http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 8:30pm
I was wondering what each shim added to the unloading valve would really do in terms of psi increase. Ryan
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CTuckerNWIL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 8:39pm
.010 will do 700 psi on my WD45.
http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 8:49pm
CTucker, thanks for any info!!! My brother and I are running out of things to replace!! We were VERY CAREFULL and had alot of information in front of us as we started. Replaced all springs and orings with Agco parts. The only other thing we didnt replace was the unloading valve assembly which I was told by our dealer was no longer available through Agco but they gave me a phone number for a aftermarket one. Maybe shims could be the answer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tedin NE-OH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 8:54pm
Just a thought, have you checked your guage?
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 9:10pm
Yes Ted. We put in our 1950 WD and it read a good 3600 psi!! We are at a point were we will not let this pump beat us!! lol
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 9:17pm
Ryan, if you take the relief spool out to shim it up, take a close look at the corner where the shims seat. Mine cracked there and came apart in 2 pieces. If it breaks all the way, like mine did, you won't have enough pressure to pick up a wheel disc. BTDT
http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 9:29pm
CTucker, it wasnt cracked. I kinda figured if the unloading valve was no longer available through Agco it must not be a high wear item. Am I wrong?? Ryan
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CTuckerNWIL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2011 at 9:48pm
No, as long as it's not cracked or broken. I doubt it would wear out.
 My new one from agco, several years ago wasn't machined complete and caused my pump to unload at over 9000psi. I took it back apart and found a 1/4 inch diameter c'bore missing down inside the back end. That was like adding a 1/4 inch shim to the front.


Edited by CTuckerNWIL - 28 May 2011 at 9:51pm
http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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Steve M C/IL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve M C/IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2011 at 11:56am
Years ago I put a new unloader in my 45 and it didn't help a bit.Had 11 shims and still eradic unload pressures.Doubt unloader is culprit but this seems to be the $64000 question no one can answer.I've got a 5/16 washer with the center trimmed out as an additional shim and it's useable.Always good pressure at/off idle but not at half throttle or more.Always suspected the check ball on back end of pump where it transfers to control valve of not holding and getting a "bounce back" of pressure which effects unloader but never went to the trouble to prove it.They didn't include that "valve" in my rebuild kit from AC years ago.It takes pressure on the outlet end of unloader to lift ball off seat.I don't understand how mine can vary so much but it's most effected by rpm.I quit beating my head on the wall on got it useable and quit.
 
  I'd shim the crap out of it first and see what happens.Keep in mind it's very hard not to nick the o-rings taking the unloader in and out.A cut o-ring won't help the preesure thing.


Edited by Steve M C/IL - 29 May 2011 at 12:00pm
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Ryan Renko View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Renko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2011 at 9:03pm
I think thats our next step. We have became real good at removing the pump!! What about the shim issue?? We are reading about 1500psi right now, now many shims would a person add?? Ryan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2011 at 9:07pm
.020-.025 inch should do it. I have a home made hole punch so i make em right on my bench in the garage. it helps to have shim stock available when you need it.
http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
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