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A/C B connecting rods "Rework" |
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BrianC
Orange Level Joined: 16 Jun 2011 Location: New York Points: 1613 |
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You could do a hardness test in the area where the lobe don't touch. A comparative test vs. another lifter that only needed touch up. Maybe find another lifter in better shape.
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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For a little bit of clarity. For those who might not know, that is a tool post grinder that I am standing next to. Steve (inME)
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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That is a good point Steve. I would like to think that they are hardened throughout. If
it is hard faced, you are right, it wouldn't be like the others. I
watched for the spark to change color, it stayed the same. I know that
doesn't mean much, but what is there should still hard. How deep the hardness goes in these parts? That's beyond me. I appreciate the input. Steve
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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Thanks Brian, Man that's too bad. A tool post grinder can be really handy with machining hardened parts on a lathe. I used to work in an electric motor repair shop. BIG electric motors for the paper mills. |
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SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 8035 |
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If they were hard faced to begin with,that is long gone on that one so even a soft face in good shape should be better on the cam.
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BrianC
Orange Level Joined: 16 Jun 2011 Location: New York Points: 1613 |
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I used to have a tool post grinder for my lathe. Someone walked away with it. Step by step, keep it up.
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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8 more horsepower Steve? I don't think so. I did have to remove almost 1/32 to get this one to clean. Some of the others weren't so bad.
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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Thanks Brian
I am lapping the lifters on a sheet of 220 grit, then to 400 grit, with penetrating oil against a flat plate. I plan on using Permatex Ultra Slick Engine Assembly Lube. I have been wondering about what to use for break in oil in the crank case at start up. Any suggestions, would be appreciated. Thanks again Steve (inME.)
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BrianC
Orange Level Joined: 16 Jun 2011 Location: New York Points: 1613 |
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That looks nice. In the last picture it looks finer, I guess you lapped it. The camshaft makers are fanatically adamant about the proper assembly lube and break-in oil, and priming the oil system for first start up. That is for high revving latter day engines. Yours is 1600 rpm, low spring pressure. Still, I would get some of that camshaft assembly lube. |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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wjohn, I want to thank you for sending out that link to me. I read it over and the last thing that I need is chunks of chipped up lifters in the oil pan.
I checked a couple of lifters and they were flat on the bottom. Then I picked up a third one. It was #5. It was concave. That was the lobe number that was warn out on the cam that I pulled. I am going to fix the lifters here at the house. Thanks again for the heads up. Steve (inME)
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wjohn
Orange Level Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 1812 |
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Are you going to resurface the lifters since the reman camshaft had the lobes ground (I presume)? The guidance I got and info I found around the internet suggested this was a good idea when installing a reground cam. Here's a thread I started where I asked the question and ended up resurfacing my WD lifters myself once I discovered that a brand new lifter for that engine was flat. I do not know for certain if the B engine lifters were flat or slightly convex when new. Another potential risk is that I do not know if they are hardened to a certain depth that I might have gotten into. Other members had done this before so I thought it was low risk. I still have not gotten my engine back together yet unfortunately. Just wanted to bring this up if you hadn't thought about it yet. |
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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Just after Christmas, I tried to place a ring into the (bottom) of one of the sleeves. As it went in, it made a short scratch in the liner. I looked at the gap, it looked at the gap by eye, close to .010, maybe less. I pulled the ring out and put it back in the package.
Before I place another ring in a sleeve, I am going to check it for burrs, Clearly, I have a lot of work ahead of me. The engine is in the cellar. I work on it for a few hours every day. Some days I don't go near it at all. |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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Thanks Mack
That's a good Idea. That will save me some time. |
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MACK
Orange Level Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Points: 7664 |
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Use your pistons to square the rings. MACK
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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Oh, I forgot to mention that I took the plunge, and got oversize pistons, rings, and sleeves. Got to have that extra 1 or 2 horsepower when I really need it.
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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I had to get an answer on those rods. I contacted the guy who sold me the tractor.
(He was the builder of my house and my former neighbor.) He was easy to find. He said that he traded an old station wagon for the tractor in the late 80's. Unfortunately the original owner had passed away over 10 years ago, but he was able to get in touch with his son for me. We spoke on the phone for almost an hour. He seemed happy to hear that Wendy and I were taking good care of his fathers Allis B.
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steve(ill)
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 78073 |
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sounds like you are building a RACE CAR !!!............... 125 cubic inch / 20 HP..
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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I have a new
set of pistons, rings, and liners. I checked the block closely and it seems to be in great shape. I
checked the top of the bare block with a straight edge. There was no deviation
or uneven areas. I spent a lot of time cleaning the oil sludge out of the block
and getting the dirt out of the coolant chamber. I purchased
an oil pump rebuild kit and have lapped the back plate flat. That Is ready to
go. I rebuilt
the governor assembly. At first the
liners would not go all the way down into the block. I lightly honed the lower
liner diameter with a small wheel cylinder hone and some light oil, and the
liners slide right in now, without the “O” rings attached. After
setting the liners into place, (without “O” rings), I checked the protrusion
for the liners. They sit cleanly in the block with a .002 - .004 protrusion. The camshaft
lifters were pulled, cleaned, numbered, tagged, and bagged. I have installed
new cam bearings, and I purchased a remanufactured cam shaft. After
measuring the cam all the cam lobes are the same height, and the 3 bearing
journals each measure 1.749. After getting
the cylinder head milled flat. I have rebuilt the cylinder head with new
valves, springs, and valve guides. Lapped the valves to the new valve seats. That’s all I
can think of right now. I haven’t gotten to setting the gap on the rings yet. I
was wondering if it was necessary for me to make a ring squaring tool to
seat the piston ring squarely in the bore, to use a feeler gauge to check its
gap. I have a
better idea how to maintain bearing crush and how shimming the split line
works. I have never heard of ether of these. I am not an
engine rebuilder. I feel that I do have enough common sense to assemble this
engine into spec. Having the service manual and a parts number book has been a
big help as well. |
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steve(ill)
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 78073 |
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He remembered that they squeezed the rods in a vice at the parting lines because he removed too much from the flats on the rods to get them to fit.
well........... i dont remember reading that one in the service manual !!
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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BrianC
Orange Level Joined: 16 Jun 2011 Location: New York Points: 1613 |
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Does it make sense to balance the rods? Pistons? I lost track of what all you are doing. Maybe you can recap the scope of the rebuild? I know you worked on the main journal bearings and end play. New pistons, rings and liners? Rings- end gap and clearance/fit to grooves in pistons. Liners- protrusion and o-ring sealing. If the block's sealing surface is corroded they might leak. The camshaft, you should put the lifters back to the lobe where they came from.From my experience the top problems of rebuilds are crank/rod bearing issues, wet liner leak, head gasket leak. Another is the darn rear main seal leaking. Interesting to me, I have a '48 C needing an engine rebuild. |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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Over last weekend, I was able to get in contact with the son of the original owner of my Allis B. I asked him if he knew anything about the engine being worked on in the past. He said that he remembered that his father was getting lower end noise from the engine. He said his father worked on the crankshaft. He pulled shims out, and ground the flats of the connecting rods to get the connecting rods to fit. He remembered that they squeezed the rods in a vice at the parting lines because he removed too much from the flats on the rods to get them to fit.
That explained to me how the bores on the connecting rods became egged. I finished the rods today. I am very happy with they way that they spin freely on the crankshaft. |
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ac55tractor
Silver Level Joined: 20 Oct 2012 Location: Raymond, Maine Points: 240 |
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It was something that I noticed, I was curious about it. Thanks.
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steve(ill)
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 78073 |
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the screen should be well BELOW the oil line.. should not suck air.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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