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Radiator fluid in oil Allis B |
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DiyDave
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gambrills, MD Points: 50528 |
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Posted: 09 Dec 2019 at 7:37am |
I wouldn't go with emory cloth, try some of those scotch-bright pads, finest you can get...
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Source: Babylon Bee. Sponsored by BRAWNDO, its got what you need!
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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Greg,
That is looking like a Allis engine torn down! Clean up and inspection next. Your moving right along! Thanks for the update on your progress! Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 7981 |
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Always replace cam bearings on an old AC
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gman54313
Silver Level Joined: 23 Nov 2019 Location: Green Bay WI Points: 66 |
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Update, I had time today to mount the engine block to the stand. Man I wish we had these things when I was younger maybe they did but I never heard of them. Anyway I was able to remove the crank caps mark them and remove the crank and the cam. sometime this week I will mic the journals' to see if they are in specs. The main journal surfaces look very smooth except where the oil groove is on the bearing that looks to be stained by something maybe water thinking emery cloth. I don't think I will be turning any wrenches this week because it is going to get very, very cold this week. But no big deal I have all winter to work on this project. A big thank you to Alex for reaching out to me with some misc. parts he has to offer. never knew there was a place only 30 minutes away from me who deals in old tractor parts.
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ac fleet
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jan 2014 Location: Arrowsmith, ILL Points: 2204 |
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Slick idea!!! LOL!!!
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http://machinebuildersnetwork.com/
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gman54313
Silver Level Joined: 23 Nov 2019 Location: Green Bay WI Points: 66 |
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To me that is a work of art and should be display instead of the some of these paintings/sculptures I've seen in our public museums. |
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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Dick,
Nice! Thanks!
Regards, Chris |
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Dick L
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Edon Ohio Points: 5082 |
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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Greg,
I believe that you will have to pull the flywheel to mount the engine. But I have not done one of those blocks. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Dick L
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Edon Ohio Points: 5082 |
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I adjust an engines vertical center after adding or removing the head to keep from ripping an arm off. |
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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WF That has some very nice features in a engine stand! Yes if they are not fairly balanced it can be a real challenge rotating them!
Only dis advantage is that you cant attach the support/ pivot to the engine first and then pick it up and insert the stand on to the rotating shaft.
Regards, Chris |
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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WF owner
Orange Level Joined: 12 May 2013 Location: Bombay NY Points: 4388 |
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Harbor Freight's stands are good. I have four of them.
I am thinking of spending a little more to get one from Jeg's that has a worm gear drive to rotate the engine. If you have ever rotated an engine on the Harbor Freight stand, you know you had better eat your Wheaties and hold on. I'm getting too old for that, so I think I may take the plunge for this stand. |
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gman54313
Silver Level Joined: 23 Nov 2019 Location: Green Bay WI Points: 66 |
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Dick L.
I have been pondering the process of the sleeve installation and how one would keep the o rings from being damaged, I am very glad you posted that tip. I recall the pic of the flapper tool and will review your post again. The bluing is a very great idea for the high spots cause I imagine one would want to keep things as symmetrical as possible. Regards Greg |
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gman54313
Silver Level Joined: 23 Nov 2019 Location: Green Bay WI Points: 66 |
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SugarMaker
I am the same way in regards to want to measure twice and cut only once mentality I spent most of my younger life rolling engine blocks around on the work bench. Not much fun so I spent $60 bucks on the stand. now I just need to find some threaded rod or long bolts should have something laying around. Wait, I should first need to pull the flywheel. regards Greg |
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Dick L
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Edon Ohio Points: 5082 |
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An added tip on installing sleeves! They are wet sleeves and are (not) a press fit. Without o rings the sleeve needs to be able to drop in and turn 360º with one hand. Going back to my pictures you will see a flapper in a die grinder. This is how I get the hole cleaned out so they will turn 369º It takes more than a little flapping. I find the tight areas using bluing. Paint mist will also work. A tight fit will not let the o rings enter the bore with out pinching/shearing.
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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gman,
I had never done any till last spring. I took some lessons, did some research, got a mentor, and kept working on the seat area to get the correct sleeve standout! Was it easy? No! Was it worth the effort? Yes! Your going in the right direction. Little Marv has some good pictures of his work on your type engine. I have a thread on a WD45. and there are many folks that can help you with the little details to get it right! I know these can be re-built in frame, also block could be rolled around on a bench. But if your like me and need to check things a couple times the engine stand allows many rotations to work on the block and the components to assemble it properly. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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gman54313
Silver Level Joined: 23 Nov 2019 Location: Green Bay WI Points: 66 |
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you gents are reading my mind on the stand LOL Also thank you for the advise on the O-rings. I have never installed sleeves so any feedback is valuable to me.
Kindest Regards Greg aka gman |
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ACJohn
Silver Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Horseheads, NY Points: 147 |
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When installing new (or used) sleeves, use plenty of o-ring lube and deburr any sharp edges on the top side of web where the o-rings seal. I put together an entire engine only to find I cut an o-ring installing a sleeve. PITA to have to do it over!! |
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Gary
Orange Level Access Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Peterborough,On Points: 5171 |
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An 'Engine Stand' is definitely recommended. Harbor Freight presently has a 3 day Sale on both Engine Hoist and Engine Stand. Both well worth the money. 1 ton Crane $128. 1000 lb Engine Stand $49. Gary |
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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Gman,
Good pictures! Glad that block looks ok! O-rings look bad! Do you have a engine stand? Looks like that would be the thing to do next! It sure makes the inspection, cleaning, and assembly work easier. And sealing up the bottom end is much easier too. Good luck in your rebuild! Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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gman54313
Silver Level Joined: 23 Nov 2019 Location: Green Bay WI Points: 66 |
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Again thank you to all for your input.
Today after work I was able to pull the remainder of the sleeves the fact that my plug for pulling the sleeves fit snuggly into the bottom of each sleeve gave me a clue all the bores were 3-3/8 and I did verify that with a gauge. After looking at all the sleeves two of the four had obvious gaps in the O-rings and all four look like they were 80 years old which i'm sure they are. After the sleeves where pulled and I covered up the crank journals and cleaned all the gak between the webs to inspect for cracks and to my surprise I did not see anything. I recently notice that the thermostat block and the lower radiator elbow with the peacock had been brazed. I am guessing because it froze at some point and cracked so I naturally was concerned about the block. The next step for me is to pull the crank and cam and check my tolerances. |
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JimD
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Mounds, OK Points: 2094 |
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Sure looks to me like someone beat apart a stuck engine. I've made them marks myself :) But I would never re-use with the damage. Customer wanted t rebuilt and supplied the kit.
JImD
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Owner of OKtractor.com PM for an instant response on parts. Open M-F 9-6 Central.
We have new and used parts. 877-378-6543 |
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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gman,
Nice work pulling the sleeves! Yes that one o-ring is compromised. Hoping you dont have block issue. I think if you clean up the webs in the block you would be able to visually see cracks. They were obvious on the cracked block I had. Your on your way. I guess my thought on the rebuilds is that I will probably never have to overhaul the engine again so the cost of getting new parts is spread over a long time. The things like mismatched pistons and new bearings lead me to think you will need a full kit with sleeves , pistons, rings, bearings, etc.... Regards, Chris Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Dick L
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Edon Ohio Points: 5082 |
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That picture album was of rebuilding an engine with all in spec used parts. New rings and bearings. I did this to show that it is not always necessary to throw the bank on a rebuild. I did this ten years, nine months ago and have used the tractor with a Woods 59 under it every since to mow 3 acres of yard and mulch manure in my hay fields. It will fire up today as easy as it did then and does not smoke. The point is in spec parts will give you very good service for a long time. It is in the (DETAILS) Edited by Dick L - 05 Dec 2019 at 6:11am |
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Gerald J.
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Hamilton Co, IA Points: 5636 |
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The shop manual might have some details to help figure out the conditions and repair details:
http://geraldj.networkiowa.com/Trees/Allis-Chalmers-G-B-C-CA-Service.pdf Gerald J. |
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gman54313
Silver Level Joined: 23 Nov 2019 Location: Green Bay WI Points: 66 |
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Thank you to everyone for there input a few views I never would have thought off.
Last night I pulled out # 3 and it looks like a different piston even the oil ring is different from the others. rod bearing and crank looks good or at least go enough till I mic it. After work today I pull #1 sleeve which went really well with the puller we made. I did see the bottom oring had a gap in it. guess that had something to do with the leak. my biggest concern was if there was a crack in the block which I could not detect. I will have time tomorrow after work to pull the rest of the liners and then check the crank before I decide haw far I will have to go with buying parts. |
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gman54313
Silver Level Joined: 23 Nov 2019 Location: Green Bay WI Points: 66 |
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Dick L.
The photo album or the Alley rebuild was helpful, Wow I thought my cylinders were bad. Good point about the wear on the bearing and possible bent rod. |
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gman54313
Silver Level Joined: 23 Nov 2019 Location: Green Bay WI Points: 66 |
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I am actually enjoying turning wrenches on Allis like most people I just want to be smart about it, money that is. |
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Sugarmaker
Orange Level Joined: 12 Jul 2013 Location: Albion PA Points: 8167 |
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gman,
Your right into it! Looks like your pretty comfortable with the work. Great pictures too. We cant help you much on the cost. Nothing is cheap any more. I set aside a WD for 2 years due to some clutch parts it needed. I had to get my mind and wallet around the project and then at that point I was good to go. Several things have to come together at the same time for these things to happen too! I spent at least 9 months on the 226 engine I overhauled. So it takes time and money. Looks like your disassembly is going to lead you to make the correct choices for you, your tractor and this engine project! Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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wekracer
Orange Level Joined: 13 Oct 2009 Location: Tebbetts, MO Points: 1587 |
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Have you priced an engine kit. You already talking about bearings and rings and head gasket etc. By the time you piece it together you can probably get a whole kit for about the same money.
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