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Carburetor for WC Puller

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Butch(OH) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Butch(OH) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Feb 2013 at 7:51am
Originally posted by SuperM74 SuperM74 wrote:

Or, what is your website? Most reputable automotive machine sites have a web page... I.E. Custom Race Engines, Cornett Automotive, Jay Dickens Racing Engines, Riverside, Haisley Machine..... You get the idea...
 
Key word being "reputable" Pank is a legend in his own mind only. One engine pieced together in the bathroom of a buddy's shop and it went KABOOM!    after 5 runs and lots of time searching the internet and playing with online calculators.  Hooks, wins and intelligent posts talk but BS walks and Pank has worn out a lot of shoes.


Edited by Butch(OH) - 28 Feb 2013 at 7:52am
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unstylish_ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote unstylish_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Feb 2013 at 8:08am
Hes what my dad would call a two week veteren.
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wi50 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wi50 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Feb 2013 at 8:33am
I really get a kick out of some of these "keyboard commando's" like spankey. It doesn't matter if you're on a tractor pulling website, or my other hobby, long range shooting. These guys are all the same. Never done much, tried in a publoc arena and weren't as good as they thought. So they resort to trying to controll a forum by spewing BS and attacking a few members who know, makeing it impossiable for those who don't know to decipher any good and usefull information from the random BS.

Then they get off on being on a forum for longer than someone else. Well I don't think real knowledge has anything to do with how long someone's been pissing their days away hideing behind a keyboard. Real knowledge comes from practical experience with the subject at hand.

Now I've put in a lot of time with "real experts", not the internet ones. But friends who you can talk to in person who have gotten their hands dirty and layed awake figureing it out. Spent tens of thousands of dollars of earned income playing on the pulling track, the flowbench and in the shop as many of you have. It doesn't make me an expert, but it sure does help me build a well performing all around engine package.
"see what happens when you have no practical experience doing something...... you end up playing with calculators and looking stupid on the internet"
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mlpankey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlpankey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Feb 2013 at 9:38am
once again 184 starlet circle cleveland tn 373232 or the other shop 727 reynolds bridge rd benton  tn 37307. I dont know how many times a guy has to post this. Some never understand straight forward wording if its not a page long bs post by wi
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Steve in NJ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve in NJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Feb 2013 at 9:53am
Getting back to the original question, (and I forgot what it was after four pages of dart throwing) the TSX464 carb would work fine with your stock or slightly modified engine. Marty mentioned about air density from down draft to updraft carbs. I agree. The main reason why I hone and smooth the intake bores of the pulling carbs I do for some of my customer's to increase the air speed. If we can get the air moving faster through an updraft unit, that increases its ability to produce more reliable power which can equate to torque increases also. Be careful just drilling out jets on carbs that will only flow an 'x' amount of air. As a rule of thumb, you can kick most carbs up one step or possibly two in jet size, and in this case on a 464, but then you start to take unit out of the realm of its stochiometric air/fuel mix. A modified engine of coarse would need a larger air/fuel mixer to make adaquit power and good ingestion, but again, it depends on what power range you want to put the engine into. Increasing air speed and establishing the right mix of fuel will increase the torque range. And Torque, as we know is pullin' power....
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Glockhead SWMI View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Glockhead SWMI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Feb 2013 at 10:31am
Well said Steve. 
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mlpankey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlpankey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 2013 at 5:59am
if the air speed is to fast it will choke the engine but in steves case removing material would enlarge the opening decreasing the velocity
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Rod B View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rod B Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 2013 at 6:52am
You don't really need to waste your time replying pankey. Wi already covered that id you were smart enough to rember what you read in his posts.
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WildBill View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WildBill Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 2013 at 11:25am
THANKS STEVE IN NJ FOR CLEARING UP MY PREVIOUS POST TO WHO ARGUED WITH ME YOU CANNOT DRILL THE JETS 1 OR 2 SIZES. AS I HAD STATED IN THE POST THE EMUSHION TUBE IS DESIGNED TO THE VENTURI DIA. I WILL AGREE ON POLISHING THE VENTURI TO SPEED THE AIR COMING IN. PANKY SHUTUP!! THE 464 IS A GREAT CARB AND I FOUND THE SMALL UP GRADES BRING A NICE IMPROVEMENT ON OPERATION AND TUNING. ITS NOT GOING IN THE CARB AND  HOGGING IT OUT OR BUTCHERING IT!!  PAY ATTENTION TO THE CARBS DETAIL. NOT ALL ARE ALIKE. I ALSO MAKE SURE THE BUTTERFLY SHAFT IS SEALED AND NOT SLOPPED OUT. I LIKE WI'S STATMENT" AIR CANNOT TURN CORNERS"       FIND THE PATH OF LEAST RESISTANCE.
Allis fan for life !   B,C,2-WC'S,WD45G,D19G,190xt ,LLSS 8010, terra tiger refurbished
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mlpankey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlpankey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 2013 at 4:20pm
The magic number is. Drumroll please the speed of sound. Dummies sometimes the ones who say they have a flow bench are just full of it. Smoke and mirrors.if they dont understand what they are doing. He still hasnt posted the first formula either. Ut did find time to post a couple of more times his typical bs.

Edited by mlpankey - 01 Mar 2013 at 4:39pm
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Rod B View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rod B Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 2013 at 5:07pm
Originally posted by mlpankey mlpankey wrote:

Dummies sometimes the ones who say they have a flow bench are just full of it. Smoke and mirrors.
 
Pankey claimed to have a wet flow bench allong with his immaginary crank welder and grinder.  He's got hemself pegged here in this quote.
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unstylish_ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote unstylish_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 2013 at 5:57pm
That's right, he did! I guess this really tops off who is full of bs
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mlpankey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlpankey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 2013 at 6:08pm
No smoke or mirrors here .when you need me to fix what you cant you will make the trip and see.

Edited by mlpankey - 01 Mar 2013 at 6:09pm
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unstylish_ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote unstylish_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 2013 at 6:17pm
Mitch, you couldn't fix your way out of a cardboard box. Your inconsistencies speak too loudly. Sorry bud.
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Steve in NJ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve in NJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Mar 2013 at 11:39am
WildBill,
As I said, small changes and upgrades to the 464 on a slightly modified 226 will have great benefits. Those 45' engines really respond quite nicely to small mods. When it comes to modifying the 464, I refer to it as "messaging" the carb. If you keep it in its realm, it works out real nice, and they work pretty slick. You just have to work with it and dial it in.. Thumbs Up
Steve@B&B
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WildBill View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WildBill Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Mar 2013 at 1:16pm

Mitch (pank) I spent some time going back through posts and find yourself contradicting yourself a whole bunch of times ? Dude ya need to be consistant and the only thing from what i learned on here from( you ) is inconsistancy ?  I can give you my sons leap frog with a couple beginner learning discs if you need to start over ?  was a thought . 

Allis fan for life !   B,C,2-WC'S,WD45G,D19G,190xt ,LLSS 8010, terra tiger refurbished
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kip-Utah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2013 at 12:27pm
I run one of Steve's mildly massaged MS 464 carbs on a 240 cid engine in my WC puller and it works great! KipClap
HANSEN'S OLD ORANGE IRON. Showing, Pulling, & Going!!
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mlpankey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlpankey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2013 at 1:02pm
Originally posted by WildBill WildBill wrote:

Mitch (pank) I spent some time going back through posts and find yourself contradicting yourself a whole bunch of times ? Dude ya need to be consistant and the only thing from what i learned on here from( you ) is inconsistancy ?  I can give you my sons leap frog with a couple beginner learning discs if you need to start over ?  was a thought . 

  Variables for build is not inconsistency
even though to the uneducated it may apper that way to the educated they know where the limits and points of no return are . Like speed of sound disrupting airflow even though velocity is a good advantage up to that point.


Edited by mlpankey - 05 Mar 2013 at 1:19pm
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wi50 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wi50 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2013 at 2:43pm
I really don't have time to alienate you this week either pankey.  But why don't you pay a little attention and do a little research on your own.
 
Air speed and air density are 2 different things, but do work somewhat hand in hand.  By shapeing the carbuerator bowl and air intake, we can increase the air density going through the venturi.  Thus the same airflow, with less speed.  With proper modifications we can actually allow an increase in AIR SPEED also when the engine demands it.
 Modifications allowing the air to turn the corner in the carbuerator with less turbulance will help it maintain velocity and acclerate when traveling through the venturi.  So we can have an increase in both speed and density. 
 
The speed of sound is roughly what?  Anyone care to take a guess?  Well it depends on elevation and atmospheric conditions for a given day.  But lets just give it a nice round number of 1100 FPS (feet per second).  1 mach is the speed of sound.  So .4 Mach is about 440 FPS
 
A carb is considered choked by .4 mach.  One air speed hits about .4 mach, it doesn't matter how much "depression" in the manifold, it just isn't going to flow any more air.
 
These numbers are well less than half the speed of sound.  I'd rather have a carb that's choked a bit at the verry upper end of it'd operating range than one that's to big.  One that's to big will alwayse be to big and cause a loss of peak torque as well as a loss of torque all through the useable power band.
 
If you can get air to bend around that sharp 90 degree corner in a single barrel updraft carb and then approach the speed of sound....... good luck.  It don't happen in the real world. 
 
"see what happens when you have no practical experience doing something...... you end up playing with calculators and looking stupid on the internet"
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mlpankey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlpankey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2013 at 2:55pm
Glad you understand speed of sound and how it disrupts airflow. The guys may want to follow my advise and run the large carbs after all you did. Wc with tqo barrel pictured.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rod B Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2013 at 4:04pm
Originally posted by mlpankey mlpankey wrote:

Originally posted by WildBill WildBill wrote:

Mitch (pank) I spent some time going back through posts and find yourself contradicting yourself a whole bunch of times ? Dude ya need to be consistant and the only thing from what i learned on here from( you ) is inconsistancy ?  I can give you my sons leap frog with a couple beginner learning discs if you need to start over ?  was a thought . 

  Variables for build is not inconsistency
even though to the uneducated it may apper that way to the educated they know where the limits and points of no return are . Like speed of sound disrupting airflow even though velocity is a good advantage up to that point.
 
 
But right here you say air speed is an advantage up to the speed of sound.  Wi says it's an advantage up to .4X the speed of sound.
 
Wi is right.  Pank is full of BS.
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Gary in da UP View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary in da UP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2013 at 4:17pm
Originally posted by mlpankey mlpankey wrote:

Glad you understand speed of sound and how it disrupts airflow. The guys may want to follow my advise and run the large carbs after all you did. Wc with tqo barrel pictured.
 ,
 No way ! I admire the guys who can build things, and fix things. I doubt you could fix a sandwitch.... Advice from Marty , Butch, Ken, and others on here is priceless, advice from a guy with plasma under his cap is worth exactly what we pay for it,  it's nothing but nonsenseical gibberish. See a doctor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlpankey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2013 at 6:41pm
Originally posted by Gary in da UP Gary in da UP wrote:

Originally posted by mlpankey mlpankey wrote:

Glad you understand speed of sound and how it disrupts airflow. The guys may want to follow my advise and run the large carbs after all you did. Wc with tqo barrel pictured.
 ,
 No way ! I admire the guys who can build things, and fix things. I doubt you could fix a sandwitch.... Advice from Marty , Butch, Ken, and others on here is priceless, advice from a guy with plasma under his cap is worth exactly what we pay for it,  it's nothing but nonsenseical gibberish. See a doctor.
go to the crank build  topic larry posted i have some pictures for you .maybe you can figure them out i know there not in crayon and that might overload you
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ihateillinoisnazis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2013 at 7:50pm
Originally posted by mlpankey mlpankey wrote:

Originally posted by Gary in da UP Gary in da UP wrote:

Originally posted by mlpankey mlpankey wrote:

Glad you understand speed of sound and how it disrupts airflow. The guys may want to follow my advise and run the large carbs after all you did. Wc with tqo barrel pictured.
 ,
 No way ! I admire the guys who can build things, and fix things. I doubt you could fix a sandwitch.... Advice from Marty , Butch, Ken, and others on here is priceless, advice from a guy with plasma under his cap is worth exactly what we pay for it,  it's nothing but nonsenseical gibberish. See a doctor.
go to the crank build  topic larry posted i have some pictures for you .maybe you can figure them out i know there not in crayon and that might overload you


Crayon!! Did you pull those videos off the worlds first 3.5" floppy disc?  Good for a laugh anyhow. 
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mlpankey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlpankey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Mar 2013 at 7:57pm
Well we know your not smart enough to.fipd the origin of the video. Its.my video taken today.
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