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Block heater woes -301

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SteveM C/IL View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Shelbyville IL
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    Posted: 20 hours 27 minutes ago at 9:26pm
Have a 78 545B loader with 301 engine. I've put 2 new 1500wt block heaters in it. First one 10? yrs ago which worked once or twice before burning plug end up.Post melted. Put last one in Dec 24. It set alot because of tranny issues. Fixed trans over summer and put about 75 hrs on since. Have been pluggin in for cold starts and everthing was good,until today. NOT WORKING! Stone cold. Have used heater maybe 10 times. It had a non working unit in it when I bought it. It is mounted in a thick plate (1" thd) bolted to the front of block on rt side below and toward rt of water pump. (engine in backward) There is a narrow water passage running length of block where it is. The element is about 5in long and does not touch block but is very close fit. Is it too confined and cooks itself? last was zerostart brand. The 190 and 7020 tractors have a diamond shaped plate at rr end of block (according to parts book) that uses a hooked heater with plate.  That port has a water manifold bolted there which goes around block and feeds engine and trans coolers on other side. There is a diamond plate on front left side of head. Would that tractor heater fit in the head and work? I'll have to get the plate off to see how much room is inside there. Inet shows a 400wt little short version element that would fit in my current location but is 400wt enough to warm it in a couple hours? I'd like to stay with the 1500wt heater but can't get them to live. Any help appreciated.
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DiyDave View Drop Down
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Gambrills, MD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 hours 10 minutes ago at 4:43am
IIRR, don't the plug type have to be clocked to a certain position? loop up?  Should be in the directions of the heater kit.  You might also try a coffee pot type, but those have to be mounted upright(vertical), and you have to mount using bypass hoses...
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calico190xt68 View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Jan 2017
Location: Frankton, IN
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote calico190xt68 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7 hours 29 minutes ago at 10:24am
I have installed a zerostart freeze plug block heater on my 67 190xt and recently my 68 190xt because neither had the special port.  I also installed a zerostart in my 7010, which has the special port and the plate install.  My 67 190XT was done 6 years ago and no problems of a meltdown.  My 7010 was replaced by me I think 2 years ago.  None of them have burnt up or stopped working so I think that is quite odd.  I have used them quite a bit.  

I don't think you will want to put in a 400 Watt version.  It will not get hot enough in a few hours.  After installing a 600 Watt in my 68 190xt, it struggles to get the block warm when the temp goes below 20 degrees.  I measured the temp on the heater side and it was 45 degrees, but on the opposite side, it was like 30 degrees.  The outside air was 10 degrees.  

Here's a couple of ideas to consider:

1) Measure the output of the voltage of the receptacle you are using?  Is it 120+ volts?
2) Are you using the same receptacle every time or do you use different ones?
3) Could you be using an inferior extension cord?  I use a heavy duty 12 awg cord on mine.  Does the short pigtail cord have damage to it causing overheating?
4) Orientation is important but most of them will only orient one way.  190xt has the element going to 3PM position for freeze plug but you are using the port.  You can only put it in one way from what I remember on my 7010.
5) When I did a search on the Allis part number, I got the 1000 watt block heater come up and not a 1500 watt version.  Could you be buying the wrong part number and that element is touching the metal?  I think 1500 watt will have more element extending into the block.  Zerostart model that is compatible with 7010 engine is 350-0014 and is 1000 watt.
6) The other possibility is that your coolant is low and not completely covering the element.  This will cook them quickly.
7) I didn't know this but the AI bot said if you leave them plugged in 24/7 it can also cause them to fail.  I have left mine plugged in all night because I wanted to use it the next morning.  It suggested no more than 3 hours at a time.

Electrical things can be quite elusive so good luck.  I really like using the block heaters but at about $130 a pop, that sucks to see them stop after short term use.
80 7010, 80 7020, 68 190XTD, 67 190XTD, 500 Loader, AC 2000 Plow, Member Indiana A-C Partners, Member TAC
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Ed (Ont) View Drop Down
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Joined: 08 Nov 2009
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ed (Ont) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 7 hours 22 minutes ago at 10:31am
Leaving it on for extended period should not hurt. I used to leave block heater on all weekend on N14 cummins in gravel hauler. Was still working at a million km. I did replace the cord a couple times over the years. Cord was available separately right from the dealer at that time! You do have to have a heavy extension cord to run it. 

Edited by Ed (Ont) - 7 hours 20 minutes ago at 10:33am
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SteveM C/IL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveM C/IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 4 hours 46 minutes ago at 1:07pm
Kats list a 1500wt for my 8070 but it is in the back of the oil cooler sticking into block with plenty of water around it. I have been using only a 14ga cord. Have a 12 but didn't grab it.I don't think the heater cord is 12ga. Mine is not a case of low water level.
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orangereborn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote orangereborn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 3 hours 31 minutes ago at 2:22pm
I put 400W heater on the winter 180 loader tractor.   took the diamond plate off, cut the old thread hole out and welded in a pipe fitting to position the element. bolted the plate back on.  Heater about $15. Not fast but just leave it plugged into an off-peak circuit when using it  regularly...Well in excess of 5 years and still working...Dale

Edited by orangereborn - 3 hours 25 minutes ago at 2:28pm
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Michael V (NM) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Michael V (NM) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2 hours 45 minutes ago at 3:08pm
one thing I been told to do,, is unplug the block heater and let set a few minutes before starting the engine. I believe this is so a rush of cold coolant doesn't hit a hot element, but that's jus WAG 

I ordered one from agco for my 8010, it goes in a port just above the starter,. I don't know how the engine is configured in the payloader, the starter may be on the opposite side??? 
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SteveM C/IL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveM C/IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2 hours 8 minutes ago at 3:45pm
Starter is on side of inj pump the port above it is manfolded around back of head to 2 oil coolers. No plugs in manifold to stick a heater in.
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calico190xt68 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote calico190xt68 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 32 minutes ago at 5:21pm
I didn't fully understand your original post, I think.  Sounds like you don't have the normal port for a block heater.  You have a 1 inch threaded plug opening which means you can use an immersion heater.  I looked at Zerostart and they have a 1 inch 1000 watt immersion heater plug (8600090 model) that is 3/4 inch shorter than the 1 inch by 5 inch long, 1500 watt model, assuming you are using that model.  Wonder if that is worth trying?  Seems to me that touching the metal may be the most likely culprit since everything else you mention seems to not be the problem.  You could stick something in the hole and determine how much clearance you have.

I always unplug my heater before starting but haven't waited very long.  Good luck.  It is cold and snowy here in Indiana this week. I am guessing you could use it to move some snow around.


80 7010, 80 7020, 68 190XTD, 67 190XTD, 500 Loader, AC 2000 Plow, Member Indiana A-C Partners, Member TAC
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