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AC WD I think |
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SteveM C/IL ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 8619 |
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Soak,soak,soak,Rock,rock rock.Hand clutch must be pulled back(enguaged)and trans in 4th for best results.You'll be ahead to pull each piston out and clean all the crap off/out of the rings ,pistons and cyl walls. If there's a lot of ridge at the top you could have trouble getting rings up past it with out cutting it out with a ridge cutter.Some careful work with a die grinder can get the job done instead of ridge cutter.Just need to "break" the corner of the ridge and do a lot of wiggling without too much force to get the rings past ridge.Rod caps have shims for setting clearance(unless someone has replaced with precision ground ones) so pay attention to what's where and keep everything seperate and matched.Also keep them in order(1,2,3,4) and scratch a mark on top pointing forward.They are usually marked in some way but just to be sure.The rods are not centered in the pistons so they need to go back in the hole they came out of.If rings are still stuck soak in a can/bucket till free if wanting to keep/re-use 'cause they break easily when prying/digging around. There will be plenty who say "new parts" but if you clean everything up well and put it back to gether,it will be as good as it was before it got stuck. Squirt some oil on the valve stems and tap with a hammer to make sure they are all free.
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Orange Blood ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 29 Nov 2010 Location: ColoradoSprings Points: 4053 |
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Steve you are right on. I almost always profess take the cylinders out, and clean the rings. I don't know that I would be as daring as you to use a die grinder, but if you are more skilled than I, go for it. As for new versus used, in these old, mostly show girls, used is fine. The older stuff was way over engineered, and since it didn't run as fast, will virtually never wear out, like the newer engines, where tolerances are far more important.
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Still in use:
HD7 WC C CA WD 2-WD45 WD45LP WD45D D14 3-D17 D17LP 2-D19D D19LP 190XTD 190XTLP 720 D21 220 7020 7030 7040 7045 3-7060 Projects: 3-U UC 2-G 2-B 2-C CA 7-WC RC WDLP WF D14 D21 210 7045 N7 |
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stu(ON) ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 377 |
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Nautyboss, it sounds like you have both rear wheels jacked up. If so, even with both clutches engaged, rear wheels will turn in opposite directions due to the nature of the differential.
Make sure that one rear wheel is grounded and then jack and rock the other with the transmission in third or fourth gear.
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Nautyboss ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 30 Dec 2011 Location: Arkansas Points: 27 |
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Thanks stu(ON), I was wondering what the deal was. It seems I'm having a problem with the gear shifter. I pulled it out and the middle fork slides back and forth (with some effort) but the left and right one doesn't. Any suggestions?
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stu(ON) ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 377 |
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Since you drove the tractor to its current location, it is unlikely that the tranny locked up or jumped into two gears just sitting there. If you get the tractor running, you may find that you don't have a tranny problem, other than the heavy oil has probably turned to mud from decades of neglect.
First off, push the hand clutch forward and try to spin the one jacked up wheel. If it does turn, then you know that the tranny is not locked in two gears or frozen up. If that works, then pull the hand clutch back and see if the wheel still turns. If it does, the tranny is in neutral. If not, then you are in whatever gear you last drove the tractor in and can still use it to try to break the engine free. Third or fourth gears are better because it gives you more leverage in torquing the engine; the exact opposite of driving in first or second on a tough haul.
If things still aren't making sense, post back here. Meanwhile you might send your e-mail address to me in a personal message and I can send some info to you that will help you figure the hand clutch and tranny our better.
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Nautyboss ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 30 Dec 2011 Location: Arkansas Points: 27 |
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Thanks stu(ON), I have the gear shift lever out at the moment. As I said it other post the forks are not sliding except for the middle one, and it is hard to slide. I have set one rear wheel on the ground and turned the other and the gears do turn, so I think were ok in the trans. Shouldn't all three forks slide on the shifting lever?
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stu(ON) ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 377 |
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If you PM me for more info you will see that there are interlocks on the forks so that you can't get into two gears very easily. However, after 60+ years, the shifter tip wears out and other things wear down or gum up. I have a '51 WD and have spent too many hours with my face over the tranny & wet clutch and under the PTO drive, but even I could straighten the problems out eventually.
If you are able to look down into the shifter tower with a light and see that all the notches line up crossways, you should be able to reinsert the shifter and "throw" it left up & down and right back (for reverse). You need leverage to drive those two outside rods, interlocks and cluster gears. WD has square cut gears in clusters riding on cage bearings and solid shafts. Primitive but very durable. The oil was 80W90 when new, and now is likely mud. The shifter rods only get lubricated by splash from below, and they haven't had a splash in a long while.
If you want to take on a lot of things at once, you can pull the shifter tower without much trouble and also the battery box and cover to the wet clutch. But, then you will have to put it all back together and there is no current evidence that you have any problems in these areas. If you try the things that I mentioned in my last post, you will quickly find out if the tranny is free and if you are in a gear, or can get into a gear. That would be my first concern in order to break the engine free. The clutch & gearshift & tranny may only need a little running and some fresh oil, although I suspect that you have leaky seals in several spots as it is one big reservoir.
Do you know how to check the oil level in the PTO/wet clutch/tranny/diff compartments? If not, PM me.
Good luck,
stu
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TREVMAN ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 04 Jan 2010 Location: Regina,Sask,Can Points: 1635 |
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I put my tractor on a hill to rock it, I think that helped a lot, just a thought, Trev.
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DaveKamp ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Location: LeClaire, Ia Points: 6067 |
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Since there's been lots of good suggestions, I figured I'd post my method of breaking free the worst patients I've ever dealt with.
1) remove the head, vacuum out any loose crud. I get a nylon brush impregnated with light abrasive, and use it to scrub the worst of the crud from the upper bore, then vacuum it out some more. I clean the valves and lap 'em so that I know I'll get a good seal. I clean the head gasket surfaces, grease and install, but leave the valves closed (on a flathead, it means removing the tappets or pushrods). 2) Remove and smash the spark-plugs... discard all but the thread-in portion. I weld a piece of 1/4" steel pipe to each one, then thread 'em into the cylinder. 3) Mix up a 3-way of diesel fuel, hydraulic fluid, and acetone, and fill every cylinder to the pipe. 4) Make a splitter-hose (manifold), connecting all cylinders to a regulator valve, connect to an air-compressor. Set the regulator to about 30psi, and walk away for a day or so. 5) Disconnect hoses, pull dipstick, and sniff it... smell acetone? It's workin' through. None? Refill cylinders (keep notes on which ones need more), rock the crankshaft a little (don't force it, just give it a little try) repeat 4 & 5. Eventually, you'll start smelling acetone, which means it's working through from the combustion chambers to the sump. The cylinders that pass first will USUALLY break free first, so when I have one flowing good, I'll disconnect that air hose, and concentrate on the rest. Once they're all flowing, I'll hook 'em back up and dial pressure down to 10psi or so. I won't say I've never had an engine stuck so bad that this wouldn't break it loose, but it's been the most successful method I've used. It isn't a quick job, and when you're working on an engine like an Allis W-series, it's faster to pop the head and pan, loosen the rods, and push the rod/piston/sleeve out as a unit, and find replacements... but if it's a cast-en-bloc linerless engine, particularly a V-type where rods won't clear the crank without turning, it's the only answer short of drilling and smashing the pistons to pieces. |
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DaveKamp ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Location: LeClaire, Ia Points: 6067 |
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Another seasonal note:
If you have an engine that was recently free, but is now stuck, and the ambient temp outside is below freezing... STOP! It's not unusual to have enough moisture between a piston and cylinder wall to cause the rings to become frosted to the cylinder wall. Rather than risking damage, tow the tractor into a heated garage, and get it up to room temperature before trying to lever it free. And if you're storing it for a long time, it's not a bad idea to fill the cylinders to the top with motor oil, so that there's a lesser chance of condensation from accumulating in the cylinders. Just don't thread the spark plugs in tight, and remember to back 'em out when you crank it over (it's gonna belch oil). You may hear suggestion of filling the cylinders with anti-freeze... clever, but bad idea, because anti-freeze WILL freeze... especially if it's full strength (many will actually freeze sooner at full-strength, than mixed 50/50). Fill the block with 50/50, but fill the cylinders with oil. I've had people suggest shooting some oil into the cylinders to prevent moisture from getting around the rings. Many of these are dished-piston designs, so it's gonna take a fair amount of oil to fill the dish... but keep in mind that oil is lighter than water, so it won't keep water from condensing on the walls above, and falling down there and settling in. |
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