AC WD I think
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=42996
Printed Date: 03 Sep 2025 at 4:46am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: AC WD I think
Posted By: Nautyboss
Subject: AC WD I think
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 7:12pm
  I know this is not a new subject but here goes.... Obviously I'm new here. I have what I believe to be a WD. I have the engine S/N WD332600PA. I have searched the real axle and have found nothing but casting marks. It does have the straight shifter and the number in front of it is 200931. The number is cast into it though and not stamped; however there is a plate above the number that appears to read R-K-KL (it could be an A at the beginning), and there appears to be a 6 stamped in below the cast number. Can anyone help?
|
Replies:
Posted By: NDBirdman
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 7:19pm
|
Looks like a WD to me, the serial number is stamped on the real axle housing below the left brake access cover. ------------- 1955 WD45 S#205467, 190XT #6652 DXT |
Posted By: Eldon (WA)
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 7:20pm
|
Number should be stamped in the vertical surface right above your screwdriver handle. ------------- ALLIS EXPRESS! This year: |
Posted By: Farrell(Utah)
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 7:22pm
|
Welcome to the Allis group. You have a WD. The serial number is on the flat area above the adjusting screw for the left brake. The screw is about three inches below the brake cover. It will start with WD______. ------------- A(1937), 2 G, 2 WD45 diesels, 6 WD45 gas, UC, 2 WD, D17 gas, WF, Farmall 400, D12, Kubota B3030 |
Posted By: Nautyboss
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 7:28pm
| I have searched that area and see no numbers |
Posted By: Farrell(Utah)
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 7:30pm
|
Geez, I am slow on the draw. Your posts hit while I was thinking. ------------- A(1937), 2 G, 2 WD45 diesels, 6 WD45 gas, UC, 2 WD, D17 gas, WF, Farmall 400, D12, Kubota B3030 |
Posted By: Nautyboss
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 7:30pm
| Can anyone tell me what displacement the engine is? |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 7:36pm
|
Early WD's had the serial number stamped in the top surface of the differential housing on the right side of the left brake cover. You may want to look there if there is no number stamped on the aforementioned place. Follow the link to see exactly where the serial number is stamped. http://people.clemson.edu/%7Ewsmth/SNLocat/ACSN4.htm - http://people.clemson.edu/~wsmth/SNLocat/ACSN4.htm 332600 is a 1952 engine block but that doesn't necessarily mean the tractor is from that year. A lot of these old things have had transplants. Another possibility is something happened to the rear end and a new housing was used to correct the problem. Replacement housings would not have had a number stamped in at the factory. So if there isn't a number where the pictures show after scraping off old paint, you may have a 1952 with a replacement diff housing.
------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: Thad in AR.
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 7:45pm
| I had to use a wire brush on a grinder to find the numbers on my wd45. They aren't stamped very deep on mine. By the way welcome to the forum. You'll fine any info you need right here. |
Posted By: Bolivar Boy
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 8:14pm
| your wd should have a 202 cu in engine, same as the wc but with the added benefit of a hydraulic over ride clutch. tell me, where did that lil allis come from.......... |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 8:19pm
WC and WD are 201.0624 cubic inches. Not to be picky but always know as a 201. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Bolivar Boy wrote:Posted By: Bolivar Boy
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 8:35pm
| i stand corrected tucker. will put my slide rule away. |
Posted By: Nautyboss
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 10:56pm
| My Dad did some car dealing about six yrs ago back in missouri and in the deal he got this tractor. I had it running when I moved them down here a little over 5 yrs ago, but it has been out in the weather and gotten some water down in the cylinders. I'm attempting to get it broke loose. |
Posted By: Nautyboss
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 11:00pm
| Thank you everyone for your help on this. After some wire brushing I did find the S/N WD122436, so I guess it is a 1952. |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 30 Dec 2011 at 11:18pm
|
I'm pretty sure MY WD's displacement has worn to 201.1731 cubic inches. Unfortunately, the bores are out-of-round, so they're not 'cubic' inches... they're measured in 'Rhombic Inches'... but for best accuracy, I verify them in CHAINS, and check the rod-length in RODS. The deck height must be measured in KiloAngstroms, and the stroke in MilliCubits. Hand me that micrometer and a piece of chalk- gotta make this a very precise cut with the torch!!! ;-} |
Posted By: B26240
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2011 at 7:40am
| That's good Dave!! and yes welcolm to the forum! a WD is still a very usefull tractor, please don't give up on her! |
Posted By: Ted J
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2011 at 8:13am
|
Welcome and get her fixed! They are wonderful playthings/workers. Good luck! That's good Dave, I like it! I think my 45 is the same way. ------------- "Allis-Express" 19?? WC / 1941 C / 1952 CA / 1956 WD45 / 1957 WD45 / 1958 D-17 |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2011 at 8:47pm
and here I kinda thought you had fat fingers and hit the wrong key. I used to be able to use a slide rule and still have one or 2 around but probably couldn't get as close as you did if I tried now. Dave, that went WAY over my head!! LOL ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: allischalmerguy
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2011 at 9:02pm
|
Nautyboss,
What are you using to break the pistons free? Acetone with autotransmission fluid works good I am told. Your WD has the brackets on front for a 2 row cultivator and it looks like it still has the radiator shutters? Welcome to the group. There are lots of neat people on here and you will find lots of good advice. Don't be afraid to ask questions! Pastor Mike ------------- It is great being a disciple of Jesus! 1950 WD, 1957 D17...retired in Iowa, |
Posted By: Nautyboss
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2011 at 9:48pm
|
I was wondering what the brackets were for, and yes it does still have the shudders. As far as getting it unlocked, I let it set the first night with all the cylinders full of oil, since I have just been keeping in soaked with a rust inhibitor. Also, if I jacked up the back wheels and put it in gear, shouldn't it engage the engine? Can anyone tell me the proper way to get the starter off this thing? |
Posted By: Alberta Phil
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2011 at 10:28pm
|
First disconnect the starter cable and starter rod. There is a large set screw with a lock nut on the left side in the bellhousing just ahead of the starter. It may be a hex head or a slot. Loosen the locknut, and remove the set screw. It has a taper on the inner end that engages a tapered hole in the nose of the starter. Once this is out, a large screwdriver or prybar can be used to start it loose, then pull it back out of the bellhousing. |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 11:09am
|
Once you get the starter out, try and turn it again... it might just be a jammed starter gear... happens sometimes. Speaking of which... I got a WD sitting in the driveway that I need to move in and unstick... it was free about 5 months ago... hope it's not bad... Fix that WD up- they're sweet! |
Posted By: TedBuiskerN.IL.
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 11:26am
|
It looks to me like someone welded the lift arm shaft to the right side support. Am I seeing that right? ------------- Most problems can be solved with the proper application of high explosives. |
Posted By: TREVMAN
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 12:30pm
| Fill the cylinders with acetone, auto trans fluid. Put the tractor in high gear and rock it. I recently freed my WD doing the above. It took a couple weeks of sit, rock, sit rock, but it freed up and it was pretty gross inside. You are gonna want to take the advice I took from more knowledgeable men on the site here and pull the head. Clean the cyls up using the atf/acetone mix with some fine grit wet/dry paper, and the clean, clean, clean until you get sick of it, and do some more cleaning in the cyls with light oil and clean clothes. Drop the pan, clean, clean, clean. Squirt oil on all the bearings. Put it back together with a new head gasket and get it going, good luck, Trev. |
Posted By: Dave (Mid-MI)
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 12:37pm
| The cultivator mounting brackets look like they have been modified. Do you have a drawbar for the tractor? Looks like it has a mounting bracket for a John Deere #5 sickle bar mower. |
Posted By: Nautyboss
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 12:45pm
|
I have the head off and have cleaned the cylinders using a wire wheel brush and 400 wet/dry paper. I have pulled the pan and lubed everything. I have soaked the cylinders in oil, rust inhibitor, diesel, and am ready to try anything (just about). What kind of ration do you use with atf/acetone? I have tried turning it over with the starter (which I have since taken out). I tried turning it from the crank shaft, and I have tried putting it in gear and rocking the tires. When I do that, the tires turn but the engine doesn't. I have visually inspected the clutch and all seems ok there. A while back we had tried to push start it and it would roll, but when you let out the clutch the wheels locked and motor not turn. Any ideas?
|
Posted By: Thad in AR.
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 5:46pm
| Did you make sure the hand clutch was locked in when you rocked the wheels? |
Posted By: TREVMAN
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 6:48pm
| Keep it soaking in 50/50 atf/acetone, and keep rocking everyday...Trev. |
Posted By: ChuckLuedtkeSEWI
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 7:25pm
|
I use ATF/acetone 50/50 and fill up each cylinder all the way to the top. The last one I freed up I let the mixture sit in each cylinder and after about a week, the level started to drop. I refilled to the top and let it drain down, and repeated for another week. Then I started rocking the wheel and she popped free and was good to go. I did like you did and took the head off so I could see what was going on and how bad it was. After it was free, I put the head back on and got it running. Good luck and if you got any questions, ask on here and there are plenty of knowledgable people that will be more then happy to help you out. ------------- 1955 WD45 diesel 203322 was my dad's tractor, 1966 D15 23530, 1961 HD3 Crawler 1918, 1966 D17 IV 83495, 1937 WC 41255, 1962 D19 6221 |
Posted By: Ted J
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 7:21am
|
I've seen talk on the forum here where the transmission is locked into 2 gears and thus it won't move? Would that affect the starting/turning over of the engine? Just a thought. There are a lot of smarter guys that can help with this idea.
------------- "Allis-Express" 19?? WC / 1941 C / 1952 CA / 1956 WD45 / 1957 WD45 / 1958 D-17 |
Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 8:59am
| Soak,soak,soak,Rock,rock rock.Hand clutch must be pulled back(enguaged)and trans in 4th for best results.You'll be ahead to pull each piston out and clean all the crap off/out of the rings ,pistons and cyl walls. If there's a lot of ridge at the top you could have trouble getting rings up past it with out cutting it out with a ridge cutter.Some careful work with a die grinder can get the job done instead of ridge cutter.Just need to "break" the corner of the ridge and do a lot of wiggling without too much force to get the rings past ridge.Rod caps have shims for setting clearance(unless someone has replaced with precision ground ones) so pay attention to what's where and keep everything seperate and matched.Also keep them in order(1,2,3,4) and scratch a mark on top pointing forward.They are usually marked in some way but just to be sure.The rods are not centered in the pistons so they need to go back in the hole they came out of.If rings are still stuck soak in a can/bucket till free if wanting to keep/re-use 'cause they break easily when prying/digging around. There will be plenty who say "new parts" but if you clean everything up well and put it back to gether,it will be as good as it was before it got stuck. Squirt some oil on the valve stems and tap with a hammer to make sure they are all free. |
Posted By: Orange Blood
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 9:31am
|
Steve you are right on. I almost always profess take the cylinders out, and clean the rings. I don't know that I would be as daring as you to use a die grinder, but if you are more skilled than I, go for it. As for new versus used, in these old, mostly show girls, used is fine. The older stuff was way over engineered, and since it didn't run as fast, will virtually never wear out, like the newer engines, where tolerances are far more important. ------------- Still in use: HD7 WC C CA WD 2-WD45 WD45LP WD45D D14 3-D17 D17LP 2-D19D D19LP 190XTD 190XTLP 720 D21 220 7020 7030 7040 7045 3-7060 Projects: 3-U UC 2-G 2-B 2-C CA 7-WC RC WDLP WF D14 D21 210 7045 N7 |
Posted By: stu(ON)
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 1:31pm
|
Nautyboss, it sounds like you have both rear wheels jacked up. If so, even with both clutches engaged, rear wheels will turn in opposite directions due to the nature of the differential.
Make sure that one rear wheel is grounded and then jack and rock the other with the transmission in third or fourth gear.
|
Posted By: Nautyboss
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 2:58pm
| Thanks stu(ON), I was wondering what the deal was. It seems I'm having a problem with the gear shifter. I pulled it out and the middle fork slides back and forth (with some effort) but the left and right one doesn't. Any suggestions? |
Posted By: stu(ON)
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 3:31pm
|
Since you drove the tractor to its current location, it is unlikely that the tranny locked up or jumped into two gears just sitting there. If you get the tractor running, you may find that you don't have a tranny problem, other than the heavy oil has probably turned to mud from decades of neglect.
First off, push the hand clutch forward and try to spin the one jacked up wheel. If it does turn, then you know that the tranny is not locked in two gears or frozen up. If that works, then pull the hand clutch back and see if the wheel still turns. If it does, the tranny is in neutral. If not, then you are in whatever gear you last drove the tractor in and can still use it to try to break the engine free. Third or fourth gears are better because it gives you more leverage in torquing the engine; the exact opposite of driving in first or second on a tough haul.
If things still aren't making sense, post back here. Meanwhile you might send your e-mail address to me in a personal message and I can send some info to you that will help you figure the hand clutch and tranny our better.
|
Posted By: Nautyboss
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 6:21pm
| Thanks stu(ON), I have the gear shift lever out at the moment. As I said it other post the forks are not sliding except for the middle one, and it is hard to slide. I have set one rear wheel on the ground and turned the other and the gears do turn, so I think were ok in the trans. Shouldn't all three forks slide on the shifting lever? |
Posted By: stu(ON)
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 6:44pm
|
If you PM me for more info you will see that there are interlocks on the forks so that you can't get into two gears very easily. However, after 60+ years, the shifter tip wears out and other things wear down or gum up. I have a '51 WD and have spent too many hours with my face over the tranny & wet clutch and under the PTO drive, but even I could straighten the problems out eventually.
If you are able to look down into the shifter tower with a light and see that all the notches line up crossways, you should be able to reinsert the shifter and "throw" it left up & down and right back (for reverse). You need leverage to drive those two outside rods, interlocks and cluster gears. WD has square cut gears in clusters riding on cage bearings and solid shafts. Primitive but very durable. The oil was 80W90 when new, and now is likely mud. The shifter rods only get lubricated by splash from below, and they haven't had a splash in a long while.
If you want to take on a lot of things at once, you can pull the shifter tower without much trouble and also the battery box and cover to the wet clutch. But, then you will have to put it all back together and there is no current evidence that you have any problems in these areas. If you try the things that I mentioned in my last post, you will quickly find out if the tranny is free and if you are in a gear, or can get into a gear. That would be my first concern in order to break the engine free. The clutch & gearshift & tranny may only need a little running and some fresh oil, although I suspect that you have leaky seals in several spots as it is one big reservoir.
Do you know how to check the oil level in the PTO/wet clutch/tranny/diff compartments? If not, PM me.
Good luck,
stu
|
Posted By: TREVMAN
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 10:05am
| I put my tractor on a hill to rock it, I think that helped a lot, just a thought, Trev. |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 10:52am
|
Since there's been lots of good suggestions, I figured I'd post my method of breaking free the worst patients I've ever dealt with. 1) remove the head, vacuum out any loose crud. I get a nylon brush impregnated with light abrasive, and use it to scrub the worst of the crud from the upper bore, then vacuum it out some more. I clean the valves and lap 'em so that I know I'll get a good seal. I clean the head gasket surfaces, grease and install, but leave the valves closed (on a flathead, it means removing the tappets or pushrods). 2) Remove and smash the spark-plugs... discard all but the thread-in portion. I weld a piece of 1/4" steel pipe to each one, then thread 'em into the cylinder. 3) Mix up a 3-way of diesel fuel, hydraulic fluid, and acetone, and fill every cylinder to the pipe. 4) Make a splitter-hose (manifold), connecting all cylinders to a regulator valve, connect to an air-compressor. Set the regulator to about 30psi, and walk away for a day or so. 5) Disconnect hoses, pull dipstick, and sniff it... smell acetone? It's workin' through. None? Refill cylinders (keep notes on which ones need more), rock the crankshaft a little (don't force it, just give it a little try) repeat 4 & 5. Eventually, you'll start smelling acetone, which means it's working through from the combustion chambers to the sump. The cylinders that pass first will USUALLY break free first, so when I have one flowing good, I'll disconnect that air hose, and concentrate on the rest. Once they're all flowing, I'll hook 'em back up and dial pressure down to 10psi or so. I won't say I've never had an engine stuck so bad that this wouldn't break it loose, but it's been the most successful method I've used. It isn't a quick job, and when you're working on an engine like an Allis W-series, it's faster to pop the head and pan, loosen the rods, and push the rod/piston/sleeve out as a unit, and find replacements... but if it's a cast-en-bloc linerless engine, particularly a V-type where rods won't clear the crank without turning, it's the only answer short of drilling and smashing the pistons to pieces. |
Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 11:31am
|
Another seasonal note: If you have an engine that was recently free, but is now stuck, and the ambient temp outside is below freezing... STOP! It's not unusual to have enough moisture between a piston and cylinder wall to cause the rings to become frosted to the cylinder wall. Rather than risking damage, tow the tractor into a heated garage, and get it up to room temperature before trying to lever it free. And if you're storing it for a long time, it's not a bad idea to fill the cylinders to the top with motor oil, so that there's a lesser chance of condensation from accumulating in the cylinders. Just don't thread the spark plugs in tight, and remember to back 'em out when you crank it over (it's gonna belch oil). You may hear suggestion of filling the cylinders with anti-freeze... clever, but bad idea, because anti-freeze WILL freeze... especially if it's full strength (many will actually freeze sooner at full-strength, than mixed 50/50). Fill the block with 50/50, but fill the cylinders with oil. I've had people suggest shooting some oil into the cylinders to prevent moisture from getting around the rings. Many of these are dished-piston designs, so it's gonna take a fair amount of oil to fill the dish... but keep in mind that oil is lighter than water, so it won't keep water from condensing on the walls above, and falling down there and settling in. |