I've been talking with Nelson Muffler Co....

I have been talking with the Nelson Muffler Co. (Nelson Global Products) for the past couple weeks about producing a run of obsolete mufflers. I chose the oval muffler for a 170 Gas tractor to try to get produced. The reason I chose the 170 gas muffler (A-C #249324) is because it is extremely close, in dimensions, to the late D17 oval muffler (246129), the 170/175 diesel muffler (250049), D19 gas muffler (246130), and 180/185 muffler (248883). And therefore would require very little modification to fit one of the above tractors. Granted, i'm sure the differences are supported by reason, but this solution is a compromise because ordering a production run for each of the 5 different mufflers wouldn't be feasible. I have drawn schematics for the mufflers so you can see how close they are. I will be working with a local shop to get the mufflers modified with a different input pipe diameter and output pipe diameter if necessary for the different applications.

Nelson ultimately said they would be willing to make a production run of 100 mufflers of the A-C #249324. I spoke to them this morning and they are going to get back to me with a cost per muffler and a confirmation that they still have the tooling to make them.

The Nelson for WD45/D17 I can get for $125, so I estimate the cost for this newer oval one at around $200 per muffler. A run of 100 mufflers at $200 per muffler is more than most can afford, so it boils down to this: I need to get orders for 70-75 mufflers to go through with this order.

This post is just to get the word out that there might be light at the end of the tunnel for these mufflers. Do you think that I can get the 70-75 orders necessary? Would you be okay with putting this muffler on a D19 or 175 diesel if it was modified to have the proper inlet and outlet pipes? Keep in mind the oval body size and baffles will be of the specs of the muffler that I will have produced. Any comments, suggestions, ideas, etc.  are valued from members with more experience and wisdom than me

Just had a customer ask if there were any available the other day.

 

Jim

 

Alex, my suggestion is make all the bases 2 3/8" and then supply a bushing to slip over the pipe on the manifold. 

  I bought a cheap stanely muffler off Ebay one time and it was for a 170/175 diesel muff...  I made a bushing for it and slipped over manifold pipe and then slipped the muffler over that and been on for many years... and the 2.25 od top side didn't really change the sound that much...Figured the engine breathed easier.   Suppose Nelson would make them out of Stainless steel? might sound tinnier and turn blue but... might not rust out ever again.

 Tracey, some were... some were put on to the front and some were put on towards the back and then they had the center ones too...  Our 170 was to the back... my uncles was to the front... and the neighbors IV was to the front...

And the series IV...

Alex, "I am NOT 100% sure that any of the oval mufflers originally had centered outlet"

 From looking at pictures in old allis lit.,  they had outlets in the center too for many of the tractors... Have a few pics with the outlet almost on the edge and ran across one picture where the outlet is just a bit offset just enough to miss the center pipe. Almost like some of these muffs were in the experimental stages.

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Thanks Tracy- So you are saying I should consider getting a run of 100 mufflers for every different application? like 100 of late D17/170/175 gas, 100 of D15 series II gas, 100 of D15/D17 Diesel, 100 of 180/185, 100 of D19, and 100 of 170/175 diesel.

In a perfect world that would work. Of course the Nelson Muffler Co. would have to have the tooling/dies for these also. But if they did have the tooling, I can see this happening one of 3 ways:

a)   I get enough preorders, like 70-75 of each style muffler, and then have Nelson make a run of 100 in each design. And if I can't get the 70-75 orders, then contact some parts suppliers if they would buy some?

b)   I take each style muffler one at a time. First do the late D17/170/175 gas style (seems to be the most popular), get the orders, pay for the 100 mufflers, and deliver the orders. Then do the next style D15/D17 diesel for example. And don't do my current "modify the inlet/outlet to application" style of current thinking

But to think I can sell 70-75 of each style muffler might be pushing it. That would be 600 mufflers at once, unless I did one style at a time. And even then, the odd ones like D15 series 2 gas, and D19- My personal opinion is I don't think I could get 75 orders for those specific mufflers, which means only the more popular mufflers would go through I would kind of like to give choice "b" a try though. That would save the extra dicking around cost of modifing the inlet/outlet pipes.

So to summarize what I have observed as the consensus here:

1)  If the original muffler had an offset, only new mufflers with the offset would be worth getting made.

2)  If the original muffler did not have an offset, it would still be worth getting made because it outlasts the Stanley and has the "Nelson- Music to the ear" sound

 example: Nobody would buy a new Nelson for there D17 series IV gas if it has a centered exhaust outlet, even if it sounded like a Nelson

Alex, From various pieces of literature, I see BOTH the offset and center mufflers used on the D17 IV, 170 and the 175, both gas and diesel... and most of them had center pipes in the pics...

 So... center pipes would be just as correct as the offset pipes... just the fact I know our 170 gas came with offset to the rear

  Guess I would find out what dies/tooling Nelson has left and figure it from there.