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Dr. Allis D17 XT Plowing |
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FREEDGUY
Orange Level Access Joined: 15 Apr 2017 Location: South West Mich Points: 5391 |
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Posted: 04 Dec 2020 at 5:35pm |
Thank you very much for that info, I thought maybe the intake/exhaust would have given trouble . Well, who ever owns it next "probably" won't be going to the dealer for '17 diesel parts from the bell house forward !!
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19547 |
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The throttle was one of the easier things I did. Still used the original throttle linkage from the steering wheel to under the fuel tank, but replaced the link rod that went from there to the gas engine with a new 1/4" rod about 4 ft long and made several kinks and bends and one guide bracket close to the injection pump. All things considered, it was easy and turned out well, as the stroke of the hand lever is 100% the same as the gas engine was. The foot clutch area seemed to take the most time and then the steering. I had the engine in and out a dozen times before I was happy with the clutch. The gas chassis clutch shaft is too long for the diesel engine, so I figured out a way around that problem. I cut off the clutch shaft nose (for the pilot bearing) and found a new pilot bearing that would slide on the new larger clutch shaft diameter and then machined the flywheel hole deeper and larger diameter to accept the new pilot brg. Then, the clutch disc had to come from a maroon model 7000, as it has an offset clutch hub in it, offset towards the engine, which I needed. The rest of the time was spent machining the flywheel to fit .100" farther forward on the crankshaft, moving the starter ring gear .100" back on the flywheel to locate it correctly, and machine the flywheel wear surface .100" to get the clutch disc to fit on the clutch shaft splines and not bind. The shorter throwout bearing sleeve had to come from a D-17 diesel to get it to locate properly to the 180/190 pressure plate. Some grinding had to be done to the inside of the bell housing to get it all in there, but after you grind enough away in the right spots, it fits. I am fortunate to have a lathe at work to be able to do many of these things, instead of hiring it done. It was important for me to get the engine to sit as far rearward as possible, because I had to design a way to be able to steer the tractor with a narrow front end and needed the engine to be as far out of the way as possible. As it turned out, the steering turned out just fine and it had its engineering problems too, but all worked out. Hydrostatic power steering that didn't change the looks or length of the tractor was the goal and I was lucky it came true after lots of thinking. I always felt if the narrow front didn't work, I'd just switch to a wide front and mount a steer cylinder crossways on it. Didn't need to and as it is now, it could be switched to a wide front with an OEM steering arm. One can always have a "plan" before he starts a project like this. Funny how the "plan" has to be changed up a bit as you go along !!
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FREEDGUY
Orange Level Access Joined: 15 Apr 2017 Location: South West Mich Points: 5391 |
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Thanks for the pictures of the process that went into the '17 ! May I ask what the most time consuming/$$ fabrication was ? I realize it's trivial to most of you guys, but I've been curios how the 433 FP linkage was mated to the '17 throttle linkage . Thanks again for all that you bring here
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Brian F(IL)
Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Paxton, IL Points: 2691 |
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Yes, Dr. you are correct. The shipping stands were solid on the bottom and I believe a little taller than your step. I just thought maybe someone modified it by making it shorter and drilled some holes for drainage. But, you're probably right; it isn't what I thought it might be.
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19547 |
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That step was on the tractor when I bought it, so I have no idea. I doubt that it is what you think it is, as the floor part of it is full of holes like a grinder mixer screen. Those shipping stands were solid, right ??
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Brian F(IL)
Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Paxton, IL Points: 2691 |
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The triangular "helper" step mounted on the left side looks familiar. It reminds me of the "stands" that were mounted on the back of AC cornheads when they were shipped upright (standing on their backs). We used to pick them up from LaPorte and used many of those "stands" as steps for several different models of AC tractors. It was just something we did at the dealership; not an AC approved modification. Just curious if that's where your step came from.
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allischalmerguy
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Deep River, IA Points: 2864 |
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Dr. Allis,
You missed your calling! Engineer at Allis Chalmers and what a tractor that D17 would of been! Way to go. God gifted you with an amazing brain and desire to do some neat things. You are a real asset to the Allis Chalmers community. Pastor Mike |
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It is great being a disciple of Jesus! 1950 WD, 1957 D17...retired in Iowa,
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19547 |
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https://photos.app.goo.gl/asormkrGTppYUWex5Pics from the build, including the 3-point hitch removal to be able to use the snap-coupler plow.
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Mikez
Orange Level Access Joined: 16 Jan 2013 Location: Usa Points: 8150 |
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Wow that's cool. Have any other pictures.
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SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 8002 |
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I have a 45D carcass around here I thought would make a good candidate for a 433T....just too many other things take precedent.
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Ky.Allis
Orange Level Joined: 31 Jan 2010 Location: Kentucky Points: 965 |
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And now days just about all tractors in this HP range and even smaller have a turbo!!
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19547 |
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The D-2200 engine wasn't enough HP, as it was naturally aspirated and only 200 cubes. I think they were 50 flywheel HP, while a One-Seventy needed 65 to 67 flywheel HP @ 1800 RPM to deliver 54 at the PTO. So, that means more cubes (230 to 250) or a TURBO !! Even if the D-2200 with a turbo (D-2400) cost more than a Perkins, it would have been worth it in my opinion. Imagine, the only diesel turbo farm tractor in the 55 HP class !!!!!
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steve fischer
Orange Level Joined: 11 Jul 2011 Location: sleepy eye mn Points: 927 |
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I put a 433 in a 175 about four years ago took the perkins out tractor runs quieter with a strait pipe and more power , I have late model black engine starts great ,
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injpumpEd
Orange Level Access Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Walnut IL Points: 4773 |
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The 200 cid 4 cylinder was used in the HD4 crawler as the 2200 series, sad the tractor division was able to outsource engines from perkins for less than their own sister division of the same company.
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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AC7060IL
Orange Level Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3207 |
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Well said about the AC 433I. Back in the late 1980s thru the 1990s, I’d usually get two full days (12-14hrs/day) running a hydro F3 Gleaner(70gal fuel tank) & A330 cornhead. It’s 433I was very economical, yet powerful.
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19547 |
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The history of the 4-cylinder version of the 301 began in 1965 from all I can find, within a year of the intro of the 301. The 301 turbo was in 1965. It just looks to me like the original One-Seventy should have had this engine in it at 2,000 RPM. A little smaller turbo would have been fine for 54 HP. But instead a Perkins ???
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injpumpEd
Orange Level Access Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Walnut IL Points: 4773 |
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This has bee fun to watch come together. This is what the D17 Series 5 should have been, instead of the Perkins, which are great engines no doubt.
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19547 |
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I do. The goal on this project was to try and make it appear as if it maybe could have been an OEM turbo-diesel installation. There were several hurdles, but in the end, we now have a powerful, economical and modern D-17. Hydrostatic power steering, live hydraulics with "float" position on the remote valves, a rugged Cat #2 3-point hitch that can easily be removed to still use the snap-coupler system, and the old high-pressure hydraulic system still intact. All original S3 D-17 features were retained with the addition of the newer more modern features. It was a lot of work, but all great fun usually is.
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Alex09(WI)
Orange Level Joined: 15 Mar 2012 Location: CECIL WI Points: 1698 |
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Looks great and works great Dr! Do you enjoy engineering/fabricating/designing?
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www.awtractor.com
A&W TRACTOR 920-598-1287 KEEPING ALLIS-CHALMERS IN THE FIELDS THROUGH THE 21ST CENTURY |
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darrel in ND
Orange Level Joined: 22 Nov 2009 Location: Hebron, ND Points: 8585 |
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Loved the video! See that the good doc is a little camera shy himself though. Have to see what this Allis genius looks like some time! LOL! Keep up the good work, Dr. Darrel
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Kenny L.
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: NEIOWA Points: 1225 |
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Looking good Doc, you done a great job even on the littlest details it looks even better up close.
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19547 |
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Yes, it is 14 to 1 compression ratio. I have the manifold heater on it. 30 to 60 seconds and it starts pretty well. Has a block heater too.
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AC720Man
Orange Level Joined: 10 Oct 2016 Location: Shenandoah, Va Points: 4641 |
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Those 433T engines are good ones. Our 81’ 6060 still runs great, plenty of power, no smoke until you roll the coal with a load, clears right up after its up to speed. Very fuel efficient. Nice set up DOC, cool project. Would have truly been a great setup for AC.
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1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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DaveKamp
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Location: LeClaire, Ia Points: 5639 |
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That soil really rolls nice off the 14's... looks like it cuts and rolls same in 2-low as 2-high, which means you've got all the geometry dead-on-perfect, and ample force on-tap at the drawbar. Great video, excellent sound!!!
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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 8002 |
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My 78 has 3300+ hrs . The meter was AWAL when I got it .I took it apart and oiled things and it's been working for last 20yrs. Doesn't use any oil and will lay a cloud when throttled up after snapping in separator clutch. Great little engine! I assume yours has the low compression pistons too causing poor cold starts?
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HD6GTOM
Orange Level Joined: 30 Nov 2009 Location: MADISON CO IA Points: 6627 |
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Doc, shes looking good. That must be some heavy dirt. Before I bought a decent disk and field cultivator I would plow corn ground in 2nd high side with a 3x16 slat bottom plow. I'd throw the dirt clear outta the furrow. I thought it was cool for a few rounds. Then I realized I'd have to level the dang field back up. Looks like fun, glad you got her all figured out. I really wish AC had put a diff lock starting with the series 4 D17 and later tractors.
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DrAllis
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19547 |
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Well, it was 30 degrees that morning, so the air was good for no smoke. The injectors have never been serviced on that 1978 model year engine. It must have had good care in all it's years of use. I'm guessing it has 3,000 hrs or less on the engine. It will smoke when you crack the throttle when under the turbo for sure. All the good ones do that !!!
The weights are what you do when you have a lot of that type laying around !! The rear wheel weights actually go on and off much easier than any OEM donut or pie weight does. All you have to do is get the wheel positioned just right and they slide right into place.
Edited by DrAllis - 24 Nov 2020 at 7:35pm |
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SLee(IA)
Silver Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Polk City, Iowa Points: 252 |
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I love the weights Doc.
Steve |
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SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 8002 |
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Where's the smoke? My F2 hazes all the time. Similar to an N6 but not that heavy.
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DanD
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: WI Points: 856 |
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Thanks...pretty much what I was thinking...but just wanted to ask you. We have a 185 and two D17's and a 433 engine in our F3 Gleaner but never had a 6000 Series tractor. That engine transplant looks like it came out of the factory that way. Looks great.
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