Allis Chalmers 180 Rebuild Qusetion?

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   Hello All,
My AC 180 diesel has steady blue smoke from the stack, a lot of white smoke from the crankcase breather and dip stick tube. Also it has dark, thick "juice" dripping from the outlet of the exhaust manifold. How much longer do I have? I suspect that my engine is about worn out. Also my injector pump leaks externally. Could it be that my injectors are leaking causing the smoke?

Should I get ready for an engine/fuel pump/injector overhaul? I took my thumb and blocked off the crankcase vent for about 15 seconds and when I let off it shot a lot of crud. Still have a lot of "venting" from all orifices.

Thanks,

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nsula_country Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 10 Mar 2011 Location: NW Louisiana Points: 218	Post Options Post Reply Quote nsula_country Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: Allis Chalmers 180 Rebuild Qusetion? Posted: 13 Apr 2012 at 9:15pm
	Hello All, My AC 180 diesel has steady blue smoke from the stack, a lot of white smoke from the crankcase breather and dip stick tube. Also it has dark, thick "juice" dripping from the outlet of the exhaust manifold. How much longer do I have? I suspect that my engine is about worn out. Also my injector pump leaks externally. Could it be that my injectors are leaking causing the smoke? Should I get ready for an engine/fuel pump/injector overhaul? I took my thumb and blocked off the crankcase vent for about 15 seconds and when I let off it shot a lot of crud. Still have a lot of "venting" from all orifices. Thanks,
	2014 LS P7010C, 1962 Farmall 504 Diesel (1st tractor) w/ 2008 Koyker 220 FEL, 1968 Allis Chalmers 180 Diesel, Komatsu PC38UU-2 Excavator, Various attachments for all!

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DSeries4 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Ontario, Canada Points: 7496	Post Options Post Reply Quote DSeries4 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 Apr 2012 at 9:32pm
	How much longer do you have? What are you waiting for? Obviously the poor thing needs some help!
	'49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '63 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21841	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 Apr 2012 at 9:38pm
	I've got three questions for you : #1. does the radiator stay full ??? #2. How much engine oil does it use in 100 hrs ??? #3. Does it pull your biggest load as well as ever when it comes to HP??

nsula_country Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 10 Mar 2011 Location: NW Louisiana Points: 218	Post Options Post Reply Quote nsula_country Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 Apr 2012 at 9:22am
	Radiator stays full. Oil use is not bad, but I have not ruled out if it is "making oil". Heaviest load I have put on it is a 10' disc. I plan to try and use it to pull a 4 yard scraper (Reynolds) to build up my new road. I bought it last year and I knew it was a little tired. I only gave $2600 for it. It doesn't pop out of gear and the PD is tight. Hydraulics seem good as well. It just smokes. I do not want to send a rod out the block before I do an OH. I have changed the oil twice since last February. Once when I bought it, and again last month. I have maybe put <100 hours on it. I was just curious that as worn as it is, if loading it down with the scraper (full load for this size tractor) for about 50 hours would finish the engine off or just make it use oil? It appears to still be strong. Thanks. CT
	2014 LS P7010C, 1962 Farmall 504 Diesel (1st tractor) w/ 2008 Koyker 220 FEL, 1968 Allis Chalmers 180 Diesel, Komatsu PC38UU-2 Excavator, Various attachments for all!

Orange Blood Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 29 Nov 2010 Location: ColoradoSprings Points: 4053	Post Options Post Reply Quote Orange Blood Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 Apr 2012 at 10:26am
	If it is holding good oil pressure, then I wouldn't worry about it holding together. Probably what happened is the air filter had a hole in it, or was missing for a while. From what you describe, It sounds like you have two problems, 1. worn sleeves and rings, from dust. 2. low pop pressure on the injectors, from old age. But if it isn't making oil from fuel in the oil, and it has good oil pressure, you should be able to run it with the blow by for what you need. I really don't think a 4 yard scraper is that much of a load that tractor anyway.
	Still in use: HD7 WC C CA WD 2-WD45 WD45LP WD45D D14 3-D17 D17LP 2-D19D D19LP 190XTD 190XTLP 720 D21 220 7020 7030 7040 7045 3-7060 Projects: 3-U UC 2-G 2-B 2-C CA 7-WC RC WDLP WF D14 D21 210 7045 N7

injpumpEd Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Walnut IL Points: 5095	Post Options Post Reply Quote injpumpEd Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 Apr 2012 at 10:30am
	could just be fuel system related. Does it start? or need ether? I haven't seen too many diesels that would smoke blue(oil) but yet still start & run really good, and not use lots of oil. Pull injectors for freshening(I can do that for you)while they're out, test compression. Those 2 things will tell the story. Then you will know for sure if you need to go deeper into the engine. I can also service the injection pump. Good luck! Ed.
	210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!

DougG Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Location: Mo Points: 8339	Post Options Post Reply Quote DougG Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 Apr 2012 at 12:29pm
	Run it then see what happens , there wont be a question then ; sorry , its got issues prolly a rebuild would make it a fine machine again !!

nsula_country Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 10 Mar 2011 Location: NW Louisiana Points: 218	Post Options Post Reply Quote nsula_country Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 Apr 2012 at 9:44pm
	Oil pressure is good. It doesn't need starting fluid and I have started it at temps as low as 30 degrees F. I did have to grind on it 4-8 times to get it to start though (low compression?), no block heater and the manifold heater doesn't work. Actually nothing electrical works except the key switch and I wired it. When I purchased it a screwdriver was provided in the tool box. Warm days like today (87 deg) just a touch of the key. I just charge the two, group 31 batteries 2-3 times a year. The air filter is a good point. Some one removed the piping to the air filter housing, cut another hole in the hood on the opposite side and stuck the pre-cleaner straight onto the air filter housing. The bottom of the filter housing has rust pin holes and the filter was rusted as well as the paper looked sad, dated in the 80's. I put silicone in the holes, bought a new pre-cleaner bowl, and a new Wix filter. I ran it good today. I put about 7 hours on it with a heavy 6' rotary mower in 3' high grass/weeds. Seems like it was not blowing as much from the crankcase vent unless I got into really thick stuff or a ridge of dirt. Maybe it needed a workout. Still has blue exhaust though. Valve lash... How important is that? Judging the poor maintenance the 180 received over the years, I'm sure they have not been touched. Could they cause some of the blow-by? Thanks again! Looks like a bottom end OH and a head job are in the future. InjPumpED will probably get to do the pump and injectors. PS. Dads 107 hp JD 6420 4x4 will spin all 4 tires if he drops the scraper too far. I know it will test the 180!
	2014 LS P7010C, 1962 Farmall 504 Diesel (1st tractor) w/ 2008 Koyker 220 FEL, 1968 Allis Chalmers 180 Diesel, Komatsu PC38UU-2 Excavator, Various attachments for all!

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21841	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 Apr 2012 at 10:00pm
	The radiator stays full....that is good. The engine starts right up without ether or manifold heater on an 80 degree day....that too is very good. Oil pressure remains good when working it....that is good. Engine HP seems good as ever.....that is good. You want to overhaul it because of some leaks and perceived blow-by issues?????......

nsula_country Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 10 Mar 2011 Location: NW Louisiana Points: 218	Post Options Post Reply Quote nsula_country Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 Apr 2012 at 10:40pm
	I have only had it about a year. Unknown history. Oil pressure gauge is questionable to say the least, actually I do not think it works. Temp gauge is broken too, but it doesn't boil over. I shopping EBAY for a Stewart Warner Oil Pressure gauge right now. What is "good" oil pressure. 25 psi, 45 psi? The fuel system is my main concern. The injector pump has no safety wire on it an it leaks externally when the fuel cut off cable is in the run position. I believe it has been gone into before. The blow-by and blue exhaust smoke is more any other diesel equipment I have ran or owned, except for an old Snapper lawn tractor I once had. It is not a mosquito fogger. Maybe I am paranoid that it is worse than it really is. So once I get a new gauge installed and if oil pressure is in spec, don't worry about it?
	2014 LS P7010C, 1962 Farmall 504 Diesel (1st tractor) w/ 2008 Koyker 220 FEL, 1968 Allis Chalmers 180 Diesel, Komatsu PC38UU-2 Excavator, Various attachments for all!

SHAMELESS Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: EAST NE Points: 29486	Post Options Post Reply Quote SHAMELESS Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15 Apr 2012 at 1:28am
	one day raking hay...all of a sudden white smoke/steam came outta the breather tube...i shut it down right now! a buddy helped me pull it back to the shop...electralisis had taken it! bought another engine from eisenman's outta madison Ne! it's still going strong, and i figger it was way cheaper to just exchange engines rather than fix it! anyway...i was able to finish raking hay with the hearse!

nsula_country Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 10 Mar 2011 Location: NW Louisiana Points: 218	Post Options Post Reply Quote nsula_country Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15 Apr 2012 at 10:39am
	Electrolysis took what? A sleeve? Are these wet sleeve engines? CT
	2014 LS P7010C, 1962 Farmall 504 Diesel (1st tractor) w/ 2008 Koyker 220 FEL, 1968 Allis Chalmers 180 Diesel, Komatsu PC38UU-2 Excavator, Various attachments for all!

Clay Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Udall, Kansas Points: 9876	Post Options Post Reply Quote Clay Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15 Apr 2012 at 1:56pm
	Yes, the sleeves are replaceable. If you have water getting into the oil, it is possible that an o-ring has failed. I have seen many engines with electrolysis / cavitation issues. Our 180 diesel, had such a problem, back in the late 1980's. We used Belzona (1111) Super Metal to repair the lower bore of the block. This was an in frame over haul. New pistons, liners and bearings. The engine still runs strong and the oil analysis is ok.

nsula_country Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 10 Mar 2011 Location: NW Louisiana Points: 218	Post Options Post Reply Quote nsula_country Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15 Apr 2012 at 11:07pm
	Looked up, Belzona. Tough stuff! I was asking if the AC engine in a 180 was wet or dry sleeve? CT Edited by nsula_country - 15 Apr 2012 at 11:08pm
	2014 LS P7010C, 1962 Farmall 504 Diesel (1st tractor) w/ 2008 Koyker 220 FEL, 1968 Allis Chalmers 180 Diesel, Komatsu PC38UU-2 Excavator, Various attachments for all!

SHAMELESS Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: EAST NE Points: 29486	Post Options Post Reply Quote SHAMELESS Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 16 Apr 2012 at 12:20am
	took the block, between the sleeves.

injpumpEd Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Walnut IL Points: 5095	Post Options Post Reply Quote injpumpEd Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 16 Apr 2012 at 6:30am
	Wet Sleeve.
	210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!