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What does the future hold |
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AllisFreak MN
Orange Level Access Joined: 07 Dec 2009 Location: Minnesota Points: 1541 |
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Posted: 07 Feb 2021 at 2:34pm |
I am hoping this can remain civil and non political, even though politics plays a major role in the outcome. Hypothetically speaking, where do you think old polluting diesel and gas engines will be in say 20 years? My concern is, will fuel prices be crazy high because they want rid of these engines, or will it be low because of lowered demand. Will we be forced to turn over this old equipment to be destroyed for a pre set payment towards something newer and less polluting, or maybe fined, fee'd or taxed for keeping it around? It worries me as an enthusiast of old orange (or any color for that matter) tractors and old Mopars and other classic vehicles. Again, I am just asking where do you "think" we will be in 20+ years regardless of politics, and will our old junk be feasible to keep around and use in the long term.
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'49 A-C WD, '51 A-C WD, '63 A-C D17 Series III, 1968 A-C One-Seventy, '82 A-C 6060, '75 A-C 7040, A-C #3 sickle mower, 2 A-C 701 wagons, '78 Gleaner M2
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DMiller
Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Hermann, Mo Points: 30971 |
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Fuels in general will go up, lack of local National supplies(Pipelines and fracking Stopped) the Powers that are in office currently will see to it we get shafted for as much as they can grab for coffers until we curtail usage, and that WILL happen.
Been told by enough people in the industry that we will be at $4+/gallon before Summer, could see spikes to OVER $5/gal thru summer and as the fuels taxes do not materialize the Admin will resort to further beatings until capitulation gained, or otherwise. Year and 10 months Congress will be set to flip again, BACK to Conservative so long as these people play this gambit.
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DougG
Orange Level Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Location: Mo Points: 8102 |
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No worries in my thoughts, theres no way to get it ALL GREEEN- its all talk, whats sad is our American companies -ALL- have foreign investment money pushing them now- all the electric stuff ive seen was disasterous, but thats my thinking,, it will be interesting
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KMAG
Orange Level Access Joined: 26 May 2020 Location: Elizabethtown, Points: 669 |
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My older brother managed a Mercedes and now a GM car dealership. His info from manufacturers says electric cars will be the only option in 20yrs.
Non-aviation gasoline use likely will become taxed massively to encourage persons not already sent to re-education camps to use non-fossil fuels, excluding natural gas. Edited by KMAG - 07 Feb 2021 at 2:51pm |
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DMiller
Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Hermann, Mo Points: 30971 |
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BTW, ANY and ALL including Synthetic Lubricants are PETROLEUM Base Stock Originated.
Anyone dismisses Oil as far as Lubricants is UNEDUCATED as to where these materials come from. Shut down Petroleum and there are ZERO lubricants in volume enough to lubricate existing machinery. Edited by DMiller - 07 Feb 2021 at 2:56pm |
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Lars(wi)
Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Permian Basin Points: 7155 |
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Crude will be hovering in the upper $70’s, lower $80’s within 2 years, barring any cataclysmic events.
The technology just is not in place for any drastic shift in how our transportation infrastructure. That is at least a100 years in the future. |
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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.
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Thad in AR.
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Arkansas Points: 9438 |
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I see a lot more public transportation. Heck look at how many things are delivered right to the house including groceries.
Got a coworker trying to get his 19 year old boy to learn to drive. The boy doesn’t want to. What the heck with that? From the time I was 10 til now I only thought of two things. Motors and girls. Harley and the big ja4 jap bike makers can’t sell cruisers. Harley is working on electric motorcycles. I myself can’t think of one modern luxury that I really like cept tacking with y’all on here. Maybe lots of electric scooters n busses in cities. I can’t see things changing much out here. |
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jaybmiller
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Greensville,Ont Points: 22399 |
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I think we'll be where we are now, prices will go up a lot, then mostly down, then up a wee bit more.. it's a 'game' to 'them' to squeeze as many coins out of your pocket into theirs...plain and simple, always has been. Since there's billions of barrels of oil to be had under our feet here in Canada and USA,gas SHOULD be cheap but 'they' export it to make $$$$. The wildcard factor will be a war, say in mideast. I don't see any electric tanks or planes.... What I'd like to see is a HUGE investment into nukes. Smaller ones..here and there.. they WOULD allow less oil/gas to be needed. Don't understand the lack of geothermal either . |
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor) Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water |
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FREEDGUY
Orange Level Access Joined: 15 Apr 2017 Location: South West Mich Points: 5391 |
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IMO, the '30 (2030) models of anything will be a "hybrid/totally electric" propelled vehicle that in turn "should" lower the fossil fuel cost due to demand. The "BIG OIL/Lobbyists" will make sure that doesn't happen though .
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steve(ill)
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 80828 |
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It can't happen overnight.. If you think all cars and light trucks will be electric in 20 years, how about gas motors in the trucks that are NEW 18 years from now ? You have to keep gasoline available for another 20 years for those vehicles... I would think the "plan" is to get most cars to electric, most light trucks to electric, and shut down the coal fired power plants... You will still see a lot of natural gas plants, and i think nukes will make a come back 20 years from now... They will not stop pumping crude.. Used to make lube oil, synthetics, plastic toys, car parts, kerosene, probably paint thinners, etc.. The push will be to eliminate "most" gasoline engines in cars, lawnmower, light trucks, etc... You cant run a 500 HP - 40 ton truck or bulldozer 12 hours a day on a battery.. at least not until WAY in the future.
Edited by steve(ill) - 07 Feb 2021 at 4:18pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Coke-in-MN
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41549 |
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A MN legislator came out strong against the so called green transportation here in MN . Said to travel from her home to State capitol during the winter instead of a 2 hour drive would be overnight as at 40% battery capacity in cold weather the trip would be beyond the range of any vehicle now in production . If she also ran the heater in the vehicle it might take 2 days to make the trip .
A move is to have people move into areas where mass transit along pre-determined routes for housing and either track or bus transport on public systems are the ONLY alternatives for the average family . Then one has to think of how you will heat your dwelling as already areas ban wood burning, and oil will be taxed high enough to not afford to heat with , natural gas is a fossil fuel as is propane - electric from solar and wind can not peak generate in cold weather and no storage capacity is big enough let alone the grid to both produce electric for heating, charging transportation and use in every other use - unless some new form of energy is found - WE ARE DOOMED TO STUPIDITY OF GREENIES . Already restrictions are placed on older diesel engines in limited use in Cal and it seems MN wants to adopt CARB standards now . This will outlaw both highway motor vehicles , farming, construction and other power users from even existing . |
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |
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FREEDGUY
Orange Level Access Joined: 15 Apr 2017 Location: South West Mich Points: 5391 |
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What does the worlds largest "pit crane" run on ?? Even the diesels days are numbered .
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fixer1958
Orange Level Joined: 13 Feb 2010 Location: kansas Points: 2434 |
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I'd say in 40-50yrs not 20yrs.
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Lars(wi)
Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Permian Basin Points: 7155 |
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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.
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modirt
Orange Level Access Joined: 18 Jul 2018 Location: Missouri Points: 7289 |
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Food is the big hammer.....can't grow or transport it without oil. And BTW, it's not like we are out of it. This is a forced death march. But as for food shortages, the feces haven't hit the fan yet. When it does......Big Green is gonna be in Big trouble.
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Coke-in-MN
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41549 |
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What does that PIT CRANE or large shovel run on - ELECTRIC - and it's not supplied by solar cells or wind mills . Try diesel generators , either turbines or reciprocating engine powered .
I suppose one could use nuclear power but reactors are banned now also . Hydropower but that is on the hit list also . But then Coal is dead and no need to mine it anymore , all them coal miners and pipeline workers and roughnecks in oil fields need to find desk jobs in the finance field where they can buy and sell futures in electric, food, heat, and other things people will need to survive in the new green world . |
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |
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FREEDGUY
Orange Level Access Joined: 15 Apr 2017 Location: South West Mich Points: 5391 |
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Technology will advance in GIANT LEAPS in the next decade, there WILL be cost effective fuel sources sooner than you think !! Look how fast a "vaccine" came about for the Covid !!
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steve(ill)
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 80828 |
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Look how fast a "vaccine" came about for the Covid !!
are you promoting putting TRUMP back in the White House ??
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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FREEDGUY
Orange Level Access Joined: 15 Apr 2017 Location: South West Mich Points: 5391 |
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You just can't distinguish between shops/varmints/barns/trucks and the political forum I take it ?? Take your kid "NEVER" back there with you please .
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NEVER green
Orange Level Access Joined: 28 Feb 2013 Location: MN. Points: 7443 |
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I believe he wants to... warp speed Snotty!!!!!
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2-8050 1-7080 6080 D-19 modelE & A 7040 R50
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bobkyllo
Orange Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: minnesota Points: 1545 |
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If you guys are looking into something to invest in, invest big into the battery and electric motor sector.
You will see huge leaps and bounds in this area. We have an administration that thinks that we can operate anything that drives on batteries. There is no way with the technology we have now days that you can make a long journey on a single charge. So your going to need to do one of two things either improve the batteries to last longer or two your going to need to make a rapid recharge system/ station (gas station model) that will charge your battery very quickly. |
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Coke-in-MN
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41549 |
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When one thinks back wood was the source of heat for many years and or in other areas animal dung .
Then came coal and in many areas peat (great grandfather owned large peat bogs in Germany) but the industrial revolution needed more power to advance , water wheels , wind for other uses but even that was not enough . Petroleum became the big advancement in both manufacturing and travel, from ships, to full navies running on oil and not on sails . Air travel and automobiles expanded the world , not to mention trains and trucks which we still depend on today . But from steam power to diesel electric advances . To think somehow everything is going to be electric without the use of fossil fuels with some new technology coming along that already individuals say is bad it a real stretch . The place I worked was making prototype fuel cells for a couple different projects and these were based on the research done by Allis Chalmers in their development of the first Fuel Cell tractor . The process was bought by GM and they were trying to develop a cheaper method as the units we worked on were 280 titanium plates of about 1/8 inch thickness but them chemical machined with special porting and passages on both sides of plated - each plate being about 18" x 24" in size . these were then bonded or clamped into a unit where hydrogen passing through with H2O as the byproduct produced about 150 HP of usable electric . To process the titanium metals special acid resistant machines were needed as working with a witches brew of Hydrofluoric Acid and proprietary chemicals made handling the process a real dangerous operation let alone treating any byproducts from the process. One byproduct was titanium-oxide which could be used in paint but before the ramp up to full production the company I worked for sold out of business. |
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |
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DiyDave
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gambrills, MD Points: 51552 |
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I believe speculating on future technology is a waste of air. What will happen, or not, depends on things we have no control over. Will the next 4 years be better or worse?
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Source: Babylon Bee. Sponsored by BRAWNDO, its got what you need!
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modirt
Orange Level Access Joined: 18 Jul 2018 Location: Missouri Points: 7289 |
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Guess we will know they mean business when they make the Chinese fit those cargo ships with tall masts and make them sail back and forth. Ultimate wind power?
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klinemar
Orange Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Michigan Points: 7993 |
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DMiller
Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Hermann, Mo Points: 30971 |
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Hydrofluoric is bad juju
Once access the human body attacks bone for calcium Does not stop nothing to remove or dilute |
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jaybmiller
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Greensville,Ont Points: 22399 |
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20-25 years ago the 'big push' in the auto sector was to get 42V cars on the road...even though gas powered, smaller 42V electrical systems meant a huge savings in weight, boatloads of copper saved, etc. time passes...yawn... more time passes....yawnnnnnnnn.. cars STILL have 12V batteries..... |
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor) Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water |
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DMiller
Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Hermann, Mo Points: 30971 |
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And the Chinese do not have to worry of they ever having EPA Down their throats, NOTHING any other nation can do to make them clean their act up.
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Coke-in-MN
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41549 |
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HF acid - kept calcium paste around all areas where in use , also milk works well as a first wash if you cant get to another means of dilution quick .
Spend many years working with it as we chemical etched all kinds of metals and glass . Remember we got drums of it in for cleaning in a form called Railroad Cleaner - what they used it for unsure but we cleaned equipment with it as it would remove stains and carbon well off other materials , had some I put in a glass jug one night next day when i picked up the jug - it separated right at the level where liquid stopped and air met - severed it off perfectly around that line |
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful." |
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AllisFreak MN
Orange Level Access Joined: 07 Dec 2009 Location: Minnesota Points: 1541 |
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If they force all the little hobby farmers to upgrade tractors most of us will have to bow out. That's all that many of us can afford is old worn out stuff. It is probably what big brother wants to happen anyway, get rid of the little guy. I just hope it is a long way down the road yet.
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'49 A-C WD, '51 A-C WD, '63 A-C D17 Series III, 1968 A-C One-Seventy, '82 A-C 6060, '75 A-C 7040, A-C #3 sickle mower, 2 A-C 701 wagons, '78 Gleaner M2
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