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Dr. Allis D17 XT Plowing

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djo220 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 10:31am
4 x 14's in high 2nd gear. Wet old hay ground

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmey5AyZh3I

[TUBE]wmey5AyZh3I[/TUBE]

Edited by djo220 - 24 Nov 2020 at 10:31am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote garden_guy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 10:42am
Dang, that is moving fast. Sounds like she has a lot of power!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 11:42am
Actual dyno test was 85 HP @ 2300 RPM's.   Slowing the engine down to 1650 (PTO speed for a D-17) it still has 67 HP and stays on top of the turbo down to 1400 RPM.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stan R Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 12:13pm
So tell me how you juiced up the engine?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 12:19pm
The engine is from an F-2 diesel combine, transplanted into a D-17 gas chassis. The only sheet metal alteration was opening up the air cleaner hole about 1/4" for the larger air cleaner inlet.
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Ed (Ont) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ed (Ont) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 12:44pm
Allis engineers would have loved that!! Any idea what the longevity will be? 😀
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 12:59pm
It will seldom get used plowing again, and only for show if it does. The old gas engine developed 210 ft lbs of torque at 1,000 RPM.  This turbo-diesel engine develops 240 ft lbs @ 1400 RPM, so 15% or so more torque, but at a higher RPM, which is good for gears, bearings and shafts. I figure if the tractor is never weighted down more than 6,300 lbs and the engine is operated under heavy load at 2,000 RPM or more, no harm will ever come to the driveline.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AC7060IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 1:59pm
Djo220, thanks for posting the video. DrAllis, After the dog got out of your furrow, I thought I could hear that you power-directed it into Hi? The plow sure makes the 433I talk it up - great sound! Interesting combo.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 2:46pm
At the 15 second mark is where I threw it into the high side. I did all the other plowing in low 2nd. I was afraid if I hit a rock at nearly 6 mph the plow might suffer severe damage.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DanD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 2:59pm
Dumb question...but I have to ask.  I assume there really isn't an issue with the engine thrust bearing given the difference between the D17 setup and the 6000 series tractors with their PTO clutch, correct?  Only time thrust bearing in this engine would see any thrust from a clutch is just when the clutch pedal is pressed so it's only for short periods of time. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 3:13pm
The crankshaft thrust bearing in this 4-cylinder version of the 301 is the same exact thrust bearing as a 180-185-190-190XT-200-7000. We never had any issues with them. This tractors foot clutch is a flywheel/clutch disc/pressure plate from one of those bigger tractors shoved into the smaller D-17 bell housing. The 6000 series had foot clutch pressure PLUS PTO clutch pressure, which at times, was just too much for the thrust bearing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DanD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 3:17pm
Originally posted by DrAllis DrAllis wrote:

The crankshaft thrust bearing in this 4-cylinder version of the 301 is the same exact thrust bearing as a 180-185-190-190XT-200-7000. We never had any issues with them. This tractors foot clutch is a flywheel/clutch disc/pressure plate from one of those bigger tractors shoved into the smaller D-17 bell housing. The 6000 series had foot clutch pressure PLUS PTO clutch pressure, which at times, was just too much for the thrust bearing.


Thanks...pretty much what I was thinking...but just wanted to ask you.  We have a 185 and two D17's and a 433 engine in our F3 Gleaner but never had a 6000 Series tractor. 
That engine transplant looks like it came out of the factory that way.  Looks great.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveM C/IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 7:19pm
Where's the smoke? My F2 hazes all the time. Similar to an N6 but not that heavy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SLee(IA) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 7:30pm
I love the weights Doc. 
Steve


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 7:33pm
Well, it was 30 degrees that morning, so the air was good for no smoke. The injectors have never been serviced on that 1978 model year engine. It must have had good care in all it's years of use. I'm guessing it has 3,000 hrs or less on the engine.  It will smoke when you crack the throttle when under the turbo for sure. All the good ones do that !!! The weights are what you do when you have a lot of that type laying around !!  The rear wheel weights actually go on and off much easier than any OEM donut or pie weight does. All you have to do is get the wheel positioned just right and they slide right into place.

Edited by DrAllis - 24 Nov 2020 at 7:35pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HD6GTOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 8:21pm
Doc, shes looking good. That must be some heavy dirt.    Before I bought a decent disk and field cultivator I would plow corn ground in 2nd high side with a 3x16 slat bottom plow. I'd throw the dirt clear outta the furrow. I thought it was cool for a few rounds. Then I realized I'd have to level the dang field back up. Looks like fun, glad you got her all figured out. I really wish AC had put a diff lock starting with the series 4 D17 and later tractors.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveM C/IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 8:35pm
My 78 has 3300+ hrs . The meter was AWAL when I got it .I took it apart and oiled things and it's been working for last 20yrs. Doesn't use any oil and will lay a cloud when throttled up after snapping in separator clutch. Great little engine! I assume yours has the low compression pistons too causing poor cold starts?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveKamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 8:37pm
That soil really rolls nice off the 14's... looks like it cuts and rolls same in 2-low as 2-high, which means you've got all the geometry dead-on-perfect, and ample force on-tap at the drawbar.  Great video, excellent sound!!!
Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AC720Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 8:48pm
Those 433T engines are good ones. Our 81’ 6060 still runs great, plenty of power, no smoke until you roll the coal with a load, clears right up after its up to speed. Very fuel efficient. Nice set up DOC, cool project. Would have truly been a great setup for AC.
1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 2020 at 10:19pm
Yes, it is 14 to 1 compression ratio. I have the manifold heater on it. 30 to 60 seconds and it starts pretty well. Has a block heater too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kenny L. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 3:12am
Looking good Doc, you done a great job even on the littlest details it looks even better up close.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote darrel in ND Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 8:48am
Loved the video! See that the good doc is a little camera shy himself though. Have to see what this Allis genius looks like some time! LOL! Keep up the good work, Dr. Darrel
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Alex09(WI) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 11:22am
Looks great and works great Dr! Do you enjoy engineering/fabricating/designing?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 12:16pm
I do.  The goal on this project was to try and make it appear as if it maybe could have been an OEM turbo-diesel installation. There were several hurdles, but in the end, we now have a powerful, economical and modern D-17. Hydrostatic power steering, live hydraulics with "float" position on the remote valves, a rugged Cat #2  3-point hitch that can easily be removed to still use the snap-coupler system, and the old high-pressure hydraulic system still intact. All original S3 D-17 features were retained with the addition of the newer more modern features. It was a lot of work, but all great fun usually is.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote injpumpEd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 12:57pm
This has bee fun to watch come together. This is what the D17 Series 5 should have been, instead of the Perkins, which are great engines no doubt. 
210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 1:21pm
The history of the 4-cylinder version of the 301 began in 1965 from all I can find, within a year of the intro of the 301.  The 301 turbo was in 1965. It just looks to me like the original One-Seventy should have had this engine in it at 2,000 RPM. A little smaller turbo would have been fine for 54 HP. But instead a Perkins ???
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AC7060IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 3:14pm
Well said about the AC 433I. Back in the late 1980s thru the 1990s, I’d usually get two full days (12-14hrs/day) running a hydro F3 Gleaner(70gal fuel tank) & A330 cornhead. It’s 433I was very economical, yet powerful.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote injpumpEd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 4:09pm
The 200 cid 4 cylinder was used in the HD4 crawler as the 2200 series, sad the tractor division was able to outsource engines from perkins for less than their own sister division of the same company. 
210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve fischer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 4:24pm
I put a 433 in a 175 about four years ago took the perkins out tractor runs quieter with a strait pipe and more power , I have late model black engine starts great ,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov 2020 at 5:33pm
The D-2200 engine wasn't enough HP, as it was naturally aspirated and only 200 cubes. I think they were 50 flywheel HP, while a One-Seventy needed 65 to 67 flywheel HP @ 1800 RPM to deliver 54 at the PTO.  So, that means more cubes (230 to 250) or a TURBO !! Even if the D-2200 with a turbo (D-2400) cost more than a Perkins, it would have been worth it in my opinion.  Imagine, the only diesel turbo farm tractor in the 55 HP class  !!!!!
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