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1941 B project... PICTURES added finally! |
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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I suppose it sorta is, save for the fact that it started life as a tractor originally. Lots of car & bicycle parts incorporated into the build though, "depression-era" style cobbling aplenty.
Still plan on doing a full walk around video of the thing once it's down off the trailer and in a semi-usable state but the least I owe all you guys for the help thus far is a few photos.
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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OK I've only gone & done it again, weather not been great so not got the photos just yet but have made further progress & she's just about ready to drive off the trailer. Steering gear is mounted enough to where it'll work for the speeds we're doing & finally wrestled the last front tire onto the rim.
I've been putting this off/procrastinating for a while as I know from the other side that it's going to be a bear (tires are 235/75 15 car ones so way too wide & this last one is a winter one with some real meat to the thing). As incorrect tires go, it went pretty well in the end. Was a real PITA to mount the second bead as I expected but once on it pushed itself against the rim such that it's sealed well enough to stay tubeless for the moment which was a worry I'd had considering the wheels were intended for tube only. So that's 3 out of 4 aired up and happy. Still can't make the rear tube hold air, poured a couple of different concoctions in it but may have to bite the bullet and patch the thing & just hope the tire holds together after re-refitting! Either way, she's gonna touch down soon. Will definitely make sure that's caught on video for posterity.
Edited by ekjdm14 - 21 Jan 2025 at 10:31am |
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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Hopefully some photos of the hackery & tractor as it now sits.
![]() DAMMIT site limit 2.0MB? I could'a sworn it was 3... Just spent a while resizing stuff down to 3.0 but not sure if I can get them any smaller, more I shrink the image the size is going back up!
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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Trying again lol I prefer welding and waylaying on stuff with hammers much more than computers! EDIT- Wahey we have pics at last! That was harder than it shoulda been!
First up is the abortion that is the "spline" end of the drop arm (well, the bicycle seat clamp & 3 point link that identify as the drop arm!) ![]() Then the steering gear bracketry & drop arm rig up as a whole... ![]() The rusty old girl as she sits, could drive off the trailer at this point but think I'll probably at least sort out an alternator and fan before that just so she doesn't heat up too much. ![]() The marriage between 1940's Fordson & 1990's Citroen steering column... ![]() Kinda the view from the driving seat, didn't fancy a wet azz so I'm off to the side a bit! ![]() Edited by ekjdm14 - 23 Jan 2025 at 10:11am |
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DiyDave ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gambrills, MD Points: 53302 |
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Will the English ministry of recycled steering wheels allow you to use it without an airbag?
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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Wouldn't surprise me if there is a Govt. agency for such. Not that any of our 30+ year old airbags would be likely to work anyway (We die like men, even the women...)
Hellacious wind last night and most of today, fence panels & wheelie bins flying past the window and all so not likely to do much on the old girl today. At least my old oil jug has stayed on the exhaust so far.
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HudCo ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 29 Jan 2013 Location: Plymouth Utah Points: 3775 |
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i use a nail to start her cause i lost the key
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Alberta Phil ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Alberta, Canada Points: 3882 |
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Don't British tractors have to be registered? Most I've ever seen have number plate or equivalent on them. Do they have to pass an MOT inspection to be registered? Just curious! Edited by Alberta Phil - 24 Jan 2025 at 9:26am |
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DiyDave ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gambrills, MD Points: 53302 |
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Not to cast aspersions on Dan's mechanical talents (clearly he are!), but I think he has to go through the MOSW to register that one! ![]() Edited by DiyDave - 24 Jan 2025 at 2:34pm |
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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She came with a V5 (title) & her plate which she will proudly wear again one day is CKG 281 ![]() The only silly walks here are adequately provided for by government shaftings of taxation on damn near everything, they don't call the national TV station the BBC for nothing
![]() Edited by ekjdm14 - 24 Jan 2025 at 4:03pm |
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85660 |
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Dan.... is your nick name McGyver ?
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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Close Steve, but not quite close enough to be able to keep air in the rear tire with chewing gum and a paper clip. Seems I'm gonna have to go "old skool" and actually use a patch on the tube ![]() Ah well, can't complain if that's the only thing I have to do up "right" I suppose. Speaking of which I need to buy a new pack of feeler gauges still from when I butchered those to shim the big ends at the start of this project!
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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https://www.youtube.com/shorts/js9q3BQTPEs?feature=share
She's on the ground at last, from looking at things I'd say it's at least 40 years since this tractor was "complete" and driveable. Clutch release mechanism could be smoother but if it doesn't get better with time I've no problem splitting the tractor again to double-check the lubrication as the clutch could use a bit less free play anyhow. Finally bit the bullet and pulled the rear tube to patch it earlier, had pinched it on install as I thought & with that sorted I just couldn't help myself but to drive her off the trailer. The smoke is mostly oil burning off the stack from the oil can I used as a cover, otherwise though she runs pretty clean. She deserves some more love now I think, may be tempted to remove the finals/trumpets to clean out and sort out the rotted off brake bands since the friction material appears to still be OK just stuck inside the housing. Really need to sort that left rear wheel too, look at that bead of the rim just flapping in the breeze as I parked her up!!! Considering this is the worst wheel on the thing I'm not quite sure how it's the only one that held air when I bought the machine
![]() Edited by ekjdm14 - 28 Jan 2025 at 10:57am |
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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OK just noted a "development" in the rear wheel issue... I did notice on parking up that the rear tire looked a bit odd but put it down to low pressure (I didn't dare put more than about 7psi in due to the rust).
On looking over the tractor this morning it's a little bit more than that... The entire inner lip/bead portion of the rim has disintegrated and crumbled to nothing when I moved the tractor & the tire has simply swelled outward by about 4". Tube still holds air to it's credit, just chucked a stand under the drawbar & taken the valve out now to take strain off it. I knew I needed to do some work on this rim, not quite that much though! Honestly, considering how good she's been to me I might even consider springing for a replacement if I can find one cheap enough.
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85660 |
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I dont see a closeup of the rim, but assume you have the 4 WEDGE clamps to hold the rim to the cat hub.... Keep and eye out for ANY 24 inch rim...anything can be MODIFIED.. but there are some 4 LOOP rims that will directly interchange..
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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Thanks Steve, I'm not 100% sure myself but I think they are 4 wedge mounting yes. Will grab a photo when I can, it's impressively rotten!
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Gary ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Peterborough,On Points: 5882 |
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You probably have dished Rear Wheels like a Model 'C' to go with your Optional Adjustable WFE. If the Rear Rim is that badly rusted, be careful it doesn't just fall off when you move the Tractor. I had one rear literally fall off the wheel while sitting along the fence line. G |
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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Honestly not sure what type, only that they're not the original 1941 wheels since they are stud mounted on spline adaptors. Hopefully the actual band of the rim isn't as far gone as the lip, it's not like they were fluid filled & I think it's just kind of rotted from effluent/moisture trapped against the bead of the tire long term.
Will get photos anyway as it's quite impressive to me that the tube still held air on this one (maybe being flat & off the bead is what saved the other side come to think of it, that only has one bad spot where it sat on the ground). Having had a quick look round at prices/availability of used rims locally I think I'll be repairing the rotten one anyway. Nothing for less than £100 even just as a bare rim Vs. maybe £25 in material (it'll probably get something like 1 1/2" x 1/8" thick angle iron, pie cut and formed using the good rim as a pattern & maybe some patches if the band is too thin. Good thing I have no objections at all to using my new cheapie inverter welder, it's great!) Either way I'll likely break the wheel down and make sure it's structurally sound, at the very least give it a good going over with the "finding rot" hammer with the tire off as I don't much fancy 2000Lb of iron deciding to roll over and play dead on top of me! Cheers, Dan.
Edited by ekjdm14 - 29 Jan 2025 at 4:35pm |
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tadams(OH) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Location: Jeromesville, O Points: 10634 |
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Maybe you can find another rim that has a bad spot and you can cut agood spot out and weld into yours
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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EDIT-: looking at the rim I don't think that's an option, it needs the whole bead rebuilding on both sides but the actual band doesn't look too bad initially so angle iron likely the way it'll go ![]() This has created some more food for thought though... As folk may be aware, the engine number & rear housing numbers are close enough to say they likely left the factory together BUT whilst cleaning things up I noticed the torque tube & remains of the toolbox tin have bright yellow paint underneath the orange. The rear housing shows no evidence of yellow just orange & rust. Would this suggest that I have a torque tube from an IB in this melting pot of bastardry, or did Allis use a yellow primer on some parts & not others?
Edited by ekjdm14 - 30 Jan 2025 at 2:24pm |
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DiyDave ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gambrills, MD Points: 53302 |
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Allis did use yellow primer on some tractors of that era, don't know about all. If you look at paint inside castings, its yellow. It might just be, in the course of the 70+ years since it was made, that somebody had some yellow paint, and used it...
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Source: Babylon Bee. Sponsored by BRAWNDO, its got what you need!
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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That is a possibility, it's not likely to be it's first coat of paint after this long & judging by the hue of the engine and front wheels not the first time someone just used what they had (seems a LOT too bright to me, more like an early JI Case). Strange though that it only appears to be the torque tube & toolbox that have any evidence of the yellow so far.
Not going to lose any sleep over it, might be I find more yellow the more I clean the back housing up.
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85660 |
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Dan there was actually three ( i think) different versions of the "axle - wheel"... The most common was the 2 inch splined hub that slides over the spline shaft... There was also a shaft that had a flange with 5 bolts on it.. Normally that was used with the " ADJUSTABLE WIDE FRONT END" tractors.... a very rare 3rd option was a 5 bolt flange unit that slid over the SPLINED shaft and was held on with the big nut...that appears to be what you have ?
As far as i know ther HUBS either bolted to the 5 bolt flange, or slid directly onto the splined shaft..... Then ALL the rims were bolted to the hub with the 4 WEDGE clamps... The 1938- 39 might have another option.. I have seen a couple tractors with what appeared to be 24 inch TRUCK RIMS on them...
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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Steve, the way I read it (from an older post here) if I remember right, is that they were all splined until a certain year when they changed to the flange type. I'll defer to your knowledge though, not least because it sounds cooler to have a super rare option
![]() Had a play round with electrics today (I'm procrastinating on the wheel situation hoping something comes up, but still probably weld it up). Got the original water pump pulley bolted onto an old Bosch alternator & made a bracket to mount that, gave it a test run with an old bike inner tube as a temporary belt to confirm the alternator still works & now just on a hold waiting for a belt to drive it for real. Dug out an old electric fan & zip tied it to the front of the tractor, ran it off a battery charger and confirmed it keeps the temperature in check decently & finally managed to run long enough to get the oil up to temperature. Once the charging system & fan are squared away properly I might even add in an electric water pump & some lights.
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85660 |
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Dan, i was not there in 1938 so i cant say for sure ...
![]() ![]() So your HUB is a 5 bolt pattern that goes on the flalnge.. and your RIMS are held to the hub with 4 wedge clamps ?? That is the "standard" design for the rim / hub attachment.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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C'mon now Steve, you could at least have jumped in the time machine & checked for me
![]() Yes the hub is 5 bolt & the rim attaches with the 4 wedges. Managed to break the wheel down earlier, surprisingly the 5/8" nuts broke loose with only minimal cheater pipe-age but the eccentric bolts were more or less welded to the wedges & hub casting so required a lot of sweat and swinging of the BFH before they relented. All but 1 of the eccentric bolts survived with no damage, did nick the threads on one but it'll clean up OK. Will be using lots of copper grease when they're cleaned up and reassembled!
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85660 |
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Copper Grease... thats a new one on me.. I had to look it up.... On this side of the pond MOST PEOPLE call that Anti Sieze.... Looks like COPPER GREASE is a common term in England.
yes.. thats the way the rims and hubs were made in the US.. I was just wondering if that carried over to England, or there was a different "VERSION" over there.... thanks.
Edited by steve(ill) - 01 Feb 2025 at 12:34pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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Ah, I thought that was a pretty universal term. Every day a school day huh!
I think this tractor was originally built in West Allis & used for a few years over there before being sold abroad, probably imported here some time in the 50s judging from the paperwork. My V5, (title equivalent) gives the year as a 1952 so likely imported then & the importer cheekily declared it as a new machine when it arrived! Either that or it sat unsold for 11 years after it was built, & then was shipped to the UK to sell, which doesn't seem likely to me???
Edited by ekjdm14 - 01 Feb 2025 at 2:03pm |
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ekjdm14 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 20 Aug 2024 Location: Manchester UK Points: 742 |
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Well, tire & tube wrestled off the rim. That was more of an ordeal than expected thanks to the tube being stuck fast to the rusty metal, I'd hoped I'd break the bead on the side that still had SOME lip left & it'd fall right off haha of course not! Hopefully the tube has survived, they cost money...
On closer inspection the band of the rim isn't all that bad. It's thin don't get me wrong but for the use it'll see I think I'll get away with about 14 foot of light 1" or 1 1/4" if I can find it angle iron for the most part & a couple of small plates where it's really bad
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85660 |
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how you gunna bent that angle iron into a circle ?? angle iron dont BENT real good !
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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