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garden_guy 
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 Topic: Where to hook tie downs on a NF WD on a trailer?
Posted: 14 Dec 2020 at 9:51am |
So yeah, I am needing to haul my narrow front WD later this week to have some work done that is beyond my capacity in my dirt floor shed, and I was wondering where the best anchor points are? I don't have any hooks welded on anything to assist.
Trying to remember where it got tied down 20 years ago when it was hauled off for some work, I remember one being hooked maybe on the drawbar support beam but not where it was chained in the front.
Also, mine has ballasted rears, so I suspect the weight is around 5000 pounds. Just curious if there are any pros or cons to backing it on vs. driving it on? Or just a matter of balancing the trailer?
It was a whopping high of like 40 degrees or so yesterday and I did my third day of cleaning on the old gal to get it ready for shipment (didn't want to dirty up their shop).
Mineral spirits, dawn dish soap, a brush, a rag, scrapers, etc... Just
trying to get 70 years of dirt, oil, and grease off. She actually looks
better than I thought under all that.
Edited by garden_guy - 14 Dec 2020 at 12:34pm
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Brian F(IL)
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Posted: 14 Dec 2020 at 1:36pm |
When I haul mine on my car trailer, I drive it on. Usually because I've also got an implement hooked on. You'll have to practice to find the right balance point for front to back location. I would think you would want this anyway for the trailer axles to carry most of the weight vs on the tongue of the tow vehicle.
As far as a hook point, I just loop a chain over the front tires behind the pedestal. Hook points on the trailer are far enough forward there is no way the chain is going to slip off and/or fall behind the tires. You also want your rear chain(s) to be well secured so when you slow down or stop, the tractor doesn't end up in the back of the tow vehicle. HTH
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 14 Dec 2020 at 1:45pm |
GG, I use 4 chains. 1 one each corner. I think it is the accepted practice in our area. Anyway I hook over the angle under the frame rails. the angle supports the front of the engine. I hook right at the frame rail then go to the front of the trailer each side. Hope that helps. Hope things go good on the transportation and work. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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garden_guy
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Posted: 14 Dec 2020 at 3:15pm |
 Brian F(IL) wrote:
When I haul mine on my car trailer, I drive it on.
Usually because I've also got an implement hooked on. You'll have to
practice to find the right balance point for front to back location. I
would think you would want this anyway for the trailer axles to carry
most of the weight vs on the tongue of the tow vehicle.
As
far as a hook point, I just loop a chain over the front tires behind
the pedestal. Hook points on the trailer are far enough forward there
is no way the chain is going to slip off and/or fall behind the tires.
You also want your rear chain(s) to be well secured so when you slow
down or stop, the tractor doesn't end up in the back of the tow
vehicle. HTH |
Well we've got a two axle trailer, seems like most people wind up with the rear tires right over the area between those two axles... Seems like a good starting point to drive it on and try that and see how it goes.
Do you loop the chain over the front tires and go forward, or do you loop it around the pedestal and one tire and go forward and to that side, then repeat? Seems like a neat idea either way.
Sugarmaker wrote:
GG,I use 4 chains. 1 one each corner. I think it is the accepted practice in our area. Anyway I hook over the angle under the frame rails. the angle supports the front of the engine. I hook right at the frame rail then go to the front of the trailer each side. Hope that helps. Hope things go good on the transportation and work. Regards, Chris |
Yeah I forget that crossmember is under there for the front engine support. That seems like a good place to hook onto, will have to look into that one. Seems like lots of options like the rear has the axles or the drawbar area, and the front has the pedestal or the frame behind the crossmember... I'm planning to use at least 4 tie-downs, so I should be good there. I am just hesitant because I haven't done this with a tractor before so wanting to read up on it in advance. Thanks as always Chris!
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john(MI)
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Posted: 14 Dec 2020 at 6:02pm |
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Just throw one around the front tires and put a clevis on the drawbar and run the chain thru there. Put a four foot pipe on the binder to snap it and you're good to go. Drive up to the trailer at a little bit of an angle and run the front tires up the far side ramp, then brake the rears around for them to come up the ramps.
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Dick L
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Posted: 14 Dec 2020 at 6:26pm |
Actually depends on how they are loaded. In hauling tractors for years I chained in many different ways. The idea is to chain them so they stay put. Some examples.
When loading straight I hooked to the torque tube on the C and thru the frame on the 77. Loading three I used the post between the front wheels. I crossed the chain at the front wheels to keep it from slipping and hooked to both sides of the trailed. I always boomed down until the tires would squash with a three foot cheater pipe.
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SteveM C/IL
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Posted: 14 Dec 2020 at 10:16pm |
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just b sure you got some tongue weight. A little test drive steering side to side will tell you if you need more. It will throw you in the ditch or oncoming traffic if not right.
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Les Kerf
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 4:04am |
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Here in Idaho the tiedown at the drawbar WILL get you a ticket; you MUST have a tiedown at each corner.
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Stan IL&TN
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 5:41am |
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One thing is for sure, you can't go wrong using too many chains or straps to keep it safe. When in doubt......use more.
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1957 WD45 dad's first AC
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mdm1
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 5:49am |
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When I bought my trailer I asked about loading. They said to have the back of the truck squat about 2". I back my tractors on but have only hauled my C and B's. I use 4 chains, 1 on each corner.
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 6:24am |
GG, Hope the hauling goes well. Good suggestions here too. I forgot to mention about that angle cross bar: Its a very good time to recheck the four bolts. One on each frame fail and cap screws going into the bottom of the timing gear cover. These can get way loose or worn in the life of these working tractors. Wouldn't want you to hook to a unsafe area. On the rear I like to go into each corner of the draw bar bail (cross support). Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 15 Dec 2020 at 6:28am
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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WF owner
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 6:34am |
Sugarmaker wrote:
GG,I use 4 chains. 1 one each corner. I think it is the accepted practice in our area. Anyway I hook over the angle under the frame rails. the angle supports the front of the engine. I hook right at the frame rail then go to the front of the trailer each side. Hope that helps. Hope things go good on the transportation and work. Regards, Chris |
I, too, use the angle iron support / frame for a hook point. I use grade 70 3/8" chains with grab hooks and hook one hook into the frame. I have both "snap" (lever) and ratcheting binders. I actually prefer the old snap binders, but the big push is to the ratcheting type.
I prefer to back a tractor on a trailer. I guess it's not as much that I prefer to back it on, but I prefer not to back it off. With gravity playing a big part, sometimes things happen very quickly, especially if it happens to be wet, when unloading and I feel that I have better control driving off.
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 6:58am |
Like WF said too. your comfort level needs to be considered. I have backed on too. But most oif the time I drive on the deck. My old small trailer is fairly low to the ground and I like the ease of getting the tractors on and off. At least I feel more comfortable. Also make sure you have a good solid center ramp for the narrow front tractors. Yes I see folks like John load them with just the two ramps. Looks to dicey for this old man!:) We have been discouraged from using snap over binders. When I purchased the new chains and binders I also went with 3/8 chain, each 10 foot long and ratcheting binders. Good pictures Dick added above! Just some random shots of things that might help or jog your brain too?
My crew:
ready to load the 45:
In this picture with a implement I believe you are supposed to have additional chain/s on the implement too. I was probably not to code here.
The WZ:
Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 15 Dec 2020 at 7:10am
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WF owner
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 10:11am |
A short story from the past.
We do quite a few parades in the summer. We were doing a volunteer fireman's parade and, during lineup, one of the police officers doing the parade came over to chat when I was unloading. He told me that he was impressed that I was chained down "by the book" with four grade 70 chains. He was talking about loads over 10,000 lbs. He looked like I was crazy when I told him my WD was only about 3500 lbs. and my CA was about 2500 lbs. Some of these guys have no clue ! I use 4 grade 70 chains only because I want them to stay on the trailer, even if I was involved in an accident.
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garden_guy
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 12:47pm |
Thanks for all the pictures and feedback guys. I appreciate it. I am definitely going to aim for "more is better" in terms of tie-downs. Lots of great pictures (many thanks, Dick L!) and info in this thread; I appreciate all the help and feedback guys!
And Sugarmaker, your pictures are pretty perfect. The trailer we've got is pretty close to yours, and I am pretty sure I'll have 2-3 inches of fender well clearance on both sides with how the tires are set out.
I think we've only got 2 ramps.... So that part I will have to work around.
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john(MI)
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 2:31pm |
I didn't see any mention in the other posts, but you need to stop after about 10 miles after you start out. Check all of the chains and binders to make sure they still tight.
Another thing that I do. I don't have D rings on my trailer so I use the stake pockets. I drop the chain down thru and bring it back up to the top and hook it. If you just hook it on the bottom or on a rail, one good bounce and the chain can just pop off.
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Michael V (NM)
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Posted: 15 Dec 2020 at 10:48pm |
5/16th grade 70 chain is way more than plenty for a WD. the working load limit this size is 4700#, that is 1/3rd of breaking strength(its like 14250#), so in theory 1 chain would be enough,,,if ya could figure out how to make that work... if ya wanna use 3/8ths,, go for it,, just lotsa more work to throw heavier chain.... I have WFE tractors, so I tie the front a little different than a narrow front, I tie the rear more secure than the front,, I don't want the tractor jumping in the cab with me... I have found out recently to run the chain all the way around the stake pocket and hook back to itself,,makes sense to me,,, car hauler, shoot, back in a ditch and run it on... they usually kinda low anyways, mine is cause it has a 'dove tail' on it. only 2 ramps with a car hauler trailer,, run the front on, set brakes, jump off move the ramps.. works better if ya have a helper..
just looked at Chris' trailer, mine is almost identical,, notice the dove tail at the rear,, if ya get the trailer in about any kind low spot, ya can jump her on there!!
Edited by Michael V (NM) - 15 Dec 2020 at 10:51pm
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garden_guy
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Posted: 16 Dec 2020 at 9:39am |
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Thanks guys. Yeah, we don't have D rings either, so it'll be stake pockets. Good call on wrapping it around so that the hook anchors on the top to make sure it can't "bounce" free. And always good to double check the load after a short initial haul to re-tighten, indeed! I even had a lawnmower have a strap go loose in 10 miles in a pick-up truck.
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ACinSC
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Posted: 16 Dec 2020 at 11:40am |
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Like Curt said backing on the trailer might be a good idea . I was backing the D 15 off my son's trailer with our heavy 6' harrow attached . Going down the ramps the tractor front wheels came up . Didn't hurt anything but I'll back on next time . HTH
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Bill Long
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Posted: 16 Dec 2020 at 2:52pm |
Well, after seeing all the "proper" way to attach a WD to a trailer I would like to add that back in the day (40's - 50's) we simply drove the tractor on to the - at that time - stake body truck, locked the brakes, put it in low gear and drove away. Nobody ever stopped me for that type of haul. I did get stopped when pulling a 66 All Crop. Was asked how wide are you in the back. I in my best 17 year old voice said "little over 6 foot". Came back with a grin and said "how about 12' 6"?" Since it was farm equipment he let me continue if I agreed not to take it through the town up ahead. Since we knew all the back roads no problem. Good Luck! Bill Long
Edited by Bill Long - 16 Dec 2020 at 2:53pm
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Stan IL&TN
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Posted: 17 Dec 2020 at 1:52am |
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I don't haul my tractors much so I'm gun shy and take precautions that are most likely unnecessary but I use a couple of jack stands and some heavy boards and place them under the rear of the trailer so when loading or unloading I know the back of the trailer is not going to tilt up as the weight of the tractor gets on the end of the trailer and tries to lift the rear end of my truck in the air. It probably only moves a couple of inches but it makes me feel better while in the process.
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WF owner
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Posted: 17 Dec 2020 at 6:20am |
Stan IL&TN wrote:
I don't haul my tractors much so I'm gun shy and take precautions that are most likely unnecessary but I use a couple of jack stands and some heavy boards and place them under the rear of the trailer so when loading or unloading I know the back of the trailer is not going to tilt up as the weight of the tractor gets on the end of the trailer and tries to lift the rear end of my truck in the air. It probably only moves a couple of inches but it makes me feel better while in the process. |
This is a great idea, especially when the trailer has a ball hitch. Many trailers that have flip down ramps, have a stand built into the ramp.
Back in the 70's, when we were heavily involved in tractor pulling, one of the guys we travelled with had to block the back of his trailer, because, without the blocks, the back of the truck would be in the air when he drove up the ramps.
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garden_guy
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Posted: 17 Dec 2020 at 1:55pm |
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Good calls about the trailer moving and all that. Will have to keep an eye on it. At least the driveway is flat and paved. Definitely can block the trailer if need be. So many things to think about; the mind boggles sometimes.
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Brian F(IL)
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Posted: 17 Dec 2020 at 3:24pm |
Stan IL&TN wrote:
I don't haul my tractors much so I'm gun shy and take precautions that are most likely unnecessary but I use a couple of jack stands and some heavy boards and place them under the rear of the trailer so when loading or unloading I know the back of the trailer is not going to tilt up as the weight of the tractor gets on the end of the trailer and tries to lift the rear end of my truck in the air. It probably only moves a couple of inches but it makes me feel better while in the process. |
I now use jack stands at the back of the trailer too. The first time I loaded my WD-45 with SC #109 disc, the ass-end of my truck started to go up in the air. Ever since then, I always use jack stands, even if it's just the tractor.
Edited by Brian F(IL) - 17 Dec 2020 at 3:26pm
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garden_guy
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Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 5:42pm |
Well everybody, we got it hauled successfully today! Each axle to the back corner, then the front pedestal to each corner. Drove it on and the trailer balanced well stopping just about six inches from the front rail.
The biggest issue I am hoping my cousin tackles for me is the calcium
destroying my rear rims, either by welding or somesuch (I left it up to
him).
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 6:35pm |
GG, After the rims are repaired are you planning to load them with the beat juice? You need a donor rim to cut that section out and have him weld in a piece matching piece from a junk rim. This looks like a couple that I did too. My recommendation would be to take the wheel assembly apart get the rim sandblasted before you start any repairs. Much easier to weld up and it shows other weak areas. BTDT! Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 6:56pm |
gee, if that 's the only salt damage you're LUCKY !!! Agree, sand blast the entire rim, rinse seveal times with water/blow dry, then lick finger,rub on rim, and taste your finger.....ANY salt...it ain't clean enough. Once clean , fix the problem area... then paint using epoxy primer 2-3 light coats, then quality enamel, urethane or epoxy. Spend time NOW and you'll never have to repair that rim in your lifetime. Jay
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PaulB
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Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 7:22pm |
No doubt about it: If you have calcium solution in your tires it not IF your rims will rust out, but WHEN
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
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garden_guy
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Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 8:12am |
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Sugarmaker -- Yes, at some point (once both tractors get their rims repaired) I think I am going to go with rim guard/beet juice. I like having the ballast, but my wallet is about to feel the calcium sting haha. But yes, definitely going to get the rim cleaned up well and painted once done to solve that issue!
jaybmiller -- Well, there's a couple other spots, and one thumb sized spot where you can press on the tube which is kind of scary lol. That was the last straw for me. Been thinking about doing it for a few years now, but it is past the point of no return now. I am hoping this is a once in a lifetime repair!
PaulB -- Absolutely. Friends don't let friends use calcium (anymore)!
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IBWD MIke
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Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 8:38am |
Sugarmaker wrote:
GG, After the rims are repaired are you planning to load them with the beat juice? You need a donor rim to cut that section out and have him weld in a piece matching piece from a junk rim. This looks like a couple that I did too. My recommendation would be to take the wheel assembly apart get the rim sandblasted before you start any repairs. Much easier to weld up and it shows other weak areas. BTDT! Regards, Chris |
Chris, he doesn't really need a donor rim. I have pieces cut out, ready to go. Would be happy to send one or two for cost of shipping.
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