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Chris/CT 
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Location: Niantic, Ct
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 Topic: Welding advise
Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 8:06am |
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I've been welding on my rear blade to keep with my snow removal work. I keep getting failure at plate to plate weld points for Top link. I have since added 2 bolts to help keep in place and hope this helps. I'm using a Lincoln AC stick welder. I have setting at 110, using pretty heavy rod. Doesn't seem as though I'm getting good penetration to these welds. Should I slow down the bead and give more time to penetrate? I'm worried about weld flowing out of joint, should I not worry so much about that aspect? Is building weld on top of weld OK for strength? Try burning in bead on each piece first, then add more bead to those welds? Is this good/Bad. Any advise appreciated.
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MNLonnie
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 8:27am |
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A pic of what your welding might help. Are you veeing it out to help with penetration?Probably need more heat to get your penetration. Is it a flat or vertical weld?
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Waukesha B, B, IB, G, styled WF, D15, 615 backhoe, 2-Oliver OC3's, 4 Ford Model T's, 3 Model A Fords, AV8 Coupe, AV8 Roadster, 1933 Ford Wrecker
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CTuckerNWIL
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 8:43am |
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Stick welding might not be the cleanest way to make multiple passes but if it weren't for multiple passes a lot of heavy equipment wouldn't last a day.
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CAL(KS)
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 10:51am |
If your not getting enough penetration then you should turn up the welder. Unless your workpiece is burning through or your rod is getting red you can turn it up. multiple passes are good just make sure to chip sl*g before next pass
more penetration is better than several light passes
if you have prior welds with low penetration might be better to torch or grind down and start clean
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Coke-in-MN
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 11:18am |
On a butt weld penatration into base metal needs to be over 1/2 to 3/4 thickness of material on root pass if both sides can be welded. If not then V notch of base has to be just short of unwelded side and root pass made to just show lightly on unwelded side. Then weld is added to each side to build material up to origonal thickness, so 2 passes on top of root, then 3 passes , then however many to close V to full width.
Root pass should be 6011 with AC welder and the rest of weld 7018 rod for build up.
Adding material like bolts or such just weakens weld , you would be better off with after build up adding a length of plate longer than break by several inches and welding that to base material with higher amp 7018 stringer bead along top and bottom edge of plate
Amp should be 90 to 120 for 1/8 rod 6011 / for the 7018 amp will varry but should be in the 100 to 140 range on the 1/8 rod. clean sl*g from weld before each pass with chipping hammer and grinder if needed . 7018 rod will be easy to clean if amp is right as flux will rise and almost self clean as it cools with little chipping needed if all is right.
Edited by Coke-in-MN - 06 Feb 2011 at 11:22am
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."
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Chris/CT
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 11:32am |
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Thank-You for all advise, I will get picture posted. I have some advise already implemented, and have been kinda on right direction. I really need to have a "Pro" do this, but cannot afford to take out of service with more storms coming in next few days.
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Coke-in-MN
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 11:55am |
wow the word sl*g is a poor word choice I guess , sl ag somehow has a added * in it
TO become a PRO WELDER it takes practice, practice, practice, some classes and more practice. I am far from it but did some school , did lot of welds that did not hold up and found out what I did wrong and try to do it different next time the situation comes up.
I seldom use rod over 1/8" unless doing real heavy plate or weld where i am doing a heavy bead on heavy metal. In fact now use wire feed welder for just about everything and use .035 wire E70S for everything.
Here is a link to picture of multi-pass weld to close gap .
Edited by Coke-in-MN - 06 Feb 2011 at 12:20pm
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."
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Kipn
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 12:03pm |
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Nothin' to add about welding, wish I knew though. Tuesday supposed to be rain south, CT & MA and snow north, NH. Two seperate systems not getting together. Otherwise we would be lookin at snow in the 2-3 FOOT range. Heard Thursday's storm is gonna be a bust also. Good luck
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1961 H3
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Coke-in-MN
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 12:25pm |
Bead height on finished weld should be slightly convex , if concave your heat is to high and if bead height is say over 1/4 of height of your rod diameter you are running to cold.
Weld should flow into base metal and if a gouge into base shows you are running to slow and to high heat. Chicken tracks looking welds are both heat and speed problems.
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."
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Chris/CT
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 7:25pm |
Coke, Thanks for all the great advise. I'm going to weld it up for 3rd try tomorrow, another strom coming on Tuesday. I'm going to re-design this 3pt adapter/hitch for the blade for next year. I have to make it more "stout" next time around. I put Grd 8 bolts down thru space to help keep it from popping off. 
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MNLonnie
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 7:45pm |
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Looks like you've got plenty of good steel there, probably just need to turn up your heat to get into it.
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Waukesha B, B, IB, G, styled WF, D15, 615 backhoe, 2-Oliver OC3's, 4 Ford Model T's, 3 Model A Fords, AV8 Coupe, AV8 Roadster, 1933 Ford Wrecker
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 10:03pm |
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If your trying to do it in one pass, thats not enough.. You need to burn in a good base, chip off the flux and put 3-4 more passes on top. THE final weld thickness should be about the same as the base metal. If you have 3/8 inch plates, you need about 3/8 inch thick weld. If you welding two plates at a 90 degree angle, you need one bead on the base, then two on the next row (one on each side of original), then three beads on the top. That should be about 3/8 inch thick or so... YOu should be using 1/8 inch rod, no bigger.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Coke-in-MN
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Posted: 06 Feb 2011 at 10:53pm |
E6011 is a AC rod and a lot better for welding than E6013 for most welds , it burns hotter and has less flux buildup. It will also work on all positions but isn't as good on thin metal.
If you use E7018 be sure it is E7018-AC or you will have trouble striking a arc and keeping it going.
With the fit-up I see in your picture it looks like a minimum of 3 passes is needed on each area. The left side top could use a couple more passes On 3 pass I like to do root pass, then top pass and finish with the lower pass to blend all areas into smooth looking weld.
If something doesn't look good , grind it out and do it over, don't try to cover it with weld.
Another thing is to whip rod from left to right as you move forward to fill a larger gap, but doing it in a U shape movement to keep puddle frozen and not flowing out of work area.
Edited by Coke-in-MN - 06 Feb 2011 at 10:56pm
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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."
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Chris/CT
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Posted: 07 Feb 2011 at 3:07pm |
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Update; Used the E6011 rod @130. Root weld/follow-up welds, really seemed like I got good penetration. I will not bore you with picture [ kinda ugly work ]. Used about a 14 rods to get it done. The rods did heat up red at last 4 inches. I tested on some wet snow piles, [ pushing back for room detail] all seems good. Thanks again for the support everyone.
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