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SGTJ 
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Joined: 15 Apr 2019
Location: La Valle, WI
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 Topic: WD Overhaul thoughts ?
Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 3:42pm |
In response to answers to my brake repair questions, I've learned that the brake job is going to be a little bit larger of a project then I intended. So while I'm at it, I thought "might as well just overhaul it" So here I am, looking for some more advice. I plan on using this tractor to put up about 35 acres of hay this summer, as well as general use around the farm. If I'm going to take a few days off to tackle the brake project, what else would you recommend I do to get this think back to peak performance ? Its pretty much in its original '52 state (I replaced the generator with a 1 wire 12v alternator and threw on new lights) - hasn't had a much use in the last 20 years. It leaks in the usual places, cant run it with the radiator cap tight or else Coolant gets in the oil (crack in the head?) , hydraulic pump isn't as strong as she once was, muffle wobbles around, ect ect its a solid and reliable tractor - it just hasn't had any attention given to it in quite some time. Basically - instead of buying a new tractor - I'm giving myself a 2 weeks and $1,500 what would you recommend I do to my WD before I start using it hard this summer - Already did a complete fluid change - Brakes - Carb Rebuild - New Gaskets ? (because it drips in a few places, like they all do)
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WD , CA
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AaronSEIA
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Mt Pleasant, IA
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Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 3:45pm |
Coolant in the oil is most likely a sleeve o-ring. I'm not sure $1500 would get the engine completely rebuilt, but it'd get pretty close. If you don't need crank work and do it all yourself. The brakes while a pain in the butt, are not nearly as involved as the video was. I've never seen anyone pull a final drive to do the brake bands. If you've got a bad drum maybe, but not to just re line the bands. AaronSEIA
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WF owner
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Joined: 12 May 2013
Location: Bombay NY
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Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 5:28pm |
Depending on how far you are getting into the engine, I would definitely do new cam bearings. They are the biggest factor in low/marginal oil pressure. I, personally. take the head off and take it to a machine shop, to have the head surfaces and valves done. It costs a little more, but these guys are pros and I have never had a problem.
If you're getting coolant in the oil (as Aaron says), it is probably an o ring on a sleeve, but it can be a crack in a sleeve, leaking head gasket or a leaking core plug in the head. If you have the head done, make sure they change the core plugs. It's very inexpensive and they often look much worse when you remove them.
When I'm doing an engine, if I don't want to spend a lot on it, I often reuse the sleeves (liners) and pistons, unless I see a definite reason not to. Hone the sleeves before you remove them. Check them over carefully. Clean up the block very well, install new O rings, lubricate them and reinsert the sleeve in the same hole (with the same piston). I always use new rings.
Mike the rod and main bearings and install new bearings. Check (and recheck) with Plastigage.
Watch Don Bradley's video (in the Knowledge Section) on how to seal up the bottom end.
Sorry so long ! |
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Ed (Ont)
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Location: New Lowell, Ont
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Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 6:13pm |
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I pulled the final drives to do the brakes. Your seals will be leaking and just ruin the brakes so replace them. They are cheap and easy. I also found bad side bearings on the diff so replaced those. Do it right. Do it once! Keep in mind those seals are 60 years old and probably have not been replaced so do it all and you are good for another 50 or so! Someone else can do it next time.
Edited by Ed (Ont) - 10 Feb 2020 at 6:17pm
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marion
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Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 6:24pm |
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I had same dilemma about 20 years ago,
since I'm not very smart I decided to do engine,
pistons, sleeves, bearings, had block line bored, had new valves in heaad
had head done, rods sized, cam bearings water pump, radiator, brakes, while I was at it
I took all my nicest Sheetmetal to body shop and had it straightened and pained correct color
tractor has show quality Sheetmetal, have a small fortune in engine it is the nicest running thing I have, took some pictures of it and average guestimate
of value was somewhere between 4 and 6 hundred dollars.
then I bought me a nice d-15 series 2 for $1500
tried to give wd to a agri museum last month and they wouldn't take it
if you save your money and wait, you can buy twice the tractor for half of what the motor will cost yoou
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Lonn
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Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 7:33pm |
Are you experienced at engine rebuilding. There are lots of little things that can be done wrong that may cause disappointment and even give you an engine that smokes and uses lots of oil within a short time. For example I've seen someone go and hone the sleeves then just wipe them once with a rag and call it good. And in a year or two it was a mosquito chaser.
First there is an art to honing to get the correct cross hatch pattern. Second the sleeves must be washed thoroughly until yo can take a pure white cloth and wipe them down and see no grey residue at all. Same goes for brand new sleeves and for that matter the pistons too. That's just a couple of examples.
And do you know you need to overhaul? Maybe it doesn't need anything more than gaskets and seals.
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dr p
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Joined: 24 Feb 2019
Location: new york
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Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 8:08pm |
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I think the two week time limit could be a bigger obstacle than the financial limitations. As someone who is currently in the middle of a wd45 engine rebuild, you will often find a little part that isn't work the risk of reusing but if you order a replacement, it might take a week (or longer) to get it. Play it safe, sounds like you have plenty of peripheral things to work on and when you have a couple of months and maybe a little more currency, then take the engine. It will be a lot more fun without having to worry about the time
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SGTJ
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Location: La Valle, WI
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Posted: 11 Feb 2020 at 8:36am |
Is a complete engine rebuild necessary ? it runs like a champ … carb could be rebuilt (runs a tad rich - think I have a float issue) but besides that - is it worth me diving into the engine ? My old man said he thought the head was cracked when he replaced the head gasket 10 plus years ago -- since then he (and I ) have only ever ran it with the radiator cap lose with no issues. The tractor has sentimental value, so I would like to continue using it - but that fact that for the last 20 years its only purpose in life was to plow snow - means that I hasn't really been worked hard. I plan on plowing / planting/ mowing / baling / hauling I guess ultimately my question is : should I really do an engine rebuild ? or are there more practical things that I could do in the meantime (IE replace PTO shear bolt , rebuild cab, new gaskets on the leaking oil pan , new tempo gauge ect ect) If you fine folks are telling me a engine rebuild is in order … well that's another thing
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WD , CA
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AaronSEIA
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Posted: 11 Feb 2020 at 9:05am |
If you plan on working it, you will have to address the coolant issue. The best way to do the pan gasket is with the engine out and upside down. Drop the pan with the engine in it and pressurize the radiator with one of those hand pump tester things. Wait a few hours, then look and see where the coolant is coming from. It'll be obvious if it's coming from the sleeve o-rings. If not, pull the head and have it checked. Either way, yank the engine and re gasket it. You can do a compression test first too. If it's low, you may want to do a full overhaul. I suppose if it were sleeve seals you could go real cheap and just replace those too. It becomes one of those "I'm this far..." discussions with your time and wallet. AaronSEIA
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Lon(MN)
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Location: Merrill Wi
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Posted: 12 Feb 2020 at 8:17am |
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If you care to do a trip to Elk River MN. I have rebuilt several of these tractors. I am a show and tell guy and willing to help out.
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Dave(inMA)
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Posted: 12 Feb 2020 at 10:06am |
Lonn(MN), that's the kind of offer I'd love to hear if I were working on one of my tractors. This is why this forum is so great. Sadly, MA is a LONG way from MN!!
Dave
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WC, CA, D14, WD45
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DrAllis
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Posted: 12 Feb 2020 at 10:40am |
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Nothing should be done to the engine until the coolant loss issue is figured out. It could be a cracked BLOCK !!!!
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nella(Pa)
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Posted: 12 Feb 2020 at 11:06am |
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The first thing I would check are the freeze out plugs in the head and head gasket at the same time. That would be the most likely place for a leak like that. As for an engine overhaul, it sounds like it isn't necessary. So, don't try to fix something that isn't broken, and don't ask how I know!
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 12 Feb 2020 at 11:46am |
After having been through this recently. I would agree with Dr. Allis. Finding what the cause of the leak is first. Then determine course of action. If you want to use this this summer and get into a engine build your time line may be way too tight, or maybe I just work slow? Also $1500 is about 1/4 of what you "might need" if you fix every thing back to working order on the tractor! Sounds crazy, but parts even good used ones are not cheap and add up. Not in any way trying to discourage you about the tractor. In good condition they will do all the work you have mentioned and love every minute of it. The water leak is what got me. I did have a cracked block. Your welcome to look at my thread along with several others that have done engine/ tractor refurbs. I will help you any way I can. P.M. me if you want. Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 12 Feb 2020 at 11:47am
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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john(MI)
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Posted: 12 Feb 2020 at 12:24pm |
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I'm wondering what baler you are using that a WD can handle?
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D14, D17, 5020, 612H, CASE 446
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ac fleet
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Posted: 13 Feb 2020 at 5:58pm |
Find the water leak before you spend one more cent on it! ---- THAT'S a serious problem that might be simple fix OR could turn out major!
As for $ 1,500, That will about get the engine kit, now you gotta get it put in and still have to get the head redone, maybe resurface the block, have crank ground, or at least checked, cam bearings installed, cam itself checked,freeze plugs replaced, ---list goes on and on. ---Most of this has to be done by a machine shop and they are not cheap.
When done, the tractor should have a good engine, BUT what else is wrong/worn thin?
A family tractor is one thing, and how much you have to spend is another.
As already said, it might be easier/cheaper to look for something newer and in better condition and keep this one because its family.
More than likely aluni-seal will stop the leak and allow the cap to be tight. ( worked in my ranger). A final note, the hydraulic pumps in these weird to begin with. I never did care for them. currently have a front mount "real" pump to put on my fav. 45, then all will be good! lol!! Good luck on your venture and keep us posted on the project.
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http://machinebuildersnetwork.com/
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Dave H
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Posted: 14 Feb 2020 at 5:50am |
My motto is if it ain't broke don't fix it.
Find something else to pfart around with.
My last pfarting around project was getting a 1848 M 72 Maytag motor running like a top. 
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AaronSEIA
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Posted: 14 Feb 2020 at 6:42am |
Not sure where you find a $1500 overhaul kit. If Jim at OKTractor has his prices right, a major OH kit for a 226 is $750 plus another $135 for a valve train kit. DJS and Steiner are about the same. AaronSEIA
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Lonn
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Posted: 14 Feb 2020 at 7:15am |
But you probably are going to grind the crank, put a clutch in which then includes a flywheel grind, additional seals like the clutch shaft seal and any others in the area of the front pedestal etc etc. Manifold planed, possible head planed, valve guides which should be installed by a professional with the proper tools, possibly valve seats replaced. By the time I was done with my WD I.......... well I'd hate to add up what I had in just that stuff and I did almost all of the work myself except machine work. After I went through my whole WD head to tail, I estimated at least $4,500 but that included transmission and final drives etc etc and except for the valve train parts everything was AGCO. If I did it again it would all be AGCO where possible because I've got a problem with the valve train area now.
I would guess half of the $4,500, give or take a couple hundred, involved everything from the clutch housing forward. For me it was worth it because it's Dad's tractor. Took me many years to get it done due to finances....... the better part of 15 years.
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AaronSEIA
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Posted: 14 Feb 2020 at 7:18am |
It will take some money at a shop for some of the work. I simply questioned $1500 in hard parts for an engine overhaul when about half of that is more accurate. For engine parts only. AaronSEIA
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Lonn
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Posted: 14 Feb 2020 at 7:39am |
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Got it, I agree unless an AGCO kit is used ............but AGCO used to be fairly competitively priced.
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Brian Jasper co. Ia
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Posted: 14 Feb 2020 at 10:06pm |
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I'd clean off the core plugs on top of the head and then pressurize the cooling system before pulling the pan. Over the course of 70 years, they are known to rust out. A tiny pin hole leak in a core plug might be the source of coolant in the oil and are easily replaced. If that isn't it, you'll want to pull the pan to see where it's coming from.
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"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford
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