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Gilly 
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Location: Lincolnshire,UK
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 Topic: WC tight turning over
Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 3:51pm |
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Have a WC with electric start, starter doesn't turn the engine over (starter has been checked out and is OK). When cranking over with the handle it is quite tight and can't get it to fire. Starts and runs fine if tow started. Would anyone have any ideas please?
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Sugarmaker
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Location: Albion PA
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Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 3:59pm |
Humm. A good starter should turn it over. Make sure the battery and wires are good. Is it still 6 volt or been converted to 12 volt! How long has it been since it was started and ran? Can you get a feel for hand cranking from another tractor? Or are you familar with how hard this should be to hand crank? Was the engine overhauled recently? Did the tractor set for a long time?
Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Bill_MN
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Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 4:36pm |
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Is it tight the whole way cranking or is there a tight spot? Sounds like it sat for a while and is starting to seize up either at the bearings or the rings. If it was running recently might have spun a bearing.
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1951 WD #78283, 1918 Case 28x50 Thresher #76738, Case Centennial B 2x16 Plow
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wfmurray
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Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 4:41pm |
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Make sure all grounds are good especialy where stater goes in housing.
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CrestonM
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Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 4:43pm |
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Is it tight turning even with the spark plugs out?
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Gilly
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Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 4:54pm |
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Bought it and the guy used to start it by hand but had to sell due to arthritis, didnt use electrical system due to old battery (checked and battery is giving good voltage). Its a 6v system, was running, not been sat.
Friend has a WC without electric start and much easier to crank by hand,really easy to pull over. This one you really have to push against the spring hard and put a fair amount of effort into pulling it over, like I mentioned though, runs lovely when tow started.
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Gilly
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Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 4:56pm |
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Haven't taken the spark plugs out yet. If it turns freely with them out, what would this point towards?
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Jim.ME
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Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 5:53pm |
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You said the battery gives good voltage. Are you just looking at voltage at rest or have you had a load test done on it? Do you have a way to check to see how many amps the starter is drawing when trying to turn it over? I would be suspicious of an old 6 volt battery not producing enough amps. As others noted be sure the cable connections, on both ends, are good. 6 volts should have heavy cables. If the cables look the size of the ones on your car, that may be part of the problem. 12 volts can use smaller cables than 6 volt.
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B26240
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Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 6:47pm |
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wild idea --- mouse nest in bell housing? Also how was the oil pressure when you had it running?
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DrAllis
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Posted: 16 Sep 2018 at 7:09pm |
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A compression test might tell you something. Install a known good compression tester in one cylinder and pull start it. Make sure you "gun" the throttle several times and read what the tester says. If it is more than 125 psi you may need 12 volts instead of 6 volts. Poor grounds are common. Get a good big ground cable to the starter mounting bolt on the left side behind the air cleaner.
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Gilly
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Posted: 17 Sep 2018 at 3:43am |
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Just took spark plugs out and engine turns really easily on the handle.
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DrAllis
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Posted: 17 Sep 2018 at 7:22am |
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So, it must have pretty good compression. That's still no excuse for a starter that won't turn it over to start it. The starter was checked out by who ?? Someone who really knows farm tractor starters ??
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Gilly
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Posted: 17 Sep 2018 at 8:55am |
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I tried turning it on the handle each time I out a spark plug back in and it got a little tighter with the 3rd and 4th but seems a bit better than before. I suspect as soon of you have said that it could be the battery now. Going to change the battery, cables and terminal clamps (all the 6v batteries that I can find in the UK are too tall for the existing battery box so will have to make a new one or a deeper lid) will add the ground strap from the starter to the starter retaining bolt as well. The starter was checked over by a small auto electrical shop that was recommended to me, the shop has being going for years, the guy was really old and seemed quite knowledgeable about them.
Thanks.
Hope to get fuel tank back on and try to start at the weekend.
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Bill_MN
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Posted: 17 Sep 2018 at 12:05pm |
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Definitely higher compression than stock then, the original 6v system was just ok for stock but anything more you really should think about switching to 12v. Will be easier to find a battery that fits your box also.
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1951 WD #78283, 1918 Case 28x50 Thresher #76738, Case Centennial B 2x16 Plow
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Gilly
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Posted: 17 Sep 2018 at 12:19pm |
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Would it need anything else changing over or would I just be able to put a 12v battery in as positive ground?
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DrAllis
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Posted: 17 Sep 2018 at 12:28pm |
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Depends. If you have a magneto ignition, that will make it easier. The generator can be adjusted to charge 12 volts by squeezing the brushes together a bit after loosening the screw on the back of the gen body. Adjust brushes to get 2 to 3 amps at full throttle is enough to keep the battery charged. Light bulbs will have to be changed to 12 volts.
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Gilly
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Posted: 21 Oct 2018 at 3:16pm |
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Changed the battery, turns over nicely now but often the starter starts to grind and other times when it engages it will cut out when turning over. Could this be a ground issue? Is it worth now trying the strap between starter bolt and starter?
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 21 Oct 2018 at 3:20pm |
My guess from what you described is that the starter may need repairs?? Also your ring gear may have some serious issues with the condition of the teeth. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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mdm1
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Posted: 21 Oct 2018 at 5:16pm |
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Pull the starter and clean it up. You should be able to look at the teeth on the ring gear then. Sounds like some may be bad.
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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Gilly
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Posted: 24 Oct 2018 at 1:41pm |
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Pulled the starter, teeth are fine. Looked through at ring gear to find a section of damaged teeth 😔
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mdm1
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Posted: 24 Oct 2018 at 7:58pm |
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I have a B that has the same problem. I guess I will be splitting a tractor next year.
Edited by mdm1 - 24 Oct 2018 at 7:59pm
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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