Wax toilet ring ?s

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   I have a question for the plumbers! I've had trouble with the wax rings on a couple toilets in our house ever since I've lived here. Seems they last a year or two, then one day...your socks get wet. Maybe I'm doing something wrong. Flanges are level with floor. Toilets don't rock on the floor. Bolts are tight keeping the toilet from sliding. Toilet is centered over flange. I've tried the rings with the plastic insert, tried the ones without, tried using two rings... nothing seems to last. I was doing some reading on toilets and a few people recommend the wax free, rubber or silicone toilet sealing rings. Do these work better than the wax?? What's the plumbers opinions?  
Thanks!!!

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baverwolf Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 24 May 2010 Location: SE Montana Points: 828	Post Options Post Reply Quote baverwolf Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: Wax toilet ring ?s Posted: 18 Nov 2022 at 2:00pm
	I have a question for the plumbers! I've had trouble with the wax rings on a couple toilets in our house ever since I've lived here. Seems they last a year or two, then one day...your socks get wet. Maybe I'm doing something wrong. Flanges are level with floor. Toilets don't rock on the floor. Bolts are tight keeping the toilet from sliding. Toilet is centered over flange. I've tried the rings with the plastic insert, tried the ones without, tried using two rings... nothing seems to last. I was doing some reading on toilets and a few people recommend the wax free, rubber or silicone toilet sealing rings. Do these work better than the wax?? What's the plumbers opinions? Thanks!!!

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Lars(wi) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Permian Basin Points: 7697	Post Options Post Reply Quote Lars(wi) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 Nov 2022 at 4:38pm
	First, check to make sure the flange coming up from the floor is at the correct height, and check if the flange moves.
	I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.

plummerscarin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 22 Jun 2015 Location: ia Points: 3755	Post Options Post Reply Quote plummerscarin Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 Nov 2022 at 4:39pm
	My first answer would have been be sure toilet isn't rocking on the floor. This is BEFORE setting a wax and tightening bolts. Once I have confirmed it does not rock either on it's own or shimmed accordingly, I set a wax then carefully set the fixture and then snug up the bolts. Have rarely used the type with the plastic horn. I would massage the ring so it would center on the flange surface and make it taller. If the flange is flush with the finished floor I would mold 2 together in that manner. Is the flange secured soundly to the floor? Is the flange out of shape due to age? Check the bottom of the toilet to ensure all old residue is removed and dry. On occasion if the glazing underneath was on the sealing area, I would smear a little fresh wax on the area to give the ring something to seal with. Perhaps a little over the top for some but I had very few call backs with that method over 20 years. One client I had was in a feeble condition and put a lot of side pressure using the commode so I had to resort to a seal with a rubber ring that stretched over the horn and another adjustable o ring down the pipe. Never had to reset it again. Have never used the rubber/foam rings. May be worth a try if the above method doesn't work for you.

steve(ill) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85478	Post Options Post Reply Quote steve(ill) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 Nov 2022 at 4:50pm
	On occasion if the glazing underneath was on the sealing area, I would smear a little fresh wax on the area to give the ring something to seal with. Not a plumber, but i have installed several.. I ALWAYS take some extra wax ( old ring or ???) and SMEAR it on the bottom of the toilet and a thin layer on the drain flange.. Then i set the way ring and allow it to mash into the SMEAR area.........if the toilet does not ROCK , it will be very hard for it to start leaking. Edited by steve(ill) - 18 Nov 2022 at 4:51pm
	Like them all, but love the "B"s.

Dave H Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Central IL Points: 3559	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dave H Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 8:08am
	Uhh, not a "plummer" but am aware that different thicknesses of rings are available. I set my last two using the extra thick rings. That was after an additional 1/8 inch vinyl floor was added. And since I am old as dirt and my back gives me fits, I took the back tank off before install to give me more control in setting the seat.

Coke-in-MN Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41819	Post Options Post Reply Quote Coke-in-MN Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 10:56am
	I would inspect the sub-floor for movement or for give when compressed by fixture , as if it gives it could allow the wax to be compressed then allowing a gap to form after weight is removed - have had some where wax got off and partially blocked flange and allowed leakage .
	Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something. "Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."

plummerscarin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 22 Jun 2015 Location: ia Points: 3755	Post Options Post Reply Quote plummerscarin Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 12:44pm
	That's why I mold them to fit. Out of the box they tend to be smaller diameter than flange. Too much hangs over the pipe inside diameter for my liking

Pat the Plumber CIL Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Springfield,Il Points: 4871	Post Options Post Reply Quote Pat the Plumber CIL Report Post Thanks(1) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 12:59pm
	Flange is supposed to be sitting on top of finished floor, not flush with it . Supposed to only be 1/4" or less gap between bottom of toilet and top of toilet flange. Bottom of toilet has a "horn" which sits inside flange. In theory shouldn't leak without a wax ring. Wax seal is for odor and keep from splashing out . Wax seal is not a pipe. Menards, Lowe's sell a toilet flange extension. Yellow plastic piece that fits tightly inside and over existing flange. Kit has several different sized spacers but you won't need them.
	You only need to know 3 things to be a plumber;Crap rolls down hill,Hot is on the left and Don't bite your fingernails 1964 D-17 SIV 3 Pt.WF,1964 D-15 Ser II 3pt.WF ,1960 D-17 SI NF,1956 WD 45 WF.

Dakota Dave Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: ND Points: 3964	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dakota Dave Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 1:38am
	I've used the red wax free rubber rings on a couple toilets I'd never use another wax one.

Dave H Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Central IL Points: 3559	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dave H Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 8:12am
	Dang Pat, thanks for the post. I learned something there. Hopefully I won't need to apply it.

desertjoe Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 23 Sep 2013 Location: New mexico Points: 13674	Post Options Post Reply Quote desertjoe Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 23 Nov 2022 at 12:49am
	Many Thanks to Plummerscarin and Pat the Plummer for this info which is very helpful,,,THANKS GUYS,,!!!!!

Gerry D17 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Bronze Level Joined: 25 Dec 2011 Points: 21	Post Options Post Reply Quote Gerry D17 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 29 Nov 2022 at 1:02pm
	Hi I had a problem with a wet floor and thought it was the wax and changed it out twice and in the end it was the gasket between the tank and bowl that had a small leak. Just a thought.pain in the ass changing the wax for nothing.

plummerscarin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 22 Jun 2015 Location: ia Points: 3755	Post Options Post Reply Quote plummerscarin Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 29 Nov 2022 at 3:43pm
	Either one is a pain. To sum it up, verify the source of the leak then proceed