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Toyota number in sales in the USA !!! |
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DougG ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Location: Mo Points: 8246 |
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Heard this morning on AM talk radio that Toyota is the number selling brand in the USA right now , or are always doing real good - the reason was - they stocked up on the computer chips and have no problems at all in factorys etc, now dont that seem real fishey!!!!???? LOL
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Tracy Martin TN ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gallatin,TN Points: 10694 |
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Probably just better management! It ain't like the big three here have much common sense! JMHO, Tracy
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No greater gift than healthy grandkids!
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Dorix ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 21 Apr 2020 Location: fox valley Points: 1021 |
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I'm inclined to believe better management. The big 3 tend to create there own problem's.
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85476 |
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US was loosing lots of money in TAXES for INVENTORY.... Dozen years ago they started the "JUST IN TIME" program... Parts show up and are used in 30 days.. No long term inventory.... Problem is when the parts dont show up JUST IN TIME, your left holding the bag........... all US companies do this now.. Not sure about Japan or others.
Edited by steve(ill) - 07 Jul 2021 at 8:23pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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DougG ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Location: Mo Points: 8246 |
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Funny you say the JUST IN TIME PROGRAM- cause Maytag tried that back when i worked there - it failed miserably,
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bemer848 ![]() Bronze Level Access ![]() Joined: 29 Sep 2013 Location: southern IL Points: 93 |
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I worked at the May Tag plant in southern Illinois for 29 years and know what you are talking about.
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wjohn ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 19 Jan 2010 Location: KS Points: 2158 |
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Funny, I thought Toyota just about invented just in time/lean manufacturing?
They've had a few decades on the big three to get it perfected, though.
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1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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LouSWPA ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Clinton, Pa Points: 24688 |
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wjohn, i was thinking the same thing, odd that those who championed JIT first and longest, is now ahead of the game due to stock piling?
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I am still confident of this;
I will see the goodness of the Lord in the land of the living. Wait for the Lord; be strong and take heart and wait for the Lord. Ps 27 |
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85476 |
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well............ I didnt say it was a GOOD IDEA !!!
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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dee_veloper ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 Apr 2021 Location: USA Points: 1168 |
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It is a good idea, if it is implemented correctly. US tried to copy it from Japan, but didn't get it quite right...
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Don't confuse my personality with my attitude.
My personality is who I am. My attitude depends on who you are. |
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jaybmiller ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Greensville,Ont Points: 24335 |
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from what I recall... JIT is/was probably an offshoot of Demming's SPC philosophy that the big 3 said 'poopoo' to in the 60s/70s.He went to Japnan and they saw the 'light' od 'going as fast as you can, but as slow as you must' to minimize errors(bad parts, bad cars, recalls, etc.) JIT is similar,ordering and shipping what you need, when you need it.Works great when it works but 'little things' like boarder delays, accidents, etc. can make it a nightmare. Pretty sure someone has calculated how much inventory is actually in semi trailers and not in physical buildings. Local auto mechanic says about 1/4 of the parts he orders from suppliers are WRONG, can delay reapirs by 2-3 hrs or more,bad news if the cars on the hoist as other jobs get delayed as well. Interesting sidenote.. the drywall for next door was made June 29th,delivered July 5th. Jay
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor) Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water |
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modirt ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 18 Jul 2018 Location: Missouri Points: 8211 |
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Guy next door works at Dana plant.....making axles for Ford. They got behind last year and ALL product had to be flown to factory. A 12 hour ride in a truck was going to take too long. Said they could never get caught up. They are now. A better reason why Toyota is #1 may be the products they make. I drive a 2006 Tundra.....over 200,000 miles.....and has never been in the shop for an unscheduled repair. Things wear out and has to be replaced, but nothing has ever failed on it. Spousal unit's Camry....same. Nearly 10 year old, 100k, no repairs. They just run and run and run. BTW, vehicle of choice for middle east militaries......Toyota Hilux.
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Tbone95 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Location: Michigan Points: 11964 |
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A dozen years ago??? Maybe 30 years ago, or a little more, and it was "borrowed" from the Japanese. TPM, the Toyota Production Method (or Model?) is a book, which shows how Toyota developed Just in Time, and Lean manufacturing, the beginning of which was decades ago.
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Tbone95 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Location: Michigan Points: 11964 |
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Not really an offshoot. Demming's is a quality system, JIT/ Lean is a production management system. While often used together, and similar vintage, one didn't spring form the other. Demming gets credit for the SPC, Lean has it's roots by a Japanese engineer from Toyota.
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Tbone95 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Location: Michigan Points: 11964 |
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They make good stuff, no question about that.
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Tbone95 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Location: Michigan Points: 11964 |
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There's a rather notorious story about Japanese quality from back in the early 80's I believe. A US company placed an order from a Japanese manufacturer, my memory says it was some sort of small carburetor but maybe not and irrelevant. Anyway, they ordered 1000 for an initial order to sort of test the waters. In their typical type of supplier contract, they specified they wanted 2% defect.
The shipment arrived, 980 in routine packaging, 20 in a special shipment with the note, "We don't know why you want defective products, but here they are."
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modirt ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 18 Jul 2018 Location: Missouri Points: 8211 |
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My first "major" Japanese produce was a 50 hp Yamaha outboard. Dealer I had went to had practically refused to sell me anything else. He kept saying....."trust me on this". He was right. Can't remember the number of times I'd be at the boat ramp......the Yamaha was slow to prime, but once it did.....it was always one touch and she started. There would always be an OMC or Merc, etc, tied to the dock with the hood off. Cranking.....but not starting. Only repair I ever had with that was when ethanol ate up the rubber fuel pump parts. Those were fixed for free. Then there was the time in the 80's when I got pissy with the Chevy salesman about why GM did not make and sell a car to compete with the Toyota's. He said they did! It was a GEO Prism. Except even that was just a Toyota Corolla with a GEO hood ornament on it. Final straw for me was my last company car, which was a Chevy S10. Was in the shop at least 4 times for serious stuff that failed, last was when the tranny dropped out of it at 60,000 miles. Was on I64 near Evanstan and had to go to Evanstan airport to rent a car to drive home. Had a nice new and shiny black Toyota Tacoma in the terminal. They were being made in Evanstan. Caught my eye and have never had reason to look elsewhere since.
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tadams(OH) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Location: Jeromesville, O Points: 10609 |
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Or are the chips made in Japan and that helps Toyota to get chips and nobody else. I don't know what they have over NASCAR but all cars have to have a rear drive car that is the body style except Toyota and their ad used to be a car pulls up nascar style changes fenders and bruns out front wheels smoking.
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Greg (Hillsboro, OH) ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Hillsboro, OH Points: 1183 |
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Toyota/Honda, etc DO require just in time deliveries of their products.... and heavily penalize the suppliers if they have to shut down due to no components. The way around this which you'll see at the assembly plants is the LARGE quantity of semi trailers full of component inventory which still belong to the suppliers..... they store them on the toyota/honda lots, and they 'deliver/sell' them at the time needed. in essence, they have forced the suppliers to stock large quantities of inventory.... holding the inventory and costs, so that the big mfg can claim a just in time process. Another case of squeezing the little guy to absorb all of the costs and risks.
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Tbone95 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Location: Michigan Points: 11964 |
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Chips are not made in Japan, would be WAY to expensive, much like trying to make them here.
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HD6GTOM ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 30 Nov 2009 Location: MADISON CO IA Points: 6627 |
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I bought one once. It cost more to fix than those dam ferd pickups I've owned. Never again.
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WF owner ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 May 2013 Location: Bombay NY Points: 4889 |
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Personally, I just can't bring myself to support a foreign corporation, like Toyota, when there are American alternatives. Even though I know every company uses foreign sourced parts, I prefer to support USA owned corporations, when possible. Many factors conspired to cause the semiconductor shortage that’s constraining the production of cars and many other products. The coronavirus pandemic massively disrupted supply chains. Remote workers stocked up on chip heavy computers and other gizmos. Same with bored consumers doing more streaming and gaming. Fires at two Japanese chip plants cut into supply. Then a surprisingly strong recovery produced demand far more robust than manufacturers expected. In 2018, as part of the trade war with China, the USA imposed 25% tariffs on $34 billion worth of Chinese imports, including semiconductors—the first of several salvos in the trade war with China. Those tariffs are still in effect, and chip imports from China have fallen by half as the price has gone up. China now accounts for only about 5% of imported semiconductors, according to research firm Panjiva. But imports from other countries have not gone up to offset the lost supply from China. A 5% contraction in supply during a shortage can have outsized effects. In 2019, the USA banned the sale of American-made components, including semiconductors, to the Chinese telecom giant Huawei, in an effort to disenfranchise the maker of networking gear and smartphones. That had several undesirable consequences. For one, it created a disincentive to make chips in the United States because producers couldn’t sell them to one of the world’s largest customers. Huawei begin to get chips from suppliers in Japan and South Korea that weren’t subject to the ban. China also boosted its own production of chips, and it began hoarding them, in case the U.S. action intensified. The U.S. semiconductor industry says the actions cost U.S. firms millions in sales. The trade actions were meant to address legitimate Chinese abuses. But this unilateral approach left China many escape hatches while causing substantial collateral damage. The fiasco contributed to the current shortages, hurting American businesses and workers.
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Tbone95 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Aug 2012 Location: Michigan Points: 11964 |
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I don’t buy Toyotas either, but from a manufacturing perspective I respect them tremendously.
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AC720Man ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 10 Oct 2016 Location: Shenandoah, Va Points: 5126 |
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I have always bought Chrysler/Dodge products. I have always been very satisfied. Very few problems and my 06 Durango has over 200k miles on it. My 07 Mega cab with a Cummins in it always delivers with its towing capability. Although I respect the Toyota brand, they don’t make a product that even comes close to meeting my needs. My 18 Durango is as plush and comfortable as any SUV on the market for its size. I also buy USA brand whenever possible. Ram trucks were the 2nd most sold truck until the chip thing happened. This whole pandemic delay has caused major issues for all manufactures of products, a lot of it is due to the stimulus money our stupid government continues to give away.
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1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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fixer1958 ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 13 Feb 2010 Location: kansas Points: 2434 |
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I look at vehicle manufactures from the repair perspective.
Toyota's are good long running choices. Never really see any major problems with them 'if' they are maintained. Honda's aren't too bad either. Same 'if'. The rest of them 'imports' I wouldn't own. US vehicles......getting to be over priced money pits. Creature comfort and emissions I think is the major drive of the manufactures. People have enough trouble driving as it is I guess they figured they needed some help. Kind of a cross between the Jetsons and Lost in Space. "Danger Will Robinson" |
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WF owner ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 May 2013 Location: Bombay NY Points: 4889 |
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As long as people have that mindset, we will continue to lose money to foreign companies and countries.
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fixer1958 ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 13 Feb 2010 Location: kansas Points: 2434 |
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What mindset? I see it everyday.
I'm not pro imports by any means. If I was to purchase a new vehicle today I wouldn't know what to get. It's all a crap shoot. I know what I see. |
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DaveKamp ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Location: LeClaire, Ia Points: 5957 |
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Toyota developed their "Toyota Way" based on observations of US mass production. There is no coincidence that Kiichiro Toyoda's first automobiles and trucks resembled American cars, and that his production lines did, too- he studied US and European mass-production to find ways to improve his textile loom manufacturing. He read Taylor's articles on scientific management methods, and personally went to meet Henry Ford to see how those famous 'assembly lines' worked. (For what it's worth, Henry Ford HATED electricity... he had a steam engine and water-wheel, didn't think he needed anything else, until his OWN engineers illustrated how going to ELECTRICALLY-DRIVEN machines would allow placement to radically improve part workflow through manufacturing. Once they proved to him how much THAT ability improved HIS ORIGINAL assembly-line, he had ALL his plants converted from lineshaft to electrically-driven machines.) Toyoda (who named his company ToyoTa because the Kanji symbol used, was a much better 'fit') saw how much METHOD and PROCESS determined production efficiency, and thus, concentrated on making production under practical scientific method (or as WE call it now, "Statistical Process Control"), his primary focus. As a result, we have LEAN, 6-Sigma, 5-Why. We use terms like Mura, Muda, and Muri... and we have what WE call 'Just In Time'. Finally, we have "PULL" rather than "PUSH". Push, is when someone dicatates how many of an item are produced. "Pull" is when market demands production. Regardless of which philosophy is used, to work properly, the ENTIRE SYSTEM must work the 'same way'... i.e., if a 'push' system dicatates that 400 chains of a given size and type will be made, then X number of pins, plates, and spacers will be manufactured and sent off for assembly into chains... and then the chains will be sent off to market to be offered for sale. In a 'pull' system, one chain will be made, and when a chain is ordered, the pins for one chain are ordered, the plates for one chain are ordered, and the spacers are ordered. The chain is assembled, and sent out to the buyer. The actual result (the customer having a chain) is the same, but the process by which the purchasing and producton occur, is entirely reversed, so that there is no excess of parts sitting around. Reason for that choice, is because sitting parts constitute substantial fiscal and operational losses when space and money are tight. Visit a big company, take a walk out into a storage yard or warehouse and see 5-year-old 'dead stock'... that's money that was spent, not only to obtain, but also handle something that was never used. In the meantime, it was also space taken up, with same loss... and this is why "JIT" is so relied-upon now. To understand how parts supply works in Japanese production business, one must understand the concept of 'Keiretsu', where companies buy large quantities of stock in their suppliers, and suppliers, in turn, buy stock in their clients. It would be like... the Hydramatic Division being owned 35% by GM, and 10% of GM being owned by the Hydramatic Division. Or Cummins being 20% owned by Dodge, and Cummins holding 10% of Dodge's stock. FWIW... my Camry was manufactured in Georgetown, Ky. It was a plant Toyota built, after dispensing with the NUMMI plant (a joint-venture with GM) in California. Georgetown cars are built by US citizens, on US soil, just like my Honda Goldwing was built in Marysville, Ohio. My Camry hasn't had but one major problem... The A541E... a failing OD/Reverse planetary... which was costly, but a solid 'fix' with transmission removal/rebuild/replacement. 51% of Asin-Warner was owned by Toyota... 42% by Asin AW... and they manufacture transmissions for over 16% of the WORLD's automotive manufacture (more than GM Powertrain Division). My 1999 Chevy pickup's 4L60E had basically same failure five years ago... fractured ring gear in the OD/reverse planetary... so there's clearly no 'superiority' in either category.
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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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Ray54 ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 22 Nov 2009 Location: Paso Robles, Ca Points: 4659 |
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Woo boys Woo Dodge, Chrysler, and Ram, are own by FIAT OF ITALY.
![]() ![]() You guys can holler all you want but my wife will not have another Chey or Dodge as both have had electronics trouble that left her sitting in middle of the lane. May not make sense to you or me but I want to keep her so I learned which battles are important. By the numbers she is driving a Toyota best chance of lasting. It has more made in USA parts than some Cheys and Fords.It could turn out bad to because everybody builds a lemon sometimes. I talked with a lot of mechanics all had Toyota in the top 3. My guess is Toyota is already riding on past success and current one may not last like the 20 year old ones do.
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