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TimNearFortWorth 
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 Topic: SC Draw Bar Question
Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 3:14pm |
Dave or anyone else interested, PM me and I can send a pic of the cart I use via e-mail. The wheels on the cart I have are large enough to use it outside also. Picking up a new battery at Wally World a while back and asked what they did with the used carts (both regular shopping, steel and aluminum stocking type) as seen some at rear of store near the automotive bays. Manager advised they were put out back until they had someone pick them up for repair if possible. If repair cost more than they deemed worth it, they scrapped em' and yes, they would let them go.
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Dave(inMA)
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Location: Grafton, MA
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Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 11:52am |
I'll keep my eyes open for used restaurant equipment! Sound like a great solution. So's the floor jack - in my case I was outside on gravel - next time I'll move her inside onto concrete.
Dave
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WC, CA, D14, WD45
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Ted J
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Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 11:36am |
 Harvey/pa wrote:
[QUOTE=Dave(inMA) Used to lift now I balance the drawbar on my floorjack, roll it under, jack it to the right height and push! lots easier on my aching back HTH...Harvey
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This works better Harvey as you can slide it all four ways, forward, backward, right and left. https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/slinging-the-drawbar_topic56506.html
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"Allis-Express"
19?? WC / 1941 C / 1952 CA / 1956 WD45 / 1957 WD45 / 1958 D-17
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TimNearFortWorth
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Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 7:04am |
Slight leak on pto seal or hyd outlet block usually dribbles down nicely on my drawbars . . . . As for handling the drawbar assy., picked up an aluminum bread cart some years back outside a curio shop I was driving by in South TX that had a bunch of restaurant equipment. Thought of it for moving stuff around the shop but soon realized the low height was perfect for install/removal as well as storing SC drawbars on D-Seiers. 12-14" 4x4 up frontputs drawbar eye at just the right height, also on the OEM 3-pt. adaptor. 20-24" 4x4 near the back of the cart supports either hitch for dropping/install and storage and 3-pt. adaptor arms fold down inward just right. Sure is a back saver and wheeled wherever you want it in the shop, can swap out hitches in just a couple minutes. I'm way past the age of "slinging" the SC hitches under tractors anymore.
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 5:32pm |
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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DiyDave
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 5:28pm |
I know how to generate even more replies...
What kind of oil is best to dribble on the drawbar, sos it slides easily, while in traction booster mode, regular or synthetic???  |
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Don(MO)
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 4:10pm |
Looks like cabin fever is kicking in. 
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3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep.
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FloydKS
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 3:53pm |
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I never imagined that something that could have a "screw loose" aaaaaaa (bolt or two) could cause such an exciting post.
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Holding a grudge is like taking poison and expecting the other person to die
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 12:06pm |
Here's what I use as a drawbar. It's my homemade SCcarryall with 2"
receiver. I use forklift forks for the carrying, slide a balless sleeve
in to use as a drawbar. I've got 3 real drawbars collecting dust around
here for the past 15 years since I made this.
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 12:05pm |
Here's what I use as a drawbar. It's my homemade SCcarryall with 2"
receiver. I use forklift forks for the carrying, slide a balless sleeve
in to use as a drawbar. I've got 3 real drawbars collecting dust around
here for the past 15 years sinc eI made this.
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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Dave(inMA)
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 11:24am |
Whew! Interesting stories and information. But I am unclear about whether TB comes into play when pulling a load.
My tractor is equipped with the 'standard draw bar' shown on p27 of the Operator's Manual. The hydraulic lift arms are not used in this situation - the draw bar unit is locked in place - the ends of the draw bar arms hook on pins up under the tractor and the arms are pinned to the multi-hole plates which in turn are bolted to the tractor. With a load applied to the draw bar, it can slide in either direction (toward front/rear of tractor) as long as the clamp bolts are loose enough to allow this.
So....with a load (ex: weight sled) attached to the draw bar, I'm reading the posts and the manual to say that TB will come into play as long as the pump settings are correct and the draw bar can move back and forth. Is this correct? Also, the lift arms may raise or lower but this doesn't apply to or remove from the load any lifting force. Also correct?
Thanks very much! Dave
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WC, CA, D14, WD45
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Harvey/pa
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 11:05am |
[QUOTE=Dave(inMA)
I gotta say that the SC hitch system is great for mounting implements like a plow.......not so much fun for mounting the draw bar.  Anyone got a good system for mounting the draw bar that takes the sting out of lifting and engaging the bar into the bell?
Thanks for all the replies!
Used to lift now I balance the drawbar on my floorjack, roll it under, jack it to the right height and push! lots easier on my aching back HTH...Harvey
Edited by Harvey/pa - 30 Nov 2018 at 11:10am
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DrAllis
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 7:00am |
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All Traction Booster systems had a "spring" of some kind in them. The snap-coupler design actually used a big coil spring. The 3-point hitches used what is called a "torsion bar" spring. it is a shaft that is anchored to the frame and gets twisted when under a pull allowing the lower draft arms to activate the linkage to the traction booster system. A-C never used the top link compression like little Fords do. They always used the pulling arms. That way pull-type implements could benefit from the weight transfer system.
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WF owner
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 6:39am |
Traction booster does not work with the drawbar unless it is somehow connected to the hydraulic arms. I think some are confusing the tractors equipped with a spring on the snap coupler bell with traction booster. Not all AC tractors had the spring on the snap coupler bell. Actually most did not have the spring. Here are a couple pictures I found of traction booster drawbars. The snap coupler one is currently for sale on Ebay. Only with one of these hitches installed will the traction booster work, using a drawbar pulled implement, unless you are using an implement that is mounted to the hydraulic arms. Three point hitch traction booster drawbar  Snap coupler model (which I never knew existed before) 
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DiyDave
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 4:37am |
Gary Burnett wrote:
Any tractor pull I have been in if the tractor is using a 3pt draw bar its has to have stabilizers to hold the arms and draw bar at a certain height. Usually at 20 inch maximum.
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Can't remember whether it was an exhibition pull or what. Think it appeared in the stock antique class of the pull. I know the thieving, lying, meth head in question, and his loser GF... He aint been back, after that pull...
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Gary Burnett
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Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 12:16am |
Any tractor pull I have been in if the tractor is using a 3pt draw bar its has to have stabilizers to hold the arms and draw bar at a certain height. Usually at 20 inch maximum.
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dawntreader74
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 11:04pm |
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talking about tractor pull' if you start the pull with the arm's down when you get done pulling the traction-booster' if it works will lift the arms all the way up 9 times out of 10 at the end of the track you will be putting them back down. the draw bar has to be working with the traction-boost or it would not lift the arms on it's own under a hard pull.stock draw-bar; same as the man has in the first picture.
Edited by dawntreader74 - 30 Nov 2018 at 8:54pm
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DiyDave
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 8:53pm |
Dave(inMA) wrote:
Thanks, Don and Tracy. I've now read the manual as suggested - dumb me for not trying that first! And interesting that the manual says both tightened and loose are right, the answer depending on how the hydraulic pump controls are set.
That said, would you set the pump for weight transfer for participating in a tractor pull (clamp loose), or set it otherwise (clamp tight)? Or do the pump settings not matter for pulling a heavy draw bar load? It'd be great if TB worked at a tractor pull!! |
Lifting the arms up wouldn't do a damn thing, at a tractor pull... I watched an idiot hook to the sled with a d-17(4), with the hitch point being a 3 point hitch drawbar... A wild ride ensued as the TB kicked in, both the arms came up, then the front end, as the weight transferred to the rear. Damn meth head girl almost flipped the tractor...
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Dave(inMA)
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 7:42pm |
Indeed he is - as are many on here!!
Dave
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WC, CA, D14, WD45
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Tracy Martin TN
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 7:33pm |
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Dave, in all honesty, DrAllis is the one that pointed this out to me on my D15. He is a wealth of knowledge! Thanks Tracy
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No greater gift than healthy grandkids!
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Dave(inMA)
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 6:32pm |
Thanks, Don and Tracy. I've now read the manual as suggested - dumb me for not trying that first! And interesting that the manual says both tightened and loose are right, the answer depending on how the hydraulic pump controls are set.
That said, would you set the pump for weight transfer for participating in a tractor pull (clamp loose), or set it otherwise (clamp tight)? Or do the pump settings not matter for pulling a heavy draw bar load? It'd be great if TB worked at a tractor pull!!
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WC, CA, D14, WD45
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Tracy Martin TN
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 5:53pm |
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When pulling wheel disc, if bolts are tight and the jerking pulls drawbar out, the disc will raise but can't fall back. Bolts are best loose enough for easy slide . HTH Tracy
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No greater gift than healthy grandkids!
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PaulB
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 5:01pm |
dawntreader74 wrote:
with the bolts tight the traction booster can't work very good. if it has one on it. don't thank them bolts should ever be tight. booster pulls on the draw bar' how can it work if it's held back? |
What piece of DRAWBAR equipment are you pulling that uses the traction booster? The traction booster works with mounted and semi mounted implements. For any PTO use the Drawbar should be clamped tight to give better control of the Baler, Combine, ect.
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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Don(MO)
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 1:48pm |
Pull out your WD45 tractor operators manual look on pages 27 and then on page 34 under "Snap Coupler" then read what's in there. Then do the same thing in the WD operators manual. If you don't have operators manuals on your tractor/tractors and implements them please get one, there's lots of good reading in them. On a "WD" that has been updated to the "Snap Coupler" them go with the WD45 INFO.
Edited by Don(MO) - 29 Nov 2018 at 1:53pm
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3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep.
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Dave(inMA)
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 10:59am |
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Thanks, Dave. Your explanation about varying load on the spring makes sense - and lays out what the design was intended to do.
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WC, CA, D14, WD45
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Allis dave
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 10:32am |
It should be slightly loose. Like someone mentioned. The parts drawing shows a casle nut so it shouldn't be like. I have steel locknuts on mine. They are tight enough to not bang and shake, but loose enough to slide. It you ever adjust your drawbar height it has to slide a little to adjust. It's also not about using traction boost. It's that the drawbar is mounted to a spring. As the drawbar pulls hard and easy the drawbar constantly changes position. If you "pull it out and lock it down" then your spring is always under pressure and will distort. If you go to a tractor pull your drawbar will pull out way more than a usual pull. Your drawbar needs to move. If you had the old hand clutch kickout for plowing, you wouldn't be able to "Lock down" your drawbar or your clutch would be kicked out all the time. The time I tractor pulled I had to hold the clutch to keep it from kicking out. The drawbar probably moved 1-2" Do what you want, but being tight isn't how the engineers designed it.
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jiminnd
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 9:22am |
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I have mine snug and double nutted. It can move just a slight amount so the pull is on the bell, not the support, it doesn't bang around but gives a little flexibility when hooking up. Also, they all had traction booster, just the early ones didn't have the gauge.
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1945 C, 1949 WF and WD, 1981 185, 1982 8030, unknown D14(nonrunner)
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Steve Bright
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 9:09am |
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I was told at a very young age to tighten the bolts, Makes no sense to me to hear all that racket when they are loose, And why would you want the movement from a loose drawbar while pulling a wagon, baler, or any other pull type implement. My Dad worked for AC after WWII that is where I got my info. So I guess it comes down to personal preference
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littlemarv
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 9:05am |
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The traction booster works by lifting the lift arms to transfer weight to the rear wheels. Not lift the implement out of the ground, just putting more pressure on the tires for traction. So when you are using the drawbar, what do you hook the lift arms to? I though traction booster was mostly for mounted implements, but I thought I saw a "traction booster drawbar", that had brackets and chains to connect to the implement?
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The mechanic always wins.
B91131, WC23065, WD89101, CA29479, B1, Early B10, HB212, 416H
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Dave(inMA)
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Posted: 29 Nov 2018 at 8:35am |
Yes - tractor indeed has the TB system, though I'm not sure that it activates when using the draw bar. I can see that being able to slide the cross bar can be helpful when engaging the slots in the arms. I wonder what the AC design guys had in mind back in the day!
I gotta say that the SC hitch system is great for mounting implements like a plow.......not so much fun for mounting the draw bar. Anyone got a good system for mounting the draw bar that takes the sting out of lifting and engaging the bar into the bell?
Thanks for all the replies! |
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WC, CA, D14, WD45
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