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Pincor pto generator anyone? |
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Hunt4Allis ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 13 Mar 2018 Location: Ohio Points: 1172 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 26 Nov 2021 at 4:22pm |
Anyone know much about these pto driven generator from pinCor? I'm hoping to run off my ac,ca or d-17(540 pto)it's a 30kw that I need to run 5 freezers full of beef,220v well pump( I mostly need to make sure it supplies clean enough power so I don't have issues with generator ruining our freezers fridge...
![]() I also would need to know could I run the CA at 3/4 throttle and still get 540 PTO speed? Edited by Hunt4Allis - 26 Nov 2021 at 7:52pm |
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Dusty MI ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Charlotte, Mi Points: 5058 |
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I had a good neighbor that had a 4000 watt v-belt driven Pincor.
I have one that looks like a Pincor but has a Montgomery Wards plate on it.
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917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express"
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PaulB ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Rocky Ridge Md Points: 4935 |
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I have a 25KW generator that I can run my entire house with, even in the summer with the central A/C going. I generally use the D10 and go by the HZ meter and run it up to about 65HZ and then as the load changes is stays give or take on 60HZ. The D10 does the same job on much less gas than the D15II does.
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits. If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY |
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im4racin ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 Jun 2017 Location: Garrison ND Points: 1003 |
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A ca will be a little light! My reasonable condition wd will run a 12kw at full load at rated speed but 15 was too much.
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Hunt4Allis ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 13 Mar 2018 Location: Ohio Points: 1172 |
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Ok, I haven't bought it yet.
Also have a d17 I could use to run this pinCor... I'm torn between a 10KW standalone 20 horsepower generator and taking a gamble on an older one like this pincor unit... I only am comparing those two because they're about the same cost as of now. I know they're too completely different ability generators but the standalone unit would be a welder also... This pincor unit does not have hertz meter just voltage. Edited by Hunt4Allis - 26 Nov 2021 at 6:28pm |
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Hunt4Allis ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 13 Mar 2018 Location: Ohio Points: 1172 |
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It would be nice to have extra amperage output because we raise our own beef and I currently have five freezers full of beef and I hate the idea of not having a way to protect my investment
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85678 |
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there are about 750 watts per HP............. 30,000 / 750 = 40 HP.
Thats if you want FULL 30 KW of power.. I cant see the name plate, but that is well over 100 amps output at 240 v....... I would think each freezer might be 10 amps... so 50 amps total... and another 15 amps for the well............ so 65 amps total. 240v x 65 amps = 16 KW ............ you should be OK... You wont be at full output load... But you do need to be at 540 pto rpm to keep the FREQUENCY above 60 hz.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85678 |
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i doubt all 5 freezers have to run at the same time... but to make sure you dont overload a small generator, you can run 2 of them for an hour, then run the other 3 for an hour, then switch back... etc.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Hunt4Allis ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 13 Mar 2018 Location: Ohio Points: 1172 |
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Okay so most likely I'm looking at only being able to run it with the D17 reliably, but possibly with the CA if I selectively turn things on and off if I had to...
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Hunt4Allis ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 13 Mar 2018 Location: Ohio Points: 1172 |
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I am pretty sure that I burnt up a six thousand watt generator because I overloaded it and this would be well above what we would ever need so I'm just wondering if anyone has any experience with pincor generators of this type?
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85678 |
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I dont, but them "old time generators" were pretty tough.. As you said, the signal is not CLEAN , so dont try to run a computer or plasma cutter... But drills, saws, all motors, lights............. anything from the 1960's design should run fine.
Edited by steve(ill) - 26 Nov 2021 at 6:58pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Hunt4Allis ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 13 Mar 2018 Location: Ohio Points: 1172 |
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Well some of our freezers are probably from the '90s
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85678 |
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yea.... but no circuit board / computer / digital lights... etc.... I would guess they are as dumb as a 1960 unit ? .......... just a motor and a pump.
that is one thing to remember.. NEWER Generators have CLEAN signals ( normally )... I had a 6000 watt BRIGGS powered unit i bought in 1990.. Runs great, but not with the Plasma cutter or computer............ Bought a new Harbor Freight 8000 watt unit 3 years ago and it works on everything ( clean) ........ also that little Chink motor and carburetor pull start a LOT QUICKER than the Briggs... after setting 4 months. Edited by steve(ill) - 26 Nov 2021 at 7:14pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Hunt4Allis ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 13 Mar 2018 Location: Ohio Points: 1172 |
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Yeah I wish I knew the age of this pincor?
Something tells me it's not that old but I'm not sure... I'm sure it would be okay with our deep freezers but I have an outdoor wood boiler stove that has circuit board in it so I wonder if it would be okay with that, probably a little chansey? Edited by Hunt4Allis - 26 Nov 2021 at 7:54pm |
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85678 |
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YEP.... most circuit boards drop the voltage down with a transformer and they look for a VERY CLEAN SIGNAL..... anything with a standard MOTOR is normally fine.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Hunt4Allis ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 13 Mar 2018 Location: Ohio Points: 1172 |
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If you were going to buy it what and how would you test it other than voltage? I know load testing would be the best but I don't know if that's feasible.
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85678 |
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I test my unit every 4 months by plugging a large skill saw into it and running.. It draws 13 amps on 120v ........ If you had a small air compressor or 2-3 HP motor that you could easily transport, thats about the best you can do for a test.... especially if it is 240v.
see if it will run 2-3 skill saws at the same time ??? portable air cond unit ??
Edited by steve(ill) - 26 Nov 2021 at 10:00pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Dusty MI ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Charlotte, Mi Points: 5058 |
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Google Pincor with your model number and you can print your own manual.
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917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express"
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DiyDave ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gambrills, MD Points: 53305 |
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There is an alternative. Build yourself a cold room with heavily insulated walls. Cool it with an air conditioner, controlled with a Cool-Bot kit. Then you are only running 1 AC unit, and you can use a smaller genset...
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Source: Babylon Bee. Sponsored by BRAWNDO, its got what you need!
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85678 |
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Dave.... my son did that. Has an 8 x 8 bathroom in the "SHOP" . During the winter that is where he hangs a deer or two to process.. Bought a big window air conditioner and modified with the "controller" and it keeps the room about 32 degrees for a couple weeks..
gets things COLD.... but not frozen.. Edited by steve(ill) - 27 Nov 2021 at 8:30am |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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DaveKamp ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Location: LeClaire, Ia Points: 5971 |
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The acid test for output performance of ANY generator is a RESISTIVE load... an electric heater. A guy can easily MAKE a resistive load network by gathering up a bunch of 1200w heaters. FIVE of them is 6,000w. Get a volt meter, a frequency meter, and if you have access, an oscilloscope. start the generator, get it warmed up, and start adding heaters. The generator's initial frequency will be around 61-62hz, and your output voltage should be in the high side of an expected range (110-125v or 220-250v). As you add load, the voltage will come down slightly, the frequency will come down slightly, and the throttle will start to open. The range between no load, and the point where the frequency drops AND the throttle responds, is called DROOP. Once you've reached DROOP point, the voltage and frequency should NOT drop much further with added load, until you're out of throttle. Along this entire range, the output waveform should be sinusoidal, with very little in terms of ripple or spikes. That's a smooth form, that doesn't look 'fuzzy'. I'll politely differ from Steve's assertion that older generators are 'noisyier' than newer. With exception of my portables and welder-generators, ALL my 'real' generators are much older than I am, and they're all dead-on beautiful... but they also have had proper maintenance- the exciter brushes are clean and free-moving, the bypass capacitors are all fresh, and high-quality. This is really the only thing that will introduce 'noise' into a generator, and it is frequently the least maintained element of the system. Small units that do NOT have a dedicated exciter, do not have brushes, which gives them a small advantage in that respect, however, they're extremely limited in their ability to self-reguate, and generate wimpy output and poor transient load response, so you get what you pay for. Air-cooled portable generators are good when you need portability. Likewise, PTO generators are great when you need to bring a LOT of power to an otherwise inaccessable area (across a muddy field, or through deep snow), because they're usually hanging on the 3-point or tongue of a tractor. Portables are generally weak, and being air-cooled, they are louder, and do not have the service life of a liquid-cooled unit. This is a natural consequence of portability. PTO generators are frequently poorly maintained because they have to be very substantially closed-in in order to prevent the ingress of dirt... they're always outside, or sitting in a dusty shed. Air-cooled units tend to accumulate beechnuts, walnuts, straw, and bits of chewed up cloth, loss of wire insulation, as well as substantial urine-corrosion of sensitive components due to the myriad of lovely places that rodents can invade. When you need that air-cooled generator the MOST, sit in the cold, under candlelight, and take the shroud off the flywheel and dig out the mess, then clean it all out before attempting to fire it up. The PTO equivalent very well may be equipped with heavy hardware-cloth screen layers to reject rodential residence... but mud-daubers often move in, so be careful with that too... mud-clods aren't made of flint, but they do disservice to a generator head when they start racing around the end-bells as they're battered into powder. Air cooled portable and semi-portable units have simple governors, and they're NOT going to be very 'tight' in regulating frequency. PTO units rely on the tractor as their prime-mover, and tractor governors are NOT as sensitive to load change as a synchronous generator SHOULD be. If you want a reliable backup system, START by doing a proper survey of your NECESSARY loads. Put a Kill-A-Watt meter on your freezers, and measure what they actually DRAW, and then get an idea of how often they actually RUN. (You can unplug a freezer for a WEEK, and the contents will still be frozen... ) Add up all your critical loads, multiply that by two, and get a generator of about-that-capacity. Look for a liquid-cooled Kohler, or an Onan JB genset, from the '40s to 70's vintage. Make a small shed into which you can run propane or natural gas, put lights in it, add an exhaust outlet and ventilation that mice cannot get through. Keep spare parts, tools, and extra oil and coolant mix on hand, as well as battery-powered overhead lighting and more-than-one starting battery. You can use a transfer switch, or a 'transfer panel', so that your generator is isolated from incoming mains, AND so that your emergency loads, and occasional convenience loads are the only thing applied as load when you have an outage.
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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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