| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
Tommyd 
Bronze Level
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
Location: Robertsville,MO
Points: 22
|
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote  Reply
 Topic: Original vs Restored what's better
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 2:56pm |
|
I am curious would you rather have a tractor in great original condition or would you rather purchase one restored correctly? Your thoughts are appreciated.
|
 |
|
Sponsored Links
|
|
|
wekracer
Orange Level
Joined: 13 Oct 2009
Location: Tebbetts, MO
Points: 1587
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 2:58pm |
|
Original. I don't have to worry about what's covered up with paint and I can do it right. I question some people definition of restored.
|
|
Sugarmaker
Orange Level
Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Location: Albion PA
Points: 8426
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 3:07pm |
|
Good topic. Boy that's a tough one. We had 4 AC tractors we farmed with. They were original until they needed engine work or something broke. Since most of these tractors are 50 to 60 years old there just aren't many original ones left. But saying that I know a friend that has two 45's that are pretty close to original. I like to see the faded original decals and the locations.
I like both, I have both. But now having restored a couple WD's I like the restored ones due to the fact that all the things work.
Regards,
Chris
|
|
D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
|
|
jaybmiller
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Greensville,Ont
Points: 24337
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 3:36pm |
|
I'd also rather have something 'original' than most people's idea of 'restored'.
Restored to me means using 100% OEM parts be they new or properly refurbished.Paint with base/clear obviously is not 'restored'. Slapping a 10SI alternator ain't quite 'restored' either ! The list is probably endless...
I'd guess that 80% of all 'restored' tractors are better called 'refurbished'.
We all know that a true restored tractor will have cost a LOT of greenbacks in materials and labour !!
Jay
|
|
3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
|
|
Wdtractorman
Orange Level
Joined: 24 Sep 2013
Location: Kentucky
Points: 975
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 3:41pm |
|
Original. There just so many perfectly painted tractors you can look at. Just frx what needs fixing and leave the look. That being said there is some cases where a total restore is the only way to make one looks descent, that usally when some one with pore taste and judgment has fixed one up. I modify things but I go out of the way to make stuff bolt on that way you can take it off easly.
|
|
Dale-OH
Orange Level
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: SW OHIO
Points: 905
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 4:00pm |
This is funny I was thinking this as I was reading some of the comments on the auction prices in another thread. I am like most have said above a firm believer in original is best. But also understand that sometimes you need to restore one, and I have an example below we are starting towards restoring (I use this term but I understand there is a lot of room for debate). This is a 1971 Minneapolis Moline G550 Tractor which is the same as an Oliver 1555. We bought this tractor just like the first picture  The only way to truly know what it was is the serial number  Luckily we were able to get the correct side panels with it  Now for what we will do for the restore, tractor had Hydraulic issues when we bought it and have redone everything hydraulic related, while inside we did an inspection of all rear end gears and bearings, rebuilt the PTO clutches why they were out and replaced the brakes. The next step is to pull the engine for an overhaul, along with the hydra power transmission, clutch replaced, and radiator will be inspected and probably recored. As far as I can tell the only thing we will not have torn apart on the mechanical side is the 6 speed transmission. It sounds good, shifts good and has no leaks, I do not really see the point in opening it up. After we are done with the mechanical side of it we will take it to a man who can properly do the paint and cosmetics side of it. I have seen his work and trust that he will make it look better than new, replace hydraulic and water hoses after paint, rewire electrical system and make it shine again. I know this is a long post to a simple question but to me that is what restore means, but I believe that this tractor being 1 of 24 warrants a correct job.
|
|
Steve in NJ
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Andover, NJ
Points: 11925
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 4:08pm |
|
I like originals also, but around here on the East Coast, you'll never find one in nice original shape. Rusted, & rotted original shape, but not original, original. I like the restored or refurbished Tractors with small upgrades like E.I., & Voltage Regulators on the 6V systems, and Generators converted to 12V, E.I.'s, VR's, and some extra lighting n' accessories. Sometimes an Alternator system. I like a mixture of things. The bestest thing I like is DETAIL whether original or custom modified. Detail to me makes em'...
Steve@B&B
|
|
39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife
|
|
Calvin Schmidt
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Ontario Can.
Points: 4529
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 4:17pm |
|
I'm firmly in the original camp. Have 5 that will never be painted. Also have some that are restored and still used. A repainted tractor should look like it came from the factory and I like a few months worth or wear showing ( a little paint worn off the drawbar, steps, clutch pedal etc). You can only be original once. Shows the history and care of the tractor or car.
|
|
Nothing is impossible if it is properly financed
|
|
kev/ont
Orange Level
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Castleton Ont
Points: 282
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 5:53pm |
|
Original is great but anyone who has "refurbished" a tractor knows exactly what it costs to do them up and detail them. Anymore around here, once you refurbish them they are yours forever. You just wont get your money back. Refurbished antique tracters around here won't sell for anymore than the back tire and paint cost.
|
|
kev/ont
Orange Level
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Castleton Ont
Points: 282
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 5:56pm |
|
I guess my point was i like the originals but really appreciate the refurbished tractors as well. I know first hand the sweat and blood and cash it takes to do them up to show quality.
|
|
Hubnut
Orange Level
Joined: 30 Jul 2014
Location: Gainesville, FL
Points: 1812
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 5:58pm |
|
I like both, but I'm leaning toward original. And, as Chris said, I own both. I am currently doing an overhaul on a B, but not painting anything. Just replacing everything that is worn out to make a nice tractor.
|
|
thunderbird
Silver Level
Joined: 31 May 2010
Location: Iowa
Points: 73
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 6:25pm |
|
I like the originals, Every tractor has a story to tell. Most of the time survivors bring more money at auction.
|
|
JW in MO
Orange Level
Joined: 16 Feb 2010
Location: South KC Area
Points: 2647
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 6:42pm |
|
I have both and it depends on the tractor. I have 1 restored, two in the process but the WD45 that Dad bought new in 54 will probably not be on front side of a paint gun, I like it the way it is.
|
|
Maximum use of available resources!
|
|
Oldoug
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Points: 1131
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 6:44pm |
|
I like original paint tractors. They are only original once. I have more pride in my original paint tractors than my restored ones. If there is a run in the original paint, I can tell a person that is the way it can from the factory...if it's in my paint job...well, it's my fault.
|
|
Matt Folkers
FOLKERS RESTORATION
Restoring vintage things to last so the future can enjoy our past.
|
|
dustinmo
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Auxvasse, MO
Points: 2187
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 7:04pm |
|
I like original, as oldoug said they are only that way once
|
|
acd17toy
Orange Level Access
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: USA
Points: 706
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 8:00pm |
|
Recently I took my wd45d to a show, not pretty but running, there was another wd45d there that was painted up, looked nice and sharp, but I noticed not many looking at it, while mine there was always someone looking it over most of the day.
|
|
DSeries4
Orange Level
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Ontario, Canada
Points: 7433
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 8:08pm |
|
I do appreciate originals as long as they still look good and not all beaten up. IE, straight body panels, decent paint, no rotten fenders, no farmer weld jobs, correct pieces like lights, switches and generators, etc. There are a few tractors in my collection that I plan on keeping original.
However, when I do come across some tractors that are do not meet these criteria, those are ones that I think should be restored (as long as it is done correctly). For my restorations, I go through great lengths to track down missing parts or get existing worn parts brought back to their original state. I go to various junk yards, find NOS, and use my local fabrication and auto body shops to achieve this objective.
While it is a lot of time, work and money to do this, I enjoy making tractors look as good as when they left the factory (or as close as possible).
As mentioned above, you can't make money restoring tractors, but it is not about making money. It is about taking and old and worn out tractor and making it (look and perform) new again. You do it for the love of doing it. That also explains why I do not sell any of the tractors I restore.
As mentioned above, Jay suggests that 80% of "restorations" can be considered as refurbished, I would agree with that statement (probably more than 80). Too many people paint a tractor in 1 day (or week) and call it restored - IMPOSSIBLE!! I am one of the 20% who does a very thorough restoration. None of my projects have taken any less than 1 year. But it is very rewarding when you look at what you started with and the end result.
|
|
'49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '61 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080
|
|
MNLonnie
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Baxter MN
Points: 4791
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 8:32pm |
|
After one of my last purchases disappointed me I want original, can't trust what people claim they did when they "restored" it.
|
|
Waukesha B, B, IB, G, styled WF, D15, 615 backhoe, 2-Oliver OC3's, 4 Ford Model T's, 3 Model A Fords, AV8 Coupe, AV8 Roadster, 1933 Ford Wrecker
|
|
DSeries4
Orange Level
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Ontario, Canada
Points: 7433
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 8:35pm |
 MNLonnie wrote:
After one of my last purchases disappointed me I want original, can't trust what people claim they did when they "restored" it. |
Ditto, I do not buy other people's "restorations". I'd rather do my own.
|
|
'49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '61 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080
|
|
CrestonM
Orange Level
Joined: 08 Sep 2014
Location: Oklahoma
Points: 8447
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 8:48pm |
Calvin Schmidt wrote:
I'm firmly in the original camp. Have 5 that will never be painted. Also have some that are restored and still used. A repainted tractor should look like it came from the factory and I like a few months worth or wear showing ( a little paint worn off the drawbar, steps, clutch pedal etc). You can only be original once. Shows the history and care of the tractor or car. |
Like Calvin and so many others have said, original is best. So many guys now days restore all their tractors, and the number of original tractors is shrinking rapidly. A tractor can be restored an indefinite number of times, but it will only be original ONCE. Once you restore an original tractor, the unique character of the tractor/combine/plow, etc. has been irretrievably lost. Forever. The only reason I painted my Ford 8N was because it was an older restoration.
Edited by CrestonM - 07 Jul 2015 at 8:48pm
|
|
darrel in ND
Orange Level
Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Location: Hebron, ND
Points: 8688
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 9:04pm |
|
I am in the either/or category. Most of my tractors are in original, cept for a few. My D 17 is restored, and I wish I had never touched it, as the guy who shot the paint on it, used persian orange #1, when I had given him strict orders to use #2, as it is a series 2. My D19, I restored myself, except for shooting the paint, and I was happy with how it turned out, but that was 20+ years ago and it's seen a lot of use since then. And my D 15, I bought "kind of" re-stored. It looks good and runs good, but not everything was fixed properly. It'll be a work in progress for as long as I own it. The rest of my fleet will probably never see a paint gun, but I continually fix on all of them to try to keep ahead of major problems. I do have the utmost of respect for the folks who do magnificent restorations, and I could look at shiney paint all day long. Darrel
|
|
ACmowerguy
Orange Level
Joined: 20 Apr 2010
Location: Winfield, MO
Points: 1210
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 9:14pm |
|
Original for me too. The only one's I've stripped bare for paint had already been repainted by someone else. My 23 year old pickup is the same way. It may need to be waxed every 3 to 6 months to keep from turning pink, but I know if it was repainted, I'd have clear peeling off and paint popping two years down the line.
|
|
10 various B-series garden tractors, AC Homesteader8, 416 hydro,710 gt, 914, 916H, 917H, 920D, and many misc attachments
|
|
pa allis
Silver Level
Joined: 23 Feb 2015
Location: Leesport Pa.
Points: 89
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 9:23pm |
|
I like the original paint tractors because you don't have to worry about putting the first scratch on it.
|
|
Mike Plotner
Orange Level
Joined: 02 Apr 2014
Location: Central Ohio
Points: 1577
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 9:35pm |
|
Original all the way, but when I see one restored, I like to see it looking like how it would when it was in its prime, earning its keep for its owners. not 16 coats of clear coat or a big old chrome stack with a bend on it. especially with all the WD-45's out there with the wrong decals on them...
|
|
2001 Gleaner R42, 1978 7060, 1977 7000, 1966 190 XT, 1966 D-17 Series IV and 1952 WD and more keep my farm running!
|
|
JimIA
Orange Level
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Castalia Iowa
Points: 1983
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 9:52pm |
|
Im in the original club as well. I remember looking at a very well known tractor at a show and I had a lot of respect for the owner who was well known and respected in the AC world. I happened to look under the fender to see it was actually all beaten up on the bottom but silky smooth on top, those fenders had to have an extra 20 lbs of bondo on them! You can hide a lot under paint. I still have respect for the owner but was a little disappointed when I saw that.
|
|
An open eye is much more observant than an open mouth
|
|
ILGLEANER
Orange Level Access
Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Willow Hill,ILL
Points: 6448
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 10:21pm |
|
If all these answers are true. Then why do the restored ones bring so much money on auctions ? I like them both, but you don't know any more about originals then you do restored ones. And yes I have both.
IG
|
|
Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated.
|
|
TimNearFortWorth
Orange Level
Joined: 12 Dec 2009
Points: 2014
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 07 Jul 2015 at 10:31pm |
|
I remember well seeing an "all original" mid 50's Chevy pickup about 10 years ago. Quickly became obvious how things get "stretched" as owner was a show car guy and had jumped on the latest bandwagon of relief painting, so it "looked" old and original. He showed me how easy it was to paint over while making it look old and I left there with a different opinion of the rest of his former work on display in his show shop.
Give me original but I am all for current upgrades if it makes the unit more usable, or up to spec on safety. Met a fella recently who purchased a 36 Ford flathead eight pickup in 1960. When he advised his biggest mistake was upgrading it to hydraulic brakes when he bought it and wished he had left it mechanical, I asked him if he thought he would still be alive had it been left mechanical as he purchased it as a daily driver at the time.
To each his own but I will take original any day, vs. what we used to call "a Krylon rebuild" where you have no idea what was done unless you know the fella well . . . . . .
|
|
SHAMELESS
Orange Level
Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: EAST NE
Points: 29486
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 08 Jul 2015 at 12:00am |
|
to use, I like the originals...and can only afford the original look ones! many times I look at my tractors and wish they looked as good as a lot of them on here that have been re-done, but then i'd be afraid i'd scratch them! sooooo....original looks for buying and working, re-furbished for selling!
|
|
Stan IL&TN
Orange Level
Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Elvis Land
Points: 6730
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 08 Jul 2015 at 7:44am |
|
I've seen too many restorations where all they did was paint it. Just love to see fresh paint over grease and dirt. If I'm buying one I want an original. Then I'm going to restore it.
|
|
1957 WD45 dad's first AC
1968 one-seventy
1956 F40 Ferguson
|
|
Don(MO)
Orange Level
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Bates City MO.
Points: 6862
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 08 Jul 2015 at 8:03am |
|
I'm looking at the title and I'm thinking (I know that's how I get in trouble) but here's go's,
"Original" has not repainted & "restored" is not just repainted. Now with that being said, I like both "Original" and "Refitted" the term Restored is used all the time on a repaint and that's just not true to me. I have had lot's of customers have me refit their tractors and them do the paint work them-self and I'm good with this because I don't paint, just wrench them back to good heath so they can go back to field work or go to the paint shop and then on to show work. When I get a family tractor and here the owner said this old gal is done working and is retired, that makes me feel good inside to know it's got a long life ahead of it again, even if it will not see the field again.
|
|
3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep.
|
|
