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Opinions on potential CA purchase |
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elitts ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Jan 2017 Location: Michigan Points: 7 |
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I'm looking for a smallish tractor and this one is available at an auction this weekend. Primary use would be mowing & potentially towing logs. I'm sadly lacking in background knowledge on Allis equipment. The item in question is described as follows:
1953 Allis Chalmers CA (SN: CA255290 gas, narrow front tractor, garage stored for 10 years, non-running, needs battery, electric start, tires are Good, Live Power ("bale clutch"), hydraulic lift. How does it look? What should I be looking for as danger signs of a money pit? What would should I pay if I'm going to get it functional for use? What would you pay if you were going to flip it? What else should I be thinking about that I haven't brought up? Thank-you. ![]() ![]() ![]() |
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MNLonnie ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Baxter MN Points: 4791 |
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Not running you don't know what the transmission is like. Jumping out of gear when it gets wore is fairly common.
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Waukesha B, B, IB, G, styled WF, D15, 615 backhoe, 2-Oliver OC3's, 4 Ford Model T's, 3 Model A Fords, AV8 Coupe, AV8 Roadster, 1933 Ford Wrecker
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TimNearFortWorth ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Dec 2009 Points: 2014 |
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That s/n has too may digits, even for a later unit as 1958 s/n's did not even go that high (last year made). Look near the shifter for the number. Later unit for sure as dist. vs. mag and also snap coupler vs. earlier pin hitch although pin hitch tractors could be converted to the snap coupler with a kit from the dealer. Word of caution if "skidding" logs as you can get in a bind in a big dog hurry if a log digs in and the front end comes up. Especially in hilly ground as the narrow front is not as stable as the wide front units.
CA is impressive for 2800-2900# without ballast and the 125 engine is one tough little powerplant. If in good working order and you also get the complete drawbar assembly, 1500-3000.00 depending on area and condition . . . . |
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Gary Burnett ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Virginia Points: 3010 |
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Once the front end comes off the ground I can't see what difference it would make what kind of front end it had.CA is about as stable of a small tractor as can be found. |
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LeonR2013 ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 01 Jan 2013 Location: Fulton, Mo Points: 3500 |
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I wonder why it has been sitting for 10 years. There could be something wrong that was beyond the PO ability to fix, so be cautious how much you put in it. Other than that really good tires are a plus and a good steam bath and it would look pretty doggone good. If it can't get started or is stuck probably really the low end in value. But it could be made into a nice one.
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Dick L ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Edon Ohio Points: 5087 |
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Nice tractor. I have bought three CA's. A tip if you get it. You can use a C drawbar with the mower in the pictures mounted. It is hard to tell the engine condition or the cost of getting it usable when not running when you buy it. Being inside is a plus. It (might) be a bargain. I bought the one that was not running and person I bought it from had worked for a year trying to get it to run. I winched it on the trailer and after setting the timing drove it off the trailer at home.
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elitts ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Jan 2017 Location: Michigan Points: 7 |
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I guess thats kind of my final issue. Its not running, so ive got not guarantee on repair costs. So if it was something you were considering, what price is low enough to warrant the gamble.
Or, what is the parts value of if, should repair be prohibitively expensive. |
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85678 |
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If it had a major problem, I would not have keep it inside for 10 years... Im guessing the old man didn't have the time and let it set... Now the kids are selling it... If you can get it for under $800. I would do it... (if tires are good)... it might be worth twice that with a tune up.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Gary Burnett ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Virginia Points: 3010 |
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I see one for sale looks pretty original,good tires,rear wheel weights,JD mower
$1500/obo. |
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JayIN ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 18 Dec 2009 Location: SE/IN Points: 1982 |
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Im in the $800 ballpark, too. Let us know how this turns out!
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sometimes I walk out to my shop and look around and think "Who's the idiot that owns this place?"
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ac720nut ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 09 Feb 2016 Location: Dexter Mi Points: 1217 |
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Bought one couple years back southern Indiana with trip loader for $1000 running very nice condition. Just my $.02
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Ted J ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 05 Jul 2010 Location: La Crosse, WI Points: 18923 |
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My first thought was also $800, give or take $100.
They are a GREAT little tractor and I wish I had one! Looks like the front drag link is disconnected.?? IF you find a crank and can turn it over......the engine might be locked up. If it turns easily, it will run with little problem! You'd want to check to see if it is stuck, and also so you don't bend any push rods. Looks like the drawbar is sitting on the rear, but the cradle is missing? It has the lift arm latches......most are missing and getting harder to find. Looks like it had/has a belly mower on it. Some of the pieces are laying there. That would be nice!! |
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"Allis-Express"
19?? WC / 1941 C / 1952 CA / 1956 WD45 / 1957 WD45 / 1958 D-17 |
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jaybmiller ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Greensville,Ont Points: 24352 |
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I wouldn't go above $500 as it's a 'non runner'. Looks are deceiving...rad may be shot, no brakes, engine siezed, clutches gone, no hydralics....the list can be endless. The '$800' deal could cost you $4000+ in the end...
I did own one though, great little tractor.. One thing not mentioned... dreaded AUCTION FEES and TAXES ! Up here 'they' tack on 15% buyers premiums, loading fees,CC transaction fee(3%), other 'fees' AND then 13% on top of all that. You 'think' you got a deal until 'they' say $1000 please for a 500$ 'deal'. So, please, be SURE to read the fine print.... Jay |
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor) Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water |
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Brian F(IL) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Paxton, IL Points: 2705 |
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Was probably a worker it it's day. The front end appears to have the cultivator mounting bracket. Also, has supports on either side of the engine that could either be cultivator supports or for a loader. The bracket lying on the ground is a Woods mower mounting bracket. The mower can be seen to the right of the tractor in the third picture.
I've got a 1952 CA and they are a good tractor. Can't tell you how much to bid on this one though.
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knkrein1 ![]() Bronze Level Access ![]() Joined: 02 Aug 2016 Location: Gregory, Mich. Points: 73 |
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Were is the action at in Michigan? ken
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Ken R.
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GregLawlerMinn ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Lawler, Mn Points: 1226 |
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Ditto on how useful/powerful a decent running CA is. It, coupled with a Woods mower is a great setup for mowing grass. You are starting out with an unknown, so be prepared for costs and time to get it running right. The tin and paint look good and the lack of oil/grease buildup around the machine is a good sign. It needs to be a runner to properly assess what repairs are needed. Quite likely, it will need brakes, ignition tune up, fuel system work, and fluid changes. You could also run into engine, tranny, pto, hydraulic, hand clutch, radiator and seal repairs. These are very easy machines to work on and most parts are readily available. $500 is about right for an unknown and will allow you to budget another $500-$1,000 to get it running right. If the plan is to flip it, you will probably be disappointed in your "profits" and "wages" for your time to fix it up.
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What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers.
Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2. With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC |
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NICKMI ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 15 Sep 2009 Location: Greenville Points: 534 |
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Auction is in Lowell mi auctioneer is merrit auction service they do have a website says it comes with a two bottom sc plow full set of cultivators and that woods mower
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Dick L ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Edon Ohio Points: 5087 |
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If I was going to the auction and the mower as well as equipment was on a one bid deal I would be in 1200.00 easy. 600 for the mower alone would not be out of line. The plow and cultivators would probly be worth 50 bucks each at an auction as a guide. That is how I would add things up to set how high I would go to buy it. If the plow points look like new and the coulters looked good I would add a few dollars.
With the condition being better than average I might go to 1500.00. I won't be there but my twin thinking fellow might. In my opinion if it goes complete for less than 1200.00 it would be a real deal. |
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elitts ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Jan 2017 Location: Michigan Points: 7 |
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Yeah, I saw the mower on the auction listing, but it was on its own line. Usually when i see that it means they are going to run them separately, which means much more expensive.
Well, I will see how it goes. Auctions around here this year have been weird for tractors (maybe everywhere) with people paying ridiculous premiums for equipment that will obviously need total overhauls, so I dont get my hopes up. Plus it's supposed to be disgustingly nice this weekend, so it'll be a big crowd. In the end, its really more tractor then i need, so i wont be heartbroken. An older 10-15hp GT is all I was looking for when I saw this one. |
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Dan73 ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 04 Jun 2015 Location: United States Points: 6054 |
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I would say 500 you see B and CA tractors here on Craigslist running for about $1000 to 1500 and they just sit there the same add shows up 6 months later. Been that way for about 2 years.
If you are interested in a garden tractor I would look hard at the case ingersoll 400 or 4000 serries. The 400 are older. I have a few of them they good thing about them is that the motor has the typical belt pullie on the front for the mower deck or snow blower but it has a hydraulic pump on the back of the motor. The tractor is really a portable hydraulic system. Hydraulic motor in the rearend hydraulic lift for the implements and you can add a remote valve for a wood splitter or other stuff. I put a Chinese 10 hp diesel as a repower in one. That is the good thing about the case ingersoll you can repower them easy and small gas or diesel motors are cheap. Just my 2 cents. |
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Bill Long ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Bel Air, MD Points: 4556 |
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As you know I am a real fan of the CA. It is a peppy, great plowing, easy to handle tractor. That said it has been sitting under cover for 10 years. Does the engine turn over? If not forget it.
I would look at the oil. Is it clean and filled. Any leaks around the tractor. To me when trading in a CA we always looked at the hand clutch. It is operational. If not MONEY How about the transmission? Slipping out of third gear? MONEY You won't get any answers on these questions till you buy it. Therefore, you have to lower your buying price. Too many unknowns. I have to agree with $ 800 even less. Nice looking tractor though. It shows it has been kept inside. Let me wish you the best of luck. Be sure to let us know how it goes. Good Luck! Bill Long Edited by Bill Long - 17 Jan 2017 at 9:29pm |
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B26240 ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 21 Nov 2009 Location: mn Points: 3860 |
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I'm with the $800 crowd, non running is non running. As far as making money flipping it that is not likely even if you get it running with little effort. Guy up here is trying that with Farmalls and has a row of about six of them most been there a couple years now. If however you are like some of us who are willing to work on a tractor as a hobby and "forget" how much you spend on the parts the CA will end up to be a nice little tractor. I currently have a tractor of a different color that I bought as a non runner for $750 and now have about $5000 in it but compared to what $5k would buy new now days I am ahead as I see it and had fun working on it to get it to this condition.
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Gary Burnett ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Virginia Points: 3010 |
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Very true big difference in buying a tractor to keep and use and buying one to sell. Also makes a big difference to me if I 'like' the tractor or not and have a use for it.On that CA if it checks out as good as it looks I might push the price up a little since I like CA's and could use another one around the farm. |
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Lon(MN) ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Merrill Wi Points: 2001 |
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Last year I had a wide front CA for sale in very nice condition. New wiring, radiator,gauges, battery box and many other items. I asked $2200.00 for it and had no inquires. Someone wanted the rear wheels so I parted out. My point is It's a $2000.00 tractor in good condition if you were to try and sell it. I value the tractor your looking at more in the $400 range. The plus is it has snap coupler if the hitch is there. Rims and tires are the big $ items.
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elitts ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Jan 2017 Location: Michigan Points: 7 |
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Thank-you everyone for the input. I think I'll write off the CA as a viable option at this point, unless it's ridiculously cheap; which I expect it won't be if there are a couple people from here attending the auction.
@Dan73 - Thank-you for the suggestion, the Case Ingersoll 400 is much closer to what I was originally intending to look for. I've also been told that the MTD 990 is a good option. Just to give an indication of the desperate straights I'm in, I'm currently mowing the 3/4 acre lawn on a Huskee/Murray 8hp rear engine riding mower. When I first moved into my house, $25 plus a new battery was almost exactly the right price. Now it's time for a grownup machine. |
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Dan73 ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 04 Jun 2015 Location: United States Points: 6054 |
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If you go the case ingersoll route just expect to have a repower in your future. If you can find one with a Kohler motor they are really nice the onan motors are just not worth rebuilding I have 4 and one one still runs. But the case ingersoll is easy to repower.
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DennisA (IL) ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Ridott IL. Points: 2064 |
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Thanks & God Bless
Dennis |
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elitts ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Jan 2017 Location: Michigan Points: 7 |
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Oh! And if anyone from here is going to this auction. Feel free to say hello. I'll be the heavy bearded guy in a mid-length black coat that says "City of Portland" on the front.
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NICKMI ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 15 Sep 2009 Location: Greenville Points: 534 |
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What did the tractor and attachments go for ?
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elitts ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Jan 2017 Location: Michigan Points: 7 |
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Tractor ended up going for $900, not running with declared carburetor problems. Was purchased by Granddaughter of owner. I talked to her afterwards and she told me had intended to buy the tractor at pretty much any price.
The working Cub Cadet 1554 with 250ish hours on it went for $700, which makes me wish I'd stayed during that part of the sale. Instead, I went to get a truck so I could take home the table saw I bought. I picked up a Craftsman 103.xxx 8" saw on a stand for $30. The top was rusted, but with no pits, cast iron web table extensions on both sides, with the fence and miter gauge. |
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