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Morten.have 
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Joined: 16 Oct 2017
Location: Denmark
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 Topic: Leaking exhaust valve HD16DC
Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 12:34pm |
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Hello today I discovered a sad failure on my 16’ it have a oil leak on the number one exhaust valve. And I surely know how to fix it the right way but I don’t have the time. Are any of you in knowledge of a shortcut or a temporary way to fix it without removing the cylinder head. I have newer used a can mechanic product before but I’m ready now... I think
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jerbob
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Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 5:34pm |
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That sucks Miorten. My knowledge is limited on the internals. I believe I have a leaking exhaust valve as well but not significant. Some oil wetness under the manifold.
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HD16DC, Bobcat 863 Turbo, Oliver 1855, John Deere 855,
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DMiller
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Location: Hermann, Mo
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Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 6:09pm |
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Oil coming out a exhaust port is usually not a leaking valve but rings failing to seat and oil being bypassed around the piston.
The standard I am using is the training I received in 1976 on Cummins engines, we would take the manifolds down, run an older engine at high idle and inspect the top of the exhaust ports for oil migration, that told us which cylinder was using or throwing oil, bad rings or bad piston or both.
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SteveM C/IL
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Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 9:08pm |
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Agree it's not a valve problem.Dose the oil with Seafoam and see what happens.If a broken ring,not gonna help. If stuck rings,you may fix it!
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jerbob
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 5:50am |
 DMiller wrote:
Oil coming out a exhaust port is usually not a leaking valve but rings failing to seat and oil being bypassed around the piston.
The standard I am using is the training I received in 1976 on Cummins engines, we would take the manifolds down, run an older engine at high idle and inspect the top of the exhaust ports for oil migration, that told us which cylinder was using or throwing oil, bad rings or bad piston or both. |
That makes me feel a little better DMiller. I wasn’t planning on doing anything as tractor runs strong, smokes very little, oil consumption good. Does the sea foam trick work for stuck rings! Do you have to dump oil after use? Thank you again.
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HD16DC, Bobcat 863 Turbo, Oliver 1855, John Deere 855,
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DMiller
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 6:26am |
SteveM C/IL wrote:
Agree it's not a valve problem.Dose the oil with Seafoam and see what happens.If a broken ring,not gonna help. If stuck rings,you may fix it! |
Would also try that first. A glazed cylinder wall, weak rings will do this if the engine is not working hard, that is about the least one can expect.
Edited by DMiller - 13 Nov 2018 at 6:27am
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jerbob
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 7:14am |
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Thank you D
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JohnCO
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 11:41am |
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Hey Morten, sorry you have problems, glad you are back! Since the crawler was taking an extended vacation, while you were resting, perhaps the rings did get stuck. The Seafoam shouldn't hurt your oil but if you know which cylinder it is that has the problem, you could pull that injector and pour enough in the hole to cover the piston. It would soak down around the rings and hopefully free them up. My 2 cents worth...
Edited by JohnCO - 13 Nov 2018 at 11:44am
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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Morten.have
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 12:27pm |
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Hello John it’s the best idea to date! I have the exhaust manifold removed so I can turn over the engine and poor it down that way. I hope it can free the rings.
I have talked to some people over here and they suggested me to poor a half bottle 1/2 liters of sparkling water directly in the intake with the engine in hi idle. I’m personally think it’s a little bit drastic, but they say it’ will work.
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DMiller
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 2:09pm |
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Don't use much. will take forever to burn off when running again. Another cheat for worn engines was to sprinkle a VERY LIMITED amount of scrubbing powder DRY into the intake. Was called the Bon Ami (Old US Cleanser) trick, comet does the same but as a reminder we wiped out a demonstrator engine on a dyno at power with a REAL Tablespoon filled with floor sweepings at a shop I worked. With engine at rated power we sprinkled in the dirt and watched HP die off, One full spoonful ATE that Cummins 855 alive.
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Ian Beale
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 3:26pm |
IIRC you used to be able get an additive for glazing which, added to the fuel, produced a mild abrasive when it burnt.
Sounds a bit odd if glazing that it is only one cylinder?
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jerbob
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 4:03pm |
Reason I love this forum is the diverse questions and solutions or ideas. I never heard of scouring powder to de glaze cylinder linings. Makes sense but never heard of that. Of course I never would have tried to seat a bead on a skidsteer tire using ether until I saw it. Worked. AND i still will never do it. Looked dangerous as hell. Farmer showed me. I noticed he had no eyebrows, missing a few fingers and walked with a limp. That told me everything I needed to know about the old tricks book he was reading. hahahahahah Good luck Morten. You are in great hands. 
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Morten.have
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 4:44pm |
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Its all good tricks but i dont know witch to use. They are all good in some way.
It’s a shame it’s not a CAT if it’s was a D9 I could rip the piston down in less than a hour. And change the rings the as they probably should. And if it was the valve oil seal I could replaced it without removing the cylinder head. But it looks like a big job on this old Allis. So I’m afraid that have chooses the easy way..
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jerbob
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 4:57pm |
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Ya know Morten, I’m surprised you didn’t think of this,,, what your girl needs is a coat of Persian Orange. Would fix it right up!
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Ian Beale
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 6:07pm |
"I never heard of scouring powder to de glaze cylinder linings. Makes sense but never heard of that. "
Bon Ami seemed to be standard practice with rebuilding Cat engines in the 1960's here - which is about when I heard it first. IIRC the first oil change was about 10 hours too.
I guess the fuel additive was less subject to the size of the handfulls
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DiyDave
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 6:23pm |
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Heard of the bon ami thing, but never had reason to try it... Another one I have tried, with some positive effects, on the small gassers that I run, is to put 1 qt to 4, dextron 3 atf, to scrub the glaze offa the cyls... Add the atf, and work it hard, a coupla days, then change back to reg motor oil...
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DMiller
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 7:02pm |
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Can see that too Dave, just a little leery on either method on a older potentially close to age related failures beast.
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DaveKamp
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 7:28pm |
jerbob wrote:
I never would have tried to seat a bead on a skidsteer tire using ether until I saw it. Worked. AND i still will never do it. Looked dangerous as hell. |
And nobody should... because the fire which causes the tire to expand into that rim, stops burning for one of two reasons- first is that the fuel (ether) is completely consumed, or the oxygen level falls too low to support combustion. Of course, the tire's bead will initially seat, and then the next step, is to put more air in the tire to fully seat it and bring it up to operating pressure... and in doing so, you add a bunch of oxygen, at high pressure... which mixes with whatever Ether happens to still be present in the tire.
Fuel, oxygen, compression... all you need... is a source of ignition.
There's an old woman in a small town in south central Iowa who's missing the lower half of her arm. When she last had her hand, she was 29, holding the hand of her young daughter as they walked to the store. That young daughter's last portrait, was her silhouette, holding her mother's hand, splattered against the cement block wall of the town grocery store, when a dumptruck's tire exploded. My father's client was cleared of liability, and every other truck in that city's fleet was stripped of wheels and tires, replaced with new, because every one of them was found to have ether inside.
Anyone who does this stunt, has absolutely no grasp of physics.
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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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SteveM C/IL
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Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 7:46pm |
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You are absolutely correct Dave! The ether trick sounds fine up front but nobody tells and often don't know the rest of the story.
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jerbob
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Posted: 14 Nov 2018 at 5:51am |
SteveM C/IL wrote:
You are absolutely correct Dave! The ether trick sounds fine up front but nobody tells and often don't know the rest of the story. |
Gotta say I wouldn’t have believed it till I saw the old guy do it. I’ve done some things that afterwards seemed foolish or even reckless,,but this stunt had disaster written all over it.
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CAL(KS)
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Posted: 14 Nov 2018 at 7:22am |
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Morten, I will have to agree here its not likely your exhaust valve. Worst case scenerio, rings, sleeves and head gaskets are available. When i acquired my 16 it was an oil drinker, and when i overhauled the engine some of the rings were worn over 3/4 original thickness! If it were mine i would certainly try the stuck ring suggestions first.
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Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20
Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15
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