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I Need Backhoe I.D. Help! (

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Peaceful Farmer View Drop Down
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    Posted: 06 Aug 2017 at 5:22pm
Hi!

I have a backhoe attachment. I think it's an Allis Chalmers/Henry backhoe something! But what model is it? I'm stumped! I thought it was a Henry Mark IV. Then I found a Henry Mark V which looks similar! In my research I discovered Allis Chalmers bought the Henry Backhoe company. 

I bought this attachment in Missouri for $800.00. It's a heavy, impressive piece of equipment! I have an M Series Kubota, 48 horse tractor, with Loader Subframe extending clear to the back axle. My tractor rear axle is rated in the operation manuel at 3,700 lbs... How heavy is this backhoe attachment? Can I fabricate a subframe system, and restore this backhoe  to use with my Kubota M4050DT?

This backhoe looks at face value to be an Allis/Henry Mark IV or Mark 5, but if you look at the photos I've posted closesly, you will see two swing cylinders, which are connected to the boom by a chain. Every Google photo I've come across, has not shown me an Allis with these particular swing cylinders.

My goal here, get an accurate weight figure, and close of enough year and model to purchase an operations manuel. AS the Equipment I.D. tag was ripped off, it's have been difficult creating a game plan to make this a useable piece of equipment.

Thanks for reading!




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DiyDave View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Aug 2017 at 5:56pm
You will first need to compare specs of the tractor the hoe comes off of, and then the specs of your Kubota, before trying it out... specs I am talking about are flow rate (GPM) and relief pressure(PSI).  Then you want to make sure both operating systems are the same type.(open or closed center, are your options, here.  Sorry but I'm not much of an expert at IDing AC backhoes, at least not without a tractor attached to 'em...Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peaceful Farmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Aug 2017 at 6:06pm
DIY Dave,

Thanks for the input! And yes that is part of my quest, to get the right info so I know what will make this backhoe compatable.

Thanks again! If anything particular about that BH tickles your fancy, as odd as it may sound, feel free to tell me!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peaceful Farmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Aug 2017 at 8:43pm
Hey! Good news! A fella on this forum, posted his progress on restoring a D14 Backhoe/Loader

The backhoe is very similar to mine... I still cannot account for those darned swing cylinders on my unit, but everything else is the same. 

Here is the link, if it will give people any ideas, please give me a shout!

http://www.allischalmers.com/forum/rebuilding-the-d14-backhoe-loader_topic110381_page9.html
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DiyDave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2017 at 4:49am
If its a hoe off a D-14, Hyd pressure is 3500 PSI, GPM output is about 4GPM...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lonn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2017 at 8:07am
I'd bet that if it's off a D14 the D14 would have had the auxiliary hydraulic, low pressure high volume pump.
-- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... -
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2017 at 11:51am
Doesn't match my Long 1099. I first used the Long on my MF-135 with the PTO pump that came with it a 20 gpm pump. Required very tender touches on the hydraulic valves to not bang the ends of the cylinders every stroke. It was hard to control. I think mostly 3" cylinders. After the leaking PTO pump was stolen one foggy winter night, I mounted a 5 gpm front mount pump on the MF-135 and operation was fast enough at full valve strokes but a lot easier to control. When I changed its use to my 4020 I built an auxiliary hydraulic manifold tapping the full pressure and flow but I put flow control needle valves on the pressure lines to the loader and to the back hoe and set them for about 5 gpm, kept control smooth and hydraulic motions not jerky.



Gerald J.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peaceful Farmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2017 at 10:55pm
Lon, and Gerald J.

Thanks for your input! I'm keeping track of what you'all say... I'm actually taking notes! One never knows when one might need to remember good advice given!

Thanks much for our comments!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peaceful Farmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2017 at 11:02pm
P.S.!

Anybody know the weight of this Mark IV unit? I'm pretty sure it's a Mark IV.

Also, I discovered the Mark IV unit was also compatable with the D-15 and D17 AC tractors.
Were the hydrolics on the D-15 and D-17 similar to the D-14?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 4:22am

  Hey Peaceful,,,,,,Lordy,,Lordy,,,,Thas my backhoe/ Loader project you are referring  to,,,,Gosh,,that brings back lots of memories of all the work I done to bring it back to life,,,ClapClap I only see two pics but sure looks like a Mark IV backhoe. The tag on mine is on the flat part right in front of the hydraulic selector valve. I cannot see the two cylinders you talkin bout on the swing. I can see the Rotary Swing Cylinder in the second pic, but not the 2 cylinders you talk bout. That "T" shaped pin on the outrigger sure looks like mine. The hoe looks to be fairly clean and I'll tell you that overhaulin thet big ole  Rotary Swing Cylinder is an absolute BEAR to get done,,,!!!,,,BUT it CAN get done,,,,,
 I don't have a clue what the loader weighs, so no help for you there,,,,Good luck with your project, tho,, if you decide it will work on your tractor,,,,,Clap
  I'll be glad to help if I can,,,,,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peaceful Farmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 12:14pm
DesertJoe,

Thanks much!  I may post a few more pictures. My first experience posting pictures on this forum was educational! The little Icon would come and and say, "Please wait patiently" for the photo to upload. Not understanding, I first tried to upload 7 photos... No worky!

I'm in Southeast Madison County, nearly the southeast corner of northwest Arkansas. In short, I live in the mountainous boonies of Northwest Arkansas and love it! But my DSL internet provider is slow to say the least.

The backhoe weight is going to be the deal breaker for if I use it on the Kabota. Otherwise I'll probably sell the Mark IV.

It's amazing how Google can have so much info, but they don't seem to have an Allis Chalmers/Henry Mark IV backhoe attachment weight figure.

I guess nobody is perfect....


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peaceful Farmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 12:23pm
Here are a couple of more photos describing my cylinder situation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 9:44pm

Hey Peaceful,,,yep,,that sure looks like a mark IV,,I think I can see the tag in the pic with the horse trailer. It is right in the middle of the plate where the two cylinders are,,,
Speakin bout the cylinders,,I'm not too sure they are "Factory" Looks like PO rigged up a "chain Tong" type of swing using the two cylinders with a chain,,,?
I just LOVE American engineuity,,,don't you,,??
I can also see the Big Rotary cylinder that operates the swing on my Mark IV.
I think I "may" have a manual on the Mark IV,,,I'll take a look see tomarrow,,,,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 9:57pm

OH,,forgot to mention ,,Peaceful, a dang good friend of mine and all us others here lives in your neck of the woods,,,somewhere around Eureka Springs, Ark. Ole Thad posts here most of the times when he ain't workin his tail off,,,,,he's also a member in good standin of the " Misfits" Club,,,you'll hear bout all them dudes sooner or late,,,,
Wait til you get to know ole Shameless,,,,,, ,,,,and,,,,and,,,don't believe everything they tell you bout me either,,,,
OH,,,and welcome to the best'est site on the web,,,,,hope you stay around a while,,,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote im4racin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2017 at 10:13pm
Yes that is a mark IV. I have one and it has the same swing cyls and chain set up. I know I have a manual somewhere but can't find it tonight. I will keep looking and report back when I find it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peaceful Farmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2017 at 8:43pm
Desertjoe,

Yes I've been wondering about those chains and swing cylinders too! Both chains seem to anchor into the tower as if the original manufacturer intended it. But the place where the plate was cut to allow both those swing cylinders access to the tower, was not cut very smooth and round. So I suspect somebody got creative with their problem solving!

About your friend!
I'm about 1 hour and 20 minutes south of Eureaka Springs! We fish for trout occasionally up by the dam near Eureka. It's good to hear that I have potential kinfolk, (or good people whom I'd wish for kinfolk) whom are friends of you'all!

Actually I'm a Los Fresnos Texas farm kid, I was born in the Harlingen Texas hospital, I grew up watching brown and white skin walk on sidewalks together and think it's normal. Some of my earlietst memories is watching a John Deere pull the irrigation ditches I later would swim in.  I'm mostly white myself, but I'm 1 part Abenaki Indian, 1 part Iriquois Indian. I sympathise with the Mexican's wanting to come here, but as my Native American forefathers insisted (but lost the argument) , everybody needs to be legal and do their part.

And occasonally a T-Model Bugle needs to sound to get peoples attention... I don't know if the sound will do much good, or bring much order but I won't object either... I'm trying to learn to keep it peaceful...Not get distracted from what is really important.

For myself, if I could just get the weight rating on that A.C. backhoe... I've been thinking about buying a manuel, but to spend roughly 30 bucks to find out the unit is to heavy for my tractor would be a real bummer!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Peaceful Farmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Aug 2017 at 8:50pm
Im4racin,

I just reread your comment and it finally registered that you said your backhoe chains and swing cylinder is made the same as mine! Thank you! I feel better!

If you find that manuel, that would be great! I don't even know for sure where to begin looking, or what to request, to be sure I get the right manuel.

Mark IV is as far as I've come!

Thanks for the info!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dusty MI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Aug 2017 at 11:17am
I'd like to find one that fits a 720.

Dusty
917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote im4racin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Aug 2017 at 9:31am
I need to correct my last post....it looks like a mark 1 not a 4. My manual says it has a shipping weight of about 2725 lbs and requires 15 gpm at 2000psi max. If you have any other questions I can look in the manual for that info
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oc-46-3g Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jun 2021 at 12:14pm
I just purchased a Henry Mark 1, and I can confirm it looks the same as in pics.  Can anyone tell me what model OC-352 was used on?  I'm assuming Oliver Crawler from the OC but that is just a guess.  Very hard to locate info on these.. BTW, mine is for sale in Central NY.
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