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TBI for GMC 454

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desertjoe View Drop Down
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Joined: 23 Sep 2013
Location: New mexico
Points: 13700
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: TBI for GMC 454
    Posted: 8 hours 42 minutes ago at 10:09pm
 Howdy,,,,Wink 
   Now, I know there is a classified section here,,,being that I been a member for several yearsbut I noticed the heading  to include  "Trucks" so,,I thought,,,maybe I can slip this one in without getting blackballed,,,is that even a word,,,,??Wink
 Anyway,,I am need of a  TBI type carb for my 1988 GMC 3500 with the 454 engine and automatic. The unit it came with was so erratic, so I got a gasket set but did not help at all. It tends to surge and die out with a rough idle.
 Anyone got any fresh ideas or maybe a magic wand in rear pocket,,,,???
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DaveKamp View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Location: LeClaire, Ia
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveKamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 5 hours 16 minutes ago at 1:35am
The item you're looking for is the Rochester TBI-220.  It appeared on everything from the 4.3L V6 up to the 454, with the difference between all, being the injector size.  Off the top of my head, I believe the injectors fitted were something like 28lbs/hr in the 4.3, the 305 were 32, the 350 was 40, and the 454 were 45lbs/hr.  fuel pressure was either 12 or 15psi on these units.

But wait, Dave... how could they use the same throttle body- that'd be way too big for the little six, or way too small for the big V8...

Yeah, but no.   It's possible for the throttle bore to be too small for the 454, but in a throttle body or injection system, there is no circumstance where having too LARGE a bore will cause the problems commonly associated with 'overcarbeuration', because the throttle body's function is simply to limit the amount of airflow INTO the manifold.  Fuel metering is not done by a venturi, it's simply a throttle plate... the fuel volume is managed by the ECM (in yours, it's referred to as '7747')  based on manifold absolute pressure (MAP), throttle position sensor position, crankshaft RPM, coolant temperature, and (when in closed-loop mode) the 02 sensor.

Now, there's a device on it called an IAC... an Idle Air Control valve.  It is a stepper motor with a leadscrew and a plunger on it.  The plunger moves in and out... opening or closing off a passage that bypasses the throttle plates.  When running at idle the throttle plates will be fully closed off (there's no 'idle stop'), the idle bypass circuit, the IAC plunger, and motor bypass whatever air is necessary to maintain proper idle.

Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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DaveKamp View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveKamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 4 hours 32 minutes ago at 2:19am
Now, the IAC motor is controlled by the 7747 ECM by looking at all the sensors, and a few other things (the park/neutral switch, the AC compressor clutch status, etc), and deciding wether the idle speed is 'below' or 'above' the target idle RPM.

So the IAC motor/plunger MAY have something to do with your idle instability, BUT...
It may also be a case that your ECM is getting incorrect readings from any of the sensors... OR...

The ignition system (which was called the Delco EST-HEI) used a really slick ignition module in the distributor base that, instead of a mechanical advance, the BASE advance curve is built into the electronic module, so if the ECM is NOT connected, it will run beautifully under the base curve.  IF the ECM is connected, the 7747 will send 'alterations' to the distributor module, and change the timing THAT way.

The reason why I'm pointing this out, is because that module, or something ABOUT it, can cause your idle to be bad.

There's also a sensor board that connects to the ECM's distributor signals, and allows the KNOCK SENSOR to arbitrarily retard ignition when it 'hears' knocks.  A failure of this module, or a lack of a good sensor will cause the module to crank back the ignition timing for no apparent reason.
Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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desertjoe View Drop Down
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Joined: 23 Sep 2013
Location: New mexico
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote desertjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 2 hours 5 minutes ago at 4:46am
 My Friend, Dave Kamp,,,,Clap,,,,It good to hear from youse!!  Many THANKS for responding!!
  Altho,,,,Ahem,,,altho,,,,I say this with a generous amount of depredations at the apparent amount of possibilities of even one little thingie being the culprit amongst all the possibilities this system has that can be the bad boy ,,,,,? My memoriy has been joggled to bring back many tales of other TBI owners being exasperated with the system,,,,,
 My question is this,,,,With the correct distributor,,,UM,,,"pre-computor",,,an adapter plate for the manifold, that will accept a simple Holly of 750 CFM or even a (gasp) AFB,,I believe Edelbrock markets them old AFB's now a days,,,would this "modification" give a fellar a lot less headache with it's simplicity,,,???
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DMiller View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DMiller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 1 hour 44 minutes ago at 5:07am
One issue not presented, is aluminum is Porous, the Manufacturers Seal Coated TBI Units when made, that as much as with Aluminum Wheels erodes and deteriorates over time.  What end up with is a vacuum leak that cannot be controlled or countered, worst effect was when as a mechanic we used Carb Cleaner spray to remove buildup of carbon and dirt from these in the mid 80s, WE destroyed said coatings and caused as much problem.  There is NO Repair for these Factory applied Coatings, the older TBI units have issues with Idle Speed Control even with all new installed components.

Holley makes TBI replacement units, if look into these or the reman units currently out there they are either Painted or otherwise Coated to prevent Vacuum leaks.
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im4racin View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Jun 2017
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote im4racin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 54 minutes ago at 5:57am
1st is we need to figure out what intake you have. From there you have options. 
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