| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
shameless dude 
Orange Level
Joined: 10 Apr 2017
Location: east NE
Points: 13611
|
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote  Reply
 Topic: MFWA
Posted: 21 Mar 2023 at 5:53pm |
|
not being up on the MFWA tractors, how much more does the MFWA make the tractor pull more than the ones without it? like do they act like they pull more than the HP they are rated at? kinda hard to explain what i'm asking
|
 |
|
Sponsored Links
|
|
|
Unit3
Orange Level
Joined: 17 Oct 2009
Location: NC Iowa
Points: 5497
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 21 Mar 2023 at 7:02pm |
|
I always felt that the front wheel assist never allowed you to pull a bigger load, but rather to pull the same load better. When pulling a field, cultivator or disc, it always felt like you were trying to climb out of a hole in 2WD. In 4WD, the tractor leveled out and pulled better. Clear as mud right?
|
|
2-8070FWA PS/8050PS/7080/7045PS/200/D15-II/2-WD45/WD/3-WC/UC/C
|
|
Ron(AB)
Orange Level
Joined: 27 Dec 2009
Location: Alberta
Points: 943
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 21 Mar 2023 at 7:56pm |
|
In general, 20-30 percent more in tough conditions.
Like: mud, hills, wet grass or dry clods that are rough as marbles, etc. and don't forget Snow!
We sold all of our snow chains thanks to mfwd.
|
|
405, 7000, 7050, 8050, 8070, L3, 2300 & 2600 disk
|
|
SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Shelbyville IL
Points: 7981
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 21 Mar 2023 at 9:46pm |
Only experience...used a neighbors Deutz Allis 150hp FWA pulling his 4 shank Landoll Weather Proofer. He told me to shut off FWA on ends to turn shorter. Almost done when next pass the FWA (electric control) wouldn't turn on again. When tool went in ground it stopped me instantly and dug holes with the rears. I had to raise tool a LOT to finish up. Point is...it worked ground deeper with FWA working and didn't pull any harder.
I would suggest pulling equipment sized for the 2wd version and pull it effortlessly with FWD engaged. I had used that Weather Proofer behind my 220 before and it was a load with 20 more hp.
Edited by SteveM C/IL - 21 Mar 2023 at 9:53pm
|
|
darrel in ND
Orange Level
Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Location: Hebron, ND
Points: 8580
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 22 Mar 2023 at 8:50am |
|
When I first moved down to the farm I'm on, we pulled a 24 foot concord with a 5288 IH two wheel drive tractor. It had a digital speedometer, so I knew how fast I was supposedly going, not accounting for wheel slippage, but knowing that there was some. When I started pulling it with my 8070 FWA, by the speed chart, I would have been pulling it almost one MPH slower, but yet at the end of the day, acres per hour were the same. So yeah, not a real scientific comparison, but enough to show me that there was considerably more wheel slippage with the 2wd than the front wheel assist.
Darrel
|
|
Tbone95
Orange Level Access
Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Location: Michigan
Points: 11388
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 22 Mar 2023 at 9:25am |
It is an amazing difference. I've gotten to a field, set my rpm, drop tool, and take off forgetting to turn on MFWD. Tractor bogged down, feels like climbing out of a hole like said, then you go OH! Flip it on and it purrs like a kitten. It is awesome for ANY conditions in dirt.
Cue Paul B. to tell us how wrong we are.
|
|
IBWD MIke
Orange Level
Joined: 08 Apr 2012
Location: Newton Ia.
Points: 3445
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 22 Mar 2023 at 9:30am |
|
I heard a story a LONG time ago from a John Deere guy that a 4250 MFWD would do the same work as a non MFWD 4450. I have no experience in this arena, your mileage may vary.
|
|
Allis dave
Orange Level
Joined: 10 May 2012
Location: Northern IN
Points: 2849
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 22 Mar 2023 at 4:01pm |
Norm has a bunch of charts in his book A guide to Allis Chalmers Farm Tractors (the small book not the big one we all talk about). He compares the traction and wheel slippage of radial tires, 2wd, 2wd w/duals, FWD, and FWD / duals. The FWD with single wheels had less wheel slippage than a 2wd with duals. Radials made a big difference too.
|
|
farmboy520
Orange Level Access
Joined: 22 Jun 2016
Location: Beason, IL
Points: 553
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 22 Mar 2023 at 4:07pm |
|
In heavy tillage, ie chisel plowing, it will reduce your wheel slip by half if not more. Dad told me years ago that he demoed an 8030 mfwa. He said it would pull the same field cultivator we were pulling with our 7040 2wd. He said it would pull the cultivator in a turn with it in the ground.
|
|
On the farm: Agco Allis 9695, 7060, 7010, R66, Farmall H, and Farmall F20 (Great Grandpa's)
|
|
DrAllis
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Points: 19504
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 22 Mar 2023 at 5:49pm |
|
I can't really think of a situation where a tractor with FWA wouldn't outperform (get more work done) than an identical model of the same HP in FIELD conditions. Soil types and ground cover will make the results vary, but the FWA should always do better. Where an FWA tractor does poorly against an equal HP 2WD is hauling things at road speeds. I'd say a 134 HP 2WD 8030 would do as well or better than a 154 HP 8050 FWA hauling corn to town. Even with the FWA disengaged, you are still turning all those gears in the front axle and at 20 MPH that isn't a free ride. FWA tractor engine life is generally shorter on tillage tractors because the engine has a higher percentage of load because of the increased traction.
|
|
thendrix
Orange Level
Joined: 04 Feb 2013
Location: Fairmount GA
Points: 4736
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 22 Mar 2023 at 6:52pm |
|
Only people I know of here that still buy 2wd tractors are hay folks. My experience with 2wd vs FWA is in chicken houses with windrowers and decakers. You can pull a decaker with 2wd but it will spin a bit when it gets full. A windrower requires FWA especially in litter that is 6 or 7 inches or deeper. About the time the windrower gets to the dirt floor, the tractor stops.
|
|
"Farming is a business that makes a Las Vegas craps table look like a regular paycheck" Ronald Reagan
|
|
shameless dude
Orange Level
Joined: 10 Apr 2017
Location: east NE
Points: 13611
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 22 Mar 2023 at 11:00pm |
|
thanks ya'll...I think this has helped me decide on dif tractors. now...finding one I can get in and out of easy! whew!
|
|
darrel in ND
Orange Level
Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Location: Hebron, ND
Points: 8580
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 23 Mar 2023 at 9:43am |
 shameless dude wrote:
thanks ya'll...I think this has helped me decide on dif tractors. now...finding one I can get in and out of easy! whew! |
So, I am trying to think back here, the 9755 agco that I used to have, should have the same cab, steps and such as what you are looking at, and if I remember correctly, getting in and out of it was not a bad gig. I did love that tractor, and this DT that you are looking to score is only newer and better, so I don't think that you could go wrong with it. I would hope that you don't need parts for it, but in the event that you do, it shouldn't be a problem. Butler equipment (cat dealer) is the agco dealer I go to, and I have never been disappointed with them. Helps that one of the parts men at Butler in DIckinson has become a very good friend of both me and my son, and he goes above and beyond to help us. In fact I like all of the parts people there Darrel
|
|
injpumpEd
Orange Level Access
Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Walnut IL
Points: 4767
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 23 Mar 2023 at 12:38pm |
|
I've always though the FWA tractors in 2wd are not going to pull as well as a 2wd version of same tractor, kinda like a 4wd pickup, are almost helpless in 2wd.
|
|
210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
|
|
Tbone95
Orange Level Access
Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Location: Michigan
Points: 11388
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 23 Mar 2023 at 1:04pm |
injpumpEd wrote:
I've always though the FWA tractors in 2wd are not going to pull as well as a 2wd version of same tractor, kinda like a 4wd pickup, are almost helpless in 2wd. |
No doubt. Mechanical drag with no benefit, plus having to push bigger, lugged tires through the dirt.
|
|
AC7060IL
Orange Level
Joined: 19 Aug 2012
Location: central IL
Points: 3198
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 23 Mar 2023 at 4:18pm |
|
FWA tractors are typically ballasted differently than a 2wd. So to be fair, if a FWA tractor’s front axle is turned off, then yes it’s somewhat less ballasted rear axle(as compared to 2wd ballast only) may spin-out while pulling same previous tillage load AND WHILE ALSO pushing its unproductive heavier ballasted front axle.
This is a research update copied from Prairie Agricultural Machinery Institute
July, 1996 ISSN 1188-4770, Group (12a) 725
Front to Back Weight Distribution
Weight distribution between the front and back wheels should not be overlooked. Here, your tractor type is the important factor: the total ballasted weight that you determined from horsepower and travel speed should be split 30% front/70% rear for 2WD, 40% front/60% rear for FWA and 55% front/ 45% rear for 4WD. Again, you can check these weights with the cooperation of your friendly neighbourhood elevator agent. The 30% on the front wheels of a 2WD tractor may appear light, but for many tractors, you will have to add front weights to achieve this.
Edited by AC7060IL - 24 Mar 2023 at 10:37am
|
|
victoryallis
Orange Level
Joined: 15 Apr 2010
Location: Ludington mi
Points: 2857
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 24 Mar 2023 at 10:47am |
Tbone95 wrote:
injpumpEd wrote:
I've always though the FWA tractors in 2wd are not going to pull as well as a 2wd version of same tractor, kinda like a 4wd pickup, are almost helpless in 2wd. |
No doubt. Mechanical drag with no benefit, plus having to push bigger, lugged tires through the dirt. |
I’ve found the opposite in damp ground a mfwd even in 2wd will go places a 2wd will not. The larger rolling radius and larger footprint keeps from cutting in as much.
|
|
8030 and 8050MFWD, 7580, 3 6080's, 160, 7060, 175, heirloom D17, Deere 8760
|
|
Tbone95
Orange Level Access
Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Location: Michigan
Points: 11388
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 24 Mar 2023 at 10:50am |
I don't think that's really the "opposite" of what we're saying. IDK, I've never driven 2 of the exact same model tractors 1 2wd, the other not, in the same field on the same day. So it's just a hunch.
|
|
AC720Man
Orange Level
Joined: 10 Oct 2016
Location: Shenandoah, Va
Points: 4637
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 24 Mar 2023 at 8:09pm |
|
Running a MF 6140 and pulling a 10’ Case offset disk, there is a huge difference between 2WD and FWA. Not only in traction but speed of pulling the disk. No doubt fuel economy is better since the tractor isn’t spinning the rear tires and covering less ground. Engine labors less also and stays at a more constant rpm. If your doing tillage it’s definitely the best option IMO.
Edited by AC720Man - 24 Mar 2023 at 8:11pm
|
|
1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
|
|
Jordan(OH)
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Celina, OH
Points: 1545
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 30 Mar 2023 at 8:20pm |
farmboy520 wrote:
In heavy tillage, ie chisel plowing, it will reduce your wheel slip by half if not more. Dad told me years ago that he demoed an 8030 mfwa. He said it would pull the same field cultivator we were pulling with our 7040 2wd. He said it would pull the cultivator in a turn with it in the ground. |
So, your dad was impressed a 134hp[ FWA pulled the same field cultivator as a 136hp 2wd? Or am I reading wrong?
|
|
DrAllis
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Points: 19504
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 30 Mar 2023 at 8:53pm |
|
I think the 8030 fwa would pull the same field cultivator deeper in the ground that the 2WD tractor..
|
|
shameless dude
Orange Level
Joined: 10 Apr 2017
Location: east NE
Points: 13611
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Mar 2023 at 1:42am |
|
well I didn't get the DT200, went for $55250.00 on the auction. a little to rich for the 76 acres i'll be tiling! thought that was a hefty price for a 20 year old tractor, out selling many green tractors of a newer age. I bid up to $30,000. figgered I could get most of that back in a couple years!
|
|
ryan(IN)
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Bluffton,IN
Points: 745
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Mar 2023 at 5:33am |
|
That’s cheap. Good looking low houred DTs around here are bringing 70-80k.
|
|
ryan
1984 8070 FWA,1979 7060,1975 7040,1971 190,1960 D-17D,1957 D-14, 196? D-19G, 1975 5040,1971? 160,1994 R62
|
|
Orange Glow
Bronze Level
Joined: 14 Feb 2018
Location: USA
Points: 168
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Mar 2023 at 7:05am |
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9KMjXN7uCwhttps://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwZCGf7sP_0These two videos show a lot of the comparisons, along with the difference in acres per hour of radial tires on MFWD, or 2wd.
|
|
Tbone95
Orange Level Access
Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Location: Michigan
Points: 11388
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Mar 2023 at 8:33am |
ryan(IN) wrote:
That’s cheap. Good looking low houred DTs around here are bringing 70-80k. |
Agreed!
|
|
