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Dorix 
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 Topic: Belt driven buzz saw
Posted: 07 May 2021 at 3:12pm |
I saw Littlemarv's post and got wondering what other's think. I was given an old Sear's belt driven buzz saw that had been sitting in a barn for 30+ years and am repacking the bearings. Anyway my plan is to run it using a 2 cylinder Wisconsin engine off a baler mounted on a skid using a jackshaft and maybe a clutch.
My reasoning for doing this instead of using a tractor is I don't intend to use it often so I don't think it's worth mounting the motor on it, and I think using an ATV for pulling the saw motor and setting up would be easier than a tractor. Anyone with experience doing something like this, would the motor move to much? Or any other thought's?
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 07 May 2021 at 3:20pm |
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Im not up to speed on your idea 100%.... i would mount the motor and saw blade/ shaft to the SAME skid. Keep the distance constant and alignment constant.. If you need to have the motor on a seperate skid , put a couple of alignment pins you can drop into place to LOCK the two skids together.
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 07 May 2021 at 3:32pm |
dont know what your "saw frame" look like.. this guy has two skids and holding them apart with a bottle jack.... i think a couple links and PINS to hold the two skids together would work better.
one skid
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Dorix
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Posted: 08 May 2021 at 2:38pm |
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Thanks Steve for the ideas and pics I don't expect to use it often but I may alter what I had in mind closer to what your describing, or at least keep it in mind if my idea doesn't work.
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 08 May 2021 at 3:27pm |
the red engine/bottle jack setup sure is SCARY !!!! can anyone spell NOT SAFE ????? At the very least, saw table and engine need to be on the SAME platform,securly bolted down,maybe on a $100 4by8 sheet of plywood ??
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 09 May 2021 at 6:04am |
Dorix, Good luck with your set up. I like to use my buzz rig for cutting slabs. Very handy tool for that job. I remember the Wisconsin engines on the balers, maybe old 77's. They were always hard starting, for my dad or uncles. Regards, Chris
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Dorix
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Posted: 09 May 2021 at 3:05pm |
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I like the idea of using the bottle jack for a tensioner but yeah the rest of the set up looks dangerous. Thanks Sugermaker just curious what set up do you have for your buzz saw?
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 09 May 2021 at 5:44pm |
re: I like the idea of using the bottle jack for a tensioner
maybe...IF... the jack is designed to be used horizontally. I don't know what makes them 'special' BUT cheapy bottle jacks aren't supposed to be used on their sides ONLY vertical A proper HORIZONTALLY reatde jack would be OK, IF properly bolted to the 'fixtures'. Overall you need to remember there's some pretty serious power,forces and well SCARY things can happen faster than I can type about it !
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 09 May 2021 at 8:41pm |
Dorix, Some shots of the buzz rig this year cutting slabs for making syrup next spring. Using the D17 this year:
Sharpening it here:
Mr Steve Yoder setting some slabs up for a cut and running the rig. He says its therapeutic, I still think its work!:)
Here is the saw and the Jubilee last spring:
The wife stacking:
I added the table extension on the left side. Just as good as having another person helping now. I can buzz wood by myself:
You must be on your "A" game running these, like any farm equipment there is danger! Stay Safe! Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 09 May 2021 at 8:44pm
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Tbone95
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 8:38am |
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So much about the bottle jack.....let's play this out. For starters, how much tension is really required on the belt? Not tons in my experience. But whatever, let's play this out. So all this tension, not perfectly aligned, vibrates a little, over time, and oops, jack kicks out, which......immediately relieves all of the tension on the belt which it turn the blade stops. What's the big deal? It's a buzz saw, it's dangerous to begin with. What does sudden catastrophic belt loosening add that's worse?
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 11:40am |
well the SCARE factor for one ! Having a big friggin belt whip off ,goin in a zillion directions, getting caught up in 'rotating' things, like the belt pulley, jamming, tearing itself into a 60' long WHIP that'll remove flesh before you know it...... BTW IF the belt DID a clean uncouple, you still got a huge, sharp sawblade doing 90MPH 'forever'..... oh yeah, when the belt got free, the 'parking brake' comes off, now tractor's kinda rolling all by itself What I find 'impressive' is that NOBODY insists on belt safety cages at fairs but you can't buy a belt driven aircompressor without 'protection'.....
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
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Tbone95
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 11:55am |
Well, the belt could break and do that anyway. You've got it imagined, sure, but that doesn't seem too likely to me. Which is it? Jamming, or whipping? What's the danger in jamming? I mean it looks hokey, and I'm not going to ever operate anything like that anyway.....but, you should have seen the buzz saw dad built and he and I used when I was a teen! Talk about your safety guards!!!
Blade doing 90 mph "forever", um, well, you're there cutting wood, grab a piece of wood and put it into the saw. With no power, I think forever is a very short time.
Tractor? What tractor? Am I looking at the wrong picture?
Edited by Tbone95 - 10 May 2021 at 11:55am
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 12:36pm |
just appears to have too much "FLOAT" to it for me.. I would like to see a link between the motor skid and the saw that had a PIN ( like a draw bar pin) to hold things in line and stable.. Like you said, you dont really TIGHTEN the belt so the jack really is not needed.
Guards are a whole other topic. You could not sell anything that looked like that today. Like Chris said "YOU BETTER KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING"... keep the kids and spectators back... a cheap guard even made of hog panel would not be a bad idea.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 1:19pm |
ok, nuther scenario... the ONE bottle jack release tension.while you're buzzing a few boards... belt slides off towards sawblade.. belt gets some 'tension' around engine pulley... jams on the sawblade shaft and engine yanks buzzsaw unit towards saw, pivoting CCW THAT would scare the h-e- dbl- toothpicks outta anyone
btm line it's an accident waiting to happen....
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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Tbone95
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 1:28pm |
Well, looks like he built it himself, so nobody to blame but himself. Darwin has a way of working things like that out in time.........But again, are you even looking at the picture? there's a whole platform there between the saw pulley and the blade. Where the heck is it going to go, except OFF?
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Dorix
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 3:03pm |
Yes, Chris I used to help run run years ago on a friends farm. Yours is much nicer than mine, mines really just 2 angle iron a frames with an arbor on top and a tilting table with a few guards around table and blade. Hopefully I'll have better luck starting the Wisconsin engine and was I'll be on my A game.
I don't think I'll need the bottle jack the belt I don't think will need much tension when looped it's about 20' so it should have tension from it's own weight. Aligning things I think will be the difficult part. It may be that it'll work best using a tractor my thought was a portable power unit would be handier just not sure if it'll be stable enough. If I use my WC I'll have the brakes on and chalk the wheels.
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 3:52pm |
If the belt comes off, it could get caught in the gap between the saw pulley and the table. At the very least, 'flop' around, bounce, maybe that will 'pull' the table right and forward. THEN all hell would break loose !
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 4:10pm |
I was a Maint Superv for 30 years.. Had this same "discusson" with several Plant Managers ( they got new ones every 5-6 years).. One would routinely show up on a job and say " this looks unsafe, is there a better way to do it"... My answer... NO.. There are 10 ways to do any job. We have discussed all the options and chosen the BEST WAY to complete the job.. Nothing is 100% SAFE....... "You work in the office.. biggest concern is not getting you finger caught in the file cabinet" ....... Maint men had 20 years experience. Done many jobs dozens of different times. Experience and common sense goes a long way. You weight the options and do the BEST you can for any situation.
Is the BUZZ saw dangerous ? .. YEP... Is there a way to do things SAFE ? .. YEP... Is there a 100% GUARANTEE that nothing will happen ? NOPE.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Tbone95
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 6:02pm |
 jaybmiller wrote:
If the belt comes off, it could get caught in the gap between the saw pulley and the table. At the very least, 'flop' around, bounce, maybe that will 'pull' the table right and forward. THEN all hell would break loose !
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Yep and a meteorite or a hunk of a junk Chinese rocket could hit you in the forehead while you’re minding your own business sawing wood, and the Jack wouldn’t have anything to do with that either.
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 6:13pm |
'cept I don't saw wood anymore..... I do burn it outside though, tossed a log on yesterday, well, rolled...it was 4' diameter and about 8 inches thick...still burning......
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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Tbone95
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 6:16pm |
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...
Edited by Tbone95 - 10 May 2021 at 6:16pm
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Dnoym N. S. Can.
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 6:45pm |
jaybmiller wrote:
re: I like the idea of using the bottle jack for a tensioner
maybe...IF... the jack is designed to be used horizontally. I don't know what makes them 'special' BUT cheapy bottle jacks aren't supposed to be used on their sides ONLY vertical A proper HORIZONTALLY reatde jack would be OK, IF properly bolted to the 'fixtures'. Overall you need to remember there's some pretty serious power,forces and well SCARY things can happen faster than I can type about it !
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Subject: RE: Do bottle jacks work sideways? Yep as long as pump is on low side to pump the oil.
Did you have the handle side up? Try using the jack with the
handle side down. I'm guessing that the oil isn't reaching the pump if
you have the handle side up.
HTH
B:-) Dnoym
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JohnColo
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Posted: 10 May 2021 at 11:38pm |
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I bought a buzz saw made for a Ford/Ferguson at an auction. It didn't have the right angle belt pulley for the pto. After several years of it sitting around I took a right angle gear box off an old sugarbeet harvester and bought a couple belts and adjustable pto shaft. Made it so it will fit on any 3 point tractor, most likely an AC. Might be kind of cool to make it a snap coupler unit.
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jaybmiller
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Posted: 11 May 2021 at 6:22am |
re: bottle jacks Never had one apart to see HOW they work, but Princess Auto sell 2 types....one specifically says it CAN be used horizontally or tilted..which led me to conclude 'normal' or 'vertical' ones shouldn't be used except as vertical ones.
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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