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Alex09(WI) 
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 Topic: Farm Stories A-C vs JD
Posted: 24 Mar 2020 at 9:07pm |
I thought it might be enjoyable to hear stories (or tall tales, "cough" shameless) about back when A-C was competing against JD to sell equipment. Such as dealer demonstrations, plow days, green neighbors vs our orange equip. etc.
I'll lead off but since I'm a younger guy I never witnessed first hand, just heard from customers or retired farmers.
A guy last week said back when the WD45 came out, a few of his neighbors had JD tractors like A's or 50's. Up in dairy farm country, when filling silos became more popular the guy's JD neighbors tried putting thier 2 bangers on the blower. They kept clogging up the blower pipes and eventually got fed up and bought a WD45 that sat on the blower! Never had a problem again. He said back then, almost every green farm had an orange tractor in the shed for on the blower!
I also wonder how JD thought putting hydraulic levers on the dash could have been a good thing? From an operators standpoint with the 4020 vs 190xt, not sure how you could think the JD was easier to operate. No wonder JD went to the side console on the later 4020's!
Edited by Alex09(WI) - 25 Mar 2020 at 10:46am
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Keith M
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Posted: 24 Mar 2020 at 9:22pm |
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I grew up in a farming community. My dad had left the farm to be a mechanic in the city. I worked for all Allis Chalmers farms growing up. I reckon that’s why I run almost total AC tractors on my farm today. One farm irrigated tobacco, corn and beans all up and down the river he had a D-17 for his 4” pump a 220 for his 6” pump. Another filled silo with a D-19. I grew to love those tractors and still do. No other farmer in the county had any color tractor that could run a pump for as many straight hours. JD as thread is limited May ov had some better tractors in the mid 80’s but during the 50’s thru early 80’s AC was the tractor they were measured against in my neck of the woods.
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HD6GTOM
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Posted: 24 Mar 2020 at 9:49pm |
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We were filling dads brand new on ground silage pit for the 1st time. Our neighbor had just taken delivery of a new 4020, factory duals, no cab. He was hooked to a wagon hauling silage in and dumping it in the pile. After the pile got so steep, he could not get up on top of the pile with out a tow chain hooked to the front axle. Dad had his old D19 diesel, would pull the same wagon up on top of the pile without help. Boy was the guy with the brand new 4020 mad.
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HaroldOmaha
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 12:53am |
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I grew up on a dairy farm in upstate NY 1953-1961 we had Allis's and one IH, and as a kid I even noticed most JD farms had an Allis. And in college I worked as assistant herdsman and when done milking worked as a farmhand. They had a variety of the latest tractors. Some of the professors also worked as farm labor. Being as the prof's got to the barn before I did they got the choice of tractors. The Wd45 was the first to go , Then the IH, Massey and then the JD 50 which most of the time sat in the shed. And I got the Ford with the mower to mow pastures.
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Butch(OH)
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 5:13am |
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I have two stories. In 1961 dad decided he wanted a new 3 plow tractor. He wanted either a Deere or an IHC but a neighbor who had A-Cs convinced him to look at those also. Was mid summer and wheat was ready, he had a JD #30 pull type combine. He went to all 3 brands dealers and told them he wanted a 3 plow tractor with to demo at the farm on a certain day. He specified DO NOT fill them with fuel! The Allis dealer brought a D15, the yellow one I told about last week on here. The Deere dealer brought a 2010,, may have been a 1010? IHC didn't show. He had opened up the field with the John Deere A and was ready. He drained all the fuel out of tbe tractors and put exactly one gallon in them put them on the combine. The D15 went a lot further than the JD offering so they got the sale. IHC showed up with a tractor a week later,,,
Story 2
When I was still in school dad and I went halves on the last 190xtIII sold at our dealership and bought a new IHC 710 auto reset plow for it. There was some small problem with it that required a trip back to the dealer and as was popular at that time I told the shop guy to put it on the dyno and give it a turn or two on the fuel screw. Tractor came back with the pump still sealed and was told it had 120 HP as delivered and they woukdnt turn them up any more. We had a bleed green neighbor who had a 4020 he was pretty proud of pulling the same plow and when we we finished plowing I went over to help him finish up and the XT was ran right up on his tail wheel and he let me around and I ran away from him. He stopped and asked how many HP is that %÷\÷ thing?? I said 92, just like yours,, is it sick??? LOL. Next day tbe JD dealer come and got it to find what was wrong, found nothing and cost the guy quite a few bucks,, felt kinda bad about that.
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Lonn
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 6:34am |
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From what I've read on this forum if the shop had an M&W dyno it may have showed 120 hp but they read high. I believe most late XT's were closer to what a 200 put out which would be around 105 hp. When my brother had his XT Series III Landhandler on the dyno at a local shop it put out exactly 105 hp. I do not know if the dyno was M&W or an AW. The AW is a better dyno IMO.
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Lonn
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 6:53am |
I've tld this story before and I hope I remember it correctly but back when the WD45 was new, a farmer near Oslo MN was looking at buying a new tractor in that hp range. So the local Deere dealer brought out a new 60 and the local AC dealer brought out a new WD45. Both were to be demoed pulling the farmer's pull-type 3 bottom plow. Local farmers gathered to watch including my uncles and grandpa.
Well according to my uncles they eached took turns pulling the plow with the 60 starting off and someone with a watch timed how long it took to plow one round. Then the WD45 was hooked up and timed. The AC mechanic on the 45 plowed in 2nd gear and pretty handily beat the 60 driven by the Deere mechanic. The Deere mechanic made some carb adjustments and they hooked again, first the 60 then the 45. This time the 45 headed down the field again in 2nd gear but then stopped half way up the first pass. My uncles thought uh oh, there's a problem but what the AC mechanic did was stop and shift into 3rd gear and just blew the 60 away.
The farmer, he wore green underwear, and the Deere dealer accused the AC dealer of hopping up the 45 for the demo and the farmer still bought the 60.
Fast forward 35 years and I'm working at a local AC dealership and the older mechanics there told of their demo stories and they all said, first they never hopped up a tractor, second they never lost a demo with the 45, 3rd usually but not always they pulled an AC Snap Coupler plow, 4th Deere was always the easiest tractor to beat at field demos right through the 190XT which is about the time dealers quit doing head to head demos at customers farms. In fact they said they never lost a demo whether it was a WD45, a D19 or a 190XT.
Oh and the farmer who bought the 60..... he lived just down the road from our farm and many years later I got to know his hired man who by that time was quite old. The hired man owned his own WC and when the 70 Deere that they had put on the silo blower kept plugging the blower the hired man convinced the farmer to let him bring over his WC and give that a try..... they finished that year with the WC on the blower.
A Deere 2 lunger might lug down and sound cool but lugging down means problems especially when on a belt or PTO piece of equipment like a blower.
And just because your engine in lugged down going slow doesn't mean it's pulling more than a WD45. 
Edited by Lonn - 25 Mar 2020 at 6:55am
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Trinity45
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 7:11am |
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Not a JD, back in the day we had a D-17 series V, my father had taken it to my grandfathers farm with a 12 ft disc to rework some hay fields. While there that fall he disc my grandfathers 5 acre tobacco patch and unhooked the disc in the field to go cut the hay. I neighbor came by and asked my grandfather if he could borrow dads disc, (he had a Long). My grandfather said "Eddie I don't think you can pull that disc" Eddie looked hurt and said my tractor is just as big as Wilburs. But Eddie you don't have the correct hydrualic hook up your going to have to change the hose ends. Eddie presisted, grandad said alright, hook up to it and if you can pull it I will get the wrenches to change the hoses. Eddie hooke up his blue Long and did not budge it from where dad unhooked. He tried several times only digging two holes in the loose dirt. He left looking all dejected and defeated.
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Brian F(IL)
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 9:53am |
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Guess I'll have to pass on the One-Ninety XT versus IH 1206 story until later...
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Lonn
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 9:54am |
 Brian F(IL) wrote:
Guess I'll have to pass on the One-Ninety XT versus IH 1206 story until later... |
Start a new thread 
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Alex09(WI)
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 10:45am |
Brian F(IL) wrote:
Guess I'll have to pass on the One-Ninety XT versus IH 1206 story until later... |
I don't think anyone will mind if IH slips though
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Sugarmaker
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 10:49am |
My only JD stories: The first event I dont have all the facts, I never asked Dad the reason. But when he started up his dairy farm in the late 40's he bought a JD A model. I have a picture of him on it. He never said much about the tractor. But when I was old enough to remember there were only AC's on the farm. It could have been when he tried to fill silo, as others have mentioned. The only tractor every put on the blower was the WD that replaced that JD A. Also could have been that it was a little taller and one of the doors in the cow stable was lower and the WD series fit in fine. Alos could be that one of my mom's favorite collors was orange of a very similar shade as Persian Orange Too! That WD now belongs to My grandson Nic and his two boys.
The second event happened in the early 1970's Dad demoed a JD 3020 but end up buying a Ford 5000. The WD and WD45's still did a lot of the work on the farm but the Ford was the big horse. Not sure why he didnt look at AC. Maybe because the dealer had gone out of business near buy? Maybe AC did not have what he was looking for?
I just dont have much desire to own a big green unit at this time. Regards, Chris
Edited by Sugarmaker - 25 Mar 2020 at 10:53am
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D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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Rick of HopeIN
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 11:01am |
For whatever reason, the small farms near Hamilton Ohio seemed heavy with Allis Chalmers when I was growing up in the 60s. Later, the Deere 3010 and 4010 were the first tractors that really seemed to turn the tide toward green. Not many red tractors at all, maybe the dealer network was not strong.
My uncle lived in the area of larger farms up North closer to Columbus Ohio and they were big on Farmall red up that way and Deere to lesser degree.
I did always think the green stuff was generally well built and engineered equipment, certainly pretty bullet proof. Probably spent more time on Deeres once I was in my teens, the 3020 was pretty sweet tractor to spend the day on. Never got a chance to run a 180 or 190 era tractor but they always looked nice at the big shows.
Edited by Rick of HopeIN - 25 Mar 2020 at 11:02am
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1951 B, 1937 WC, 1957 D14, -- Thanks and God Bless
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Allis-Chalmers Damon
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 11:13am |
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My great-grandfather owned an Allis-Chalmers dealership in the 50's so naturally we have all A/C equipment. Fast forward to the mid 60's, my grandfather was using our WD45 Diesel and a 4 bottom plow all day in the field. They farmed around 60 acres of ground. A neighbor came over to borrow something and pointed at the 4 bottom plow and said "What do you have around here that pulls that?" My grandpa pointed at the WD45d and the neighbor didn't believe a word that came out of my grandfathers mouth. To this day our neighbor still doesn't believe it and he runs JD equipment.
Edited by Allis-Chalmers Damon - 25 Mar 2020 at 11:14am
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1955 WD45 Diesel, 1959 D14, All-Crop Drill, 2015 John Deere 5075e, New Holland 279 Haybine, New Holland 575 square baler, New Holland 1032 Stackliner, 10ft Industrias Disc, 6ft Titan grapple
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Brian F(IL)
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 11:29am |
Alex09(WI) wrote:
Brian F(IL) wrote:
Guess I'll have to pass on the One-Ninety XT versus IH 1206 story until later... |
I don't think anyone will mind if IH slips though
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Dad was demonstrating a One-Ninety XT diesel at a farmer's house. The farmer had an IH 1206 that was pulling a 5-bottom plow. We were also pulling a 5-bottom plow (don't remember if it was 14" or 16" bottoms). The farmer thought he could go much faster but Dad just stayed right behind him. I don't think he ever let Dad go in front of him for fear of Dad pulling away.
Not sure if the sale was made that day, but the farmer did end up buying a tractor.
When I told my IH friends the story, they didn't believe me and said it had to be an IH 806. I said nope, it was a 1206 with white fenders and all.
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injpumpEd
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 12:57pm |
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Well, a bone stock 1206 is rated at 112 pto hp, and many XT's were right around 100. The difference in plows could make a noticeable difference. Like XT's, you rarely see a 12-0 not tinkered on.
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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Trinity45
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 1:00pm |
Allis-Chalmers Damon wrote:
My great-grandfather owned an Allis-Chalmers dealership in the 50's so naturally we have all A/C equipment. Fast forward to the mid 60's, my grandfather was using our WD45 Diesel and a 4 bottom plow all day in the field. They farmed around 60 acres of ground. A neighbor came over to borrow something and pointed at the 4 bottom plow and said "What do you have around here that pulls that?" My grandpa pointed at the WD45d and the neighbor didn't believe a word that came out of my grandfathers mouth. To this day our neighbor still doesn't believe it and he runs JD equipment. |
The big farmer around my area uses Deere, their daddy was a Deere mechanic for the local dealer back in the early 80's the local Allis dealer brought out a Gleaner N series combine for them to test out hoping for a sell. They were running good heavy corn at 7 mph according to one of the boys and when they told their dad he said no way they must have rigged the meter to read high, he went to his grave saying that. Needless to say he would not let them buy the Gleaner even though the farming operation had nothing to do with him, they did buy some off color stuff once he passed away.
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Brian F(IL)
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 1:07pm |
injpumpEd wrote:
Well, a bone stock 1206 is rated at 112 pto hp, and many XT's were right around 100. The difference in plows could make a noticeable difference. Like XT's, you rarely see a 12-0 not tinkered on. |
I don't know what the 1206 had done to it.
And, I'm telling the truth here, I don't know FOR SURE if the One-Ninety XT had a "laying on of hands" as Norm Swinford called it. I'm guessing it had but again, don't know for sure.
I'm also guessing the AC plow we had was a 9000 series plow. I don't think the mono-frame plows had come out yet. I don't remember what the 1206 was pulling; probably a #700.
Edited by Brian F(IL) - 25 Mar 2020 at 1:09pm
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JC-WI
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 1:10pm |
Couple of old fellows wanted their farm plowed up in a hurry one year and they hired a fellow that had gotten a new Hydro 100 and was out there plowing with his older 4 bottom plow. Hank Love saw him plowing and looked like he was not going real fast so...Hank stopped and asked why he was going so slow. Fellow said it was hard plowing there. Hank said he would go home and get his D17 and plow and come back up there. Hank did some custom farm work for others with his series IV. He was back about half hour later and dropped the plow in and caught up with the fellow at the other end... and the fellow said to him he wasn't plowing as deep as he was... No, actually Hank was an inch deeper... and turning the same width as the other fellow. Rest of the day every 3 rounds the fellow had to let Hank go by. Next morning the IH dealer was out and picked up the tractor and took it back in and checked everything over in the Hydro and found nothing wrong with it, even set it up on the dyno and jacked it up beyond the 104 pto HP by another 15 hp. Now it should have been 100HP on the drawbar instead of the 80 from the factory... The hauler when bringing it back said that the fellow was adamant about them getting it fixed that morning cuzz he didn't want a lousy AC showing up his new tractor...
At least now the Hydro was able to keep up with the D17... and burned twice as much diesel as Hank burned in gas.
There was 3 reasons old Hank went up there to plow, 1. was to help out the Johnson brothers, 2. he could use the work, and 3,... to stick it to the 'everything I have is better than yours' windy braggart.
Hank said he could have been nice and helped set the plow up so it would have pulled a lot easier.  But then his old D17 wouldn't have looked so good at making that Hydro look weak. 
Dad told of renting a piece of ground one time and plowing it up. He had the old WD with the mounted 3x14 plow and came up on some cattails in a shallow part of the field and the tractor was spinning and going down and he hit the hydraulics and the front end reared up and plowed 3 perfect furrows through that spot, dropped the front end down and kept right on going, and worked the ground and never thought to much of that episode after that, but then didn't rent the ground after that year. Many years later, the old farmer across the road from that field said to my dad that he watched him plow through that strip and everyone that tried to go through there always got stuck and he was waiting to come over and pull him out, but... dad plowed right through that spot. ... and it dried up and never had been wet since. Must have closed up a weep hole in the clay or something because it still a farmable field to this day.
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Gary(VA)
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 1:51pm |
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I don't remember what Red Model it was but my cousin who owned an A-C dealership until the late seventies told a story about taking 190 with a traction booster hitch through and area where the red tractor got stuck the day before. Sale made!
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Gary(VA)
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 1:57pm |
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Should have said above, each tractor was pulling disc harrows
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DougG
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 6:25pm |
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I always thought Allis,s Traction Booster was a big seller in the day,, did any other other manufacter have anything like this ?
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WF owner
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 8:53pm |
Not a JD story, but there seem to be a few "red" stories, so....
We finished up chopping haylage one day and they were calling for rain. A neighbor still had a lot of hay down and was trying to beat the rain. They were chopping with an IH Hydro 100 and a New Holland 770 chopper. He and Dad were always arguing tractors.
My Dad told me to take his 185 and my Hesston 7140 chopper up and help them finish up. I got there just about the time he was turning around at the end and we started chopping almost side-by-side. I was going a lot faster than he was. When We were changing wagons, Johnny told me my chopper must run a lot easier than "my big New Holland", so I said let's change choppers. He wouldn't !
I grew up sitting on the toolbox of Dad's WD and WD45. I like the other older tractors, too, but I like orange the best!
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Rick of HopeIN
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Posted: 25 Mar 2020 at 9:31pm |
Grew up the toolbox of WD and later a D17. Also was my first real job, hauling hay a couple miles down the road with a WD for several weeks. But I enjoyed em all, Case SC then later our Case 830, the big old Cockshutt 40 and several neighbors 30s.
When I got older worked for the big dairy up the road and they were all JD. The big tires did ride better. Once in a while worked for a young farmer on weekends that had a WD45 that was tricked out with weights and duals to pull a disk that seemed way too big for it. Biggest downside of that was the small tires made for a rough ride, it was noticeable when he hitched up the Oliver 1850 after the plowing was done. Probably part of the reason no one could imagine the WD45 was so capable was it just looked small.
Edited by Rick of HopeIN - 25 Mar 2020 at 9:46pm
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1951 B, 1937 WC, 1957 D14, -- Thanks and God Bless
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