714B/L starting issue (1976) diesel

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   I have a question re starting the backhoe. 

diesel 4 cylinder. will roll over fairly fast when warn outside (<10F). 

The engine is plugged in (block heater), oil pan mag mount heater 200W, and battery charger to maintain battery top up.

I start with light spray of ether at air intake and crank engine over.

No fire...The last time it fired the engine started right up ran for 10 seconds and then died and has not started since. The engine is tired but no knocks leaks or other.

The machine has run in past very good as long as it was plugged in and operated in temps above 10F. I did run the machine out of fuel in the late fall and has been an issue starting since. I thought i had the starting licked most recently as it would start right up and run well. but as noted above the last time it fired it died and wound not fire again. 

Could something be sticking in the main fuel pump? Is there anything to adjust or inspect without a complete (professional tear down of the pump) I did bleed the fuel system previously and the machine ran for over 2 hours last time.

Any suggestions would be helpful 

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Eric Rollin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Bronze Level Joined: 02 Nov 2013 Location: Sault Ste marie Points: 7	Post Options Post Reply Quote Eric Rollin Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: 714B/L starting issue (1976) diesel Posted: 08 Jan 2014 at 9:54pm
	I have a question re starting the backhoe. diesel 4 cylinder. will roll over fairly fast when warn outside (<10F). The engine is plugged in (block heater), oil pan mag mount heater 200W, and battery charger to maintain battery top up. I start with light spray of ether at air intake and crank engine over. No fire...The last time it fired the engine started right up ran for 10 seconds and then died and has not started since. The engine is tired but no knocks leaks or other. The machine has run in past very good as long as it was plugged in and operated in temps above 10F. I did run the machine out of fuel in the late fall and has been an issue starting since. I thought i had the starting licked most recently as it would start right up and run well. but as noted above the last time it fired it died and wound not fire again. Could something be sticking in the main fuel pump? Is there anything to adjust or inspect without a complete (professional tear down of the pump) I did bleed the fuel system previously and the machine ran for over 2 hours last time. Any suggestions would be helpful

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DMiller Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Hermann, Mo Points: 33549	Post Options Post Reply Quote DMiller Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 09 Jan 2014 at 7:17am
	Roosa Master or Stanadyne pump? Or a CAV system? If Roosa/Stana the pump may need to come off. I am not too up on the CAV units as to running them out on fuel.

Coke-in-MN Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41933	Post Options Post Reply Quote Coke-in-MN Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 10 Jan 2014 at 12:51am
	When trying to start - will it run on shots of either down intake ? My machine had the fuel pump go bad and would not start - would run on either but no good smoke from stack . Check filters to make sure they are clean , check if you have fuel at injectors . Could be the fuel shutoff on pump is in wrong position - have seen it where cable will slip and not allow pump shutoff to be in right position . With it turning over, crack injector line at injector and see if you have fuel there . Could be air bound if it ran low on fuel last time and all injectors will need to be bled. Should be a priming pump on bottom of fuel pump for hand use. It sounds like the main fuel pump is bad - replace - Edited by Coke-in-MN - 10 Jan 2014 at 12:52am
	Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something. "Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."

AC7060IL Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 19 Aug 2012 Location: central IL Points: 3506	Post Options Post Reply Quote AC7060IL Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 01 Feb 2014 at 10:48pm
	When you are trying to start it, is there a good amount of white/light blue smoke coming from exhaust? If so, then its getting fuel. If not, then you have lost fuel flow to injectors. Lost fuel flow could be injection pump problems, clogged fuel filters, clogged fuel lines, or clogged fuel tank outlet.... If it runs for 10 seconds with shot of ether, its just burning the either. Not getting fuel.

creeperfreak Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 10 May 2013 Location: WNC Points: 142	Post Options Post Reply Quote creeperfreak Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 02 Feb 2014 at 12:37pm
	I worked on a Ford backhoe with much the same issue, it wouldn't even run on ether. Turns out the fuel system was full of water.

injpumpEd Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Walnut IL Points: 5080	Post Options Post Reply Quote injpumpEd Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 06 Feb 2014 at 12:40pm
	There is a possibility the pumping plungers have stuck in the pump. No matter what, they will not start if the plungers aren't pumping fuel. This happens with Stanadyne/Roosa-Master as well as the CAV pumps, since they are both the same pumping design. It may have been gumming up when it started and died, metering valve could have been sticky, but with it continuing to sit in poor fuel, more things tend to stick/gum up. Smell the fuel. Does it smell like latex paint? Take the top cover off the pump and see if the governor linkage is moving the metering valve. I've seen this way too many times to count! Good luck! Ed.
	210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!

Eldon (WA) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Spokane, WA Points: 7765	Post Options Post Reply Quote Eldon (WA) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 06 Feb 2014 at 1:15pm
	It may have gotten a little air in the system....if it is a CAV pump check for leaks around the governor assy... where the shutoff and throttle shaft come out. Also check for leaks around fuel lines. Might just need bleeding, and they need to be bled according to the manual.
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Eric Rollin Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Bronze Level Joined: 02 Nov 2013 Location: Sault Ste marie Points: 7	Post Options Post Reply Quote Eric Rollin Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 Jun 2014 at 3:26pm
	I still at a loss. i gave up during the winter as too cold to work in driveway. Upgrades completed to get the thing to start replaced mechanical lift pump with new electric unit. added clear glass inline filter and down stream check valve between pump and main dual filters. replaced both canister filters and tried to bleed the system as per manual (purchased on line for a 1975). I added additional battery for extra turning over and bleeding of injector. i find that i am getting fuel to injectors but it doesn't seam to be alot of fuel coming out when cranking. more like trickle/drips. should i see pressurized suirts or what? I pulled the air can and spray ether directly and will get firing but not continued as I suspect fuel supply is issue. How hard is it to clean injectors and should I be afraid of springs/parts flying apart when doing so as I don't have a supplier of these parts around hear i suspect. other related how do i determine what engine the unit has and the particular high pressure fuel pump it has installed?

Coke-in-MN Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Afton MN Points: 41933	Post Options Post Reply Quote Coke-in-MN Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 24 Jun 2014 at 10:05am
	Might be time to find a shop to check things out - I found a mechanic in diesel shop who worked on the side - he rebuilt several pumps for me as well as helped with problems with injectors - also had local farm service store check pump on my HD4 (AC 2200 engine) and reset it on the bench. Price on carry in was not that bad.
	Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something. "Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."