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thinking topfuel machining on 226 |
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mlpankey
Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Vols country Points: 4580 |
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The advantage is how much stroke a few extra thousandts will let you get by the heel of the cam . no replacement for displacement.
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CTuckerNWIL
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: NW Illinois Points: 22810 |
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I don't see any test and no one has gotten an A+ yet sept Butch. The question was: "Heres the question how much do you recon it can be moved before having major bellhousing issues with starter to flywheel ring cam gear to crank gear etc." The answer is another question, why move it a few thousands of an in? Yes thousandths of an inch would be the limit before you have trouble with the cam and crank gears. There would be no advantage to it and it will only add problems to a build. |
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http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
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Butch(OH)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Lucerne Ohio Points: 3831 |
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Pictures realy add to posts like this
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Butch(OH)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Lucerne Ohio Points: 3831 |
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Well Pank, you have not realy shared any secrete or top level knowledge here. You asked if moving the crank will cause problems eslewhere and the obvious question is yes. It is also obvious that taking one gear out of a gear train or adding one reverses the direction of the driven gear, again all emementary. If you want to talk inteligently I am willing to participate. If your going to build it, just do it. If you just want to beat your chest and talk stupid I am done here.
Edited by Butch(OH) - 13 Dec 2012 at 9:20am |
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mgburchard
Orange Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Tennessee Points: 1123 |
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well looks like most have passed the man pankeys test as to what you have to do to makes this work YOUR THE MAN PANKEY
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mlpankey
Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Vols country Points: 4580 |
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We looked at moving the cam but that means lifterbores move pushrods rockers etc . overhead cam is a diffeferent story playing with that idea as well . You guys are right I aint the only one working on it word is hayden is attempting the same . yes butch starter bell housing issues include input shaft. rob if you remember i posted when wi showed his bottom end 15 years ago that andy needed to do something like that for that 6.5 stroke crank laying under his bed . Wi used aluminum bars to girdle . This would be steel inserts to fit upper main bores to move crank down away from cam . its not as hard to hide as the cylinder head will be. A belt drive for the cam means a new cam . Cam will turn clockwise instead of counter clockwise like it does by paired gears. 500 cubes on 4 cylinders is a challenge fo the likes of me but over 400 cubes isnt and no one to my knowledge that has 400 plus inches on this site calls me a keyboard commando as well .
Edited by mlpankey - 13 Dec 2012 at 7:16am |
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Butch(OH)
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Lucerne Ohio Points: 3831 |
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Clutch flywheel problems will likely be easier than the others you create when moving the crank centerline? I guess you need to better define "major" issues. Moving the crank down more than a few thousands means new gears or new drive sytem such as chains cog belt etc so the answer there is it makes no differance, of your going to move it down .100 you might as well go 1.000. One problem you didnt mention is the relationship of the crank to the input shaft. Engine will have to be moved up or some creative means to move the input down? I saw this done with a full width plate or girdle on ( I think?) an Oliver? Some classes you cannot have such exterior mods? but you would know more that than I for sure. I would be a hard modification to hide if thats part of the equation.
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Rod B
Orange Level Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Location: Peoria Points: 415 |
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Who's attackin pank?
I'm only telling him how to do it and the easiest way to do it. He was asking for advice how to do it and keep the stock timeing gears so I gave him a better idea. Moveing the cam keeps the ring gear and starter problem he had out of the equation. |
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Mrgoodwrench
Orange Level Joined: 03 Apr 2011 Location: CHICORA PA Points: 2081 |
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for once pankey has a great post with good questions and ideas and with no negativity and he gets attacked! 5 replies in!
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There are 3 ways to do job GOOD, FAST, CHEAP. YOU MAY CHOOSE 2. If its FAST & CHEAP it won't be GOOD, if it's GOOD & CHEAP it won't be FAST, and if its GOOD & FAST it won't be CHEAP!!!!
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Rod B
Orange Level Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Location: Peoria Points: 415 |
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Your mechanical disability never ceases to amuse us. As long as you're worried about moveing it so little that cam gear train isn't effected. It'd be easier to move the cam by offset boreing and sleveing the bores up in the block and turning the main cam diameters down as far as possiable. Or offset bore the cam bore and make a billet cam with large mains. Just think of the ramp geometry if starting with a clean slate. Edited by Rod B - 12 Dec 2012 at 8:26pm |
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Rod B
Orange Level Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Location: Peoria Points: 415 |
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It'd be easy enough to do. Use a small main crank or turn the mains down even smaller on a d17 crank to fit another berring insert for even less surface speed like others have to. Make a main berring assembly like WI50 has shown he made 15 years ago and place the liner in the main berring bores of the block.
You're not the first one to think about it. Edited by Rod B - 12 Dec 2012 at 7:34pm |
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AaronSEIA
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Mt Pleasant, IA Points: 2534 |
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Curious, when you lower the crank, how do you keep the cam gear and timing the same? Interesting idea, but seems to me the bellhousing is the least of the problems. The trouble would all be at the front. Love this forum, no one is afraid to think outside the box.
AaronSEIA
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Mrgoodwrench
Orange Level Joined: 03 Apr 2011 Location: CHICORA PA Points: 2081 |
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if you can build that and pull it i don't think you could be called a keyboard commando again...sounds very interesting...i would think any distance would at the least mean slotting some holes for bell, but i guess you could make a relocated adapter plate?
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There are 3 ways to do job GOOD, FAST, CHEAP. YOU MAY CHOOSE 2. If its FAST & CHEAP it won't be GOOD, if it's GOOD & CHEAP it won't be FAST, and if its GOOD & FAST it won't be CHEAP!!!!
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mlpankey
Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Vols country Points: 4580 |
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Gary in da UP
Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: EUP of Mi. Points: 1885 |
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I say go for it, build it , dyno it, put it in a tractor and pull it ! Here is a great chance to show everyone what you can do. Good Luck Mitch !
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mlpankey
Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Vols country Points: 4580 |
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Aluminum blocks if known are going to be used for top fuel get the mains machined and a replaceable steel insert goes in to hold upper main bearing. I was pondering the same thing but solely to move cranks centerline down away from cam to fit 7 inch stroke. Heres the question how much do you recon it can be moved before having major bellhousing issues with starter to flywheel ring cam gear to crank gear etc.
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