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Allis C camshaft swap

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SWPennTom View Drop Down
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Joined: 06 May 2024
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    Posted: 01 Oct 2025 at 7:03pm
Troubleshooting an engine knock on a '49 C, inherited from my Dad.  ( It also won't start when it's hot - have to wait for the engine to cool down to restart it )  I was at a antique tractor show in August so I could talk with owners of restored C's, listen to their engines run and get advice.  The knock in my CE 95394 engine is not normal, their A/C's engines did not knock.  Recommendations were bad crank bearing(s) and/or worn camshaft causing valve clatter.  Back in 2017, Dad said the engine had been rebuilt, without saying when.  Currently it leaks a significant amount of motor oil from the front crankshaft seal, slightly less from the rear seal at the flywheel.  The engine is off the tractor now, and yes, it looks like new cylinder liners and pistons.  Also the cylinder head has new valves and the new valve guides.  I haven't pulled the crankshaft off yet.  The camshaft appears to be the original, to my untrained eyes I think it looks worn.  I'm getting a less worn replacement.
Question for the mechanics out there : Do I need to have the tappets machined to make them perfectly flat again for the apparently unused replacement camshaft?  Any tips on installing not mentioned in the manual are welcome.  Pictures are from #1 & #4 cylinders.
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Les Kerf View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Les Kerf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2025 at 8:49pm
Those cam lobes are badly worn and the tappets most likely are as well; I would definitely want the tappets to be re-surfaced.
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2025 at 8:53pm
a real KNOCK is crank / rods / piston pin area... Worn cam shaft with excess valve clearance will make a RACKET , but normally not a Knock... Cant tell about most problems without actually takeing MEASUREMENTS... but i would agree, the lobes of that cam do look like they are worn off on the edges... Tappets need to be looked at close or measured to determine if they need refaced..... I have done several of the B engines over the past 20 years and never had one that i thought the tappets were bad enough to reface.

If you have a service manual, make sure to read the part about how the connecting rods go in the block, which way they face... If you dont have a book, we can give you some advice on that..  Its a pretty basic engine getting 25 HP from 125 CID.. If you have rebuilt any motor what so ever in the past, this one will be pretty basic.
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2025 at 8:55pm
Did you happen to look at the oil pressure gauge prior to tear down ?  Pulling the pump apart and block sanding the end plate to tighten up the clearances can give you a couple extra psi on an old engine.
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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PaulB View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote PaulB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 6:10am
If you resurface the lifters, they are NOT flat. They are supposed to be slightly rounded to make them spin.
If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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Matt (Jordan,MN) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Matt (Jordan,MN) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 hours 4 minutes ago at 3:25pm
I do have a New old stock camshaft that I will sell. Let me know if you want it
Owner of Matt Scott LLC
Specializing in NOS and used Allis Chalmers tractor & implement parts & liturature and Magneto Repair
http://www.mattscottllc.com/
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wjohn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wjohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 hours 22 minutes ago at 8:07pm
Originally posted by PaulB PaulB wrote:

If you resurface the lifters, they are NOT flat. They are supposed to be slightly rounded to make them spin.

The BE/CE lifters were actually convex/domed when new? When I replaced the camshaft and lifters in my WD (WD201 engine, to be fair), I was curious about that so I tracked down a new one. It was flat as could be so I machined the old ones flat myself.

I'd be really curious to see a new 116/125 lifter if anyone has one.
1939 B, 1940 B, 1941 WC, 1951 WD, 1952 CA, 1956 WD-45
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SWPennTom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 1 hour 38 minutes ago at 8:51am
Originally posted by Matt (Jordan,MN) Matt (Jordan,MN) wrote:

I do have a New old stock camshaft that I will sell. Let me know if you want it
I may take you up on that.  I purchased a used camshaft on eBay - in photos  it looks like it never saw the inside of an engine.  Have to wait to see what it looks like in my hand, and see what the micrometer says.
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SWPennTom View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SWPennTom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 1 hour 10 minutes ago at 9:19am
Originally posted by steve(ill) steve(ill) wrote:

a real KNOCK is crank / rods / piston pin area... Worn cam shaft with excess valve clearance will make a RACKET , but normally not a Knock... Cant tell about most problems without actually takeing MEASUREMENTS... but i would agree, the lobes of that cam do look like they are worn off on the edges... Tappets need to be looked at close or measured to determine if they need refaced..... I have done several of the B engines over the past 20 years and never had one that i thought the tappets were bad enough to reface.

If you have a service manual, make sure to read the part about how the connecting rods go in the block, which way they face... If you dont have a book, we can give you some advice on that..  Its a pretty basic engine getting 25 HP from 125 CID.. If you have rebuilt any motor what so ever in the past, this one will be pretty basic.

I appreciate you taking the time to offer your experiened opinion.  The oil pressure gauge indicator was always between the O and the R in NORMAL.  The gauge is not the original.  I have the I&T A/C Shop Manual, the parts manual I got from Jensales and the A/C service manual.  Besides that there's a guy on youtube, kettle moraine meadows, who does a 15-part series rebuilding this motor.  He gets into micrometer readings, so it's pretty detailed.  JPN76 does a rebuild also.  I've been re-running all of them.
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steve(ill) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve(ill) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 0 hours 60 minutes ago at 9:29am
yes... a couple of those You Tube videos are GREAT... See all the details they give !
Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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