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190 key switch replacement

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elmer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote elmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 190 key switch replacement
    Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 8:32am
 
 I have a broken blade on the back of my switch. Could tell something wasn't right and luckily got it in the shop before all connection was lost. It is a 5 blade switch with only 3 wires to it now. I can see that at sometime there was a 4th but I need to find it. The 5th blade is empty.   It looks like an Indak switch on the key anyway but no numbers on it. Any recommendations on a tractor supply / orscheln  type switch I can try to find? It seems to be a 3 position switch 

 Thank you 
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Lonn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lonn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 8:42am
AGCO dealer is your sure bet and it might even be made in the USA, They used to be anyhow. And you need a wiring diagram..... I think your owner's manual has that but the diagram might be specific to your serial number. 

BTW...When I worked at the Allis dealer there were a couple 190 tractors that got a little burned from a bad harness. I'd consider a new harness if yours is old and cracked or at least a master switch to shut off the power when you park it. 

Just the ramblings from a guy who is temporarily bed ridden and bored.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WF owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 10:13am
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elmer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote elmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 3:12pm
Correct Lonn !   Chain farm stores had nothing that matched. Dealer about 20miles away has one for 26$ . Probably the same one in the other response. Plan to go get it in the morning. I make the mistake of assuming the dealer would be 2-3 times the price. 

 Thank you 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote elmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 3:15pm
Thank you for the link. There is  lot of good information on there. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DougG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 6:43pm
Thats a good dealer price,Agco is in line sometimes- i was a little shocked, but not really suprised a while back one for a 6080 is $104.55,,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AC720Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 9:19pm
Disconnect your batteries before you replace it. You can fry your wiring if wires touch or you touch a ground.
1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FREEDGUY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 9:41pm
We replaced the key switch on a 180 with an Agco dealer switch for $28 3 years ago. They had it in stock and no shipping cost/wait time involved Thumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote elmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 2020 at 11:11pm
Well I guess I still need a little advice. My IT shop manual shows a wring diagram but slightly different than what I think I had. The new switch is 70241965V with 5 spades
2  bat 
1  ST 
2 IGN 
The switch illustration in the book is showing nothing going to the S terminal. It also shows the white and the red w white stripe going to the I terminal. Red going to the B terminal. The old switch is not labeled but it has 3 wires. None of them went to the same terminal. 

 I can understand the solid red because it also runs to the ammeter. I know my old one did not have the white and the red w white on the same terminal. Also the old switch had 5 terminals but none of them were tied together like this new switch. It has 5 but since 2 are doubles it is only 3 posts.  Any ideas on what I should do? Sorry to be pain but don't want to burn the switch up.
Thank you  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WF owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 6:55am
This is what I was able to copy and paste from my online AC manual. I apologize that some of it didn't "copy and paste" very well, but you should get the idea.

If you send me your email address, I will attach the whole electrical page,

3. R ed - white wire from small terminal of manifold heater magnetic switch to "S" terminal of key switch.


8 . White wire from opposite terminal of starting switch push button to ignition terminal of key switch {double wire connector).

 9. Brown - white wire from number two {2) terminal of voltage regulator to wire connector, then white wire to ignition terminal of key switch (to double wire connector).

13. Red wire from charge side of ammeter to battery terminal of key switch.

14. White wire from ignition terminal of key switch to wire connector, then red wire to instrument fuse holder , then black wire from fuse holder to terminal of fuel gauge.


I don't want to rub salt in an open wound, but that's why it pays to buy an AC manual, rather than an IT (should say IT sucks).

If I can be of any help, PM me. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote elmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 7:33am
Sorry I should have mentioned mine is a gas tractor and they seem to be different . It looks like this book also shows  a different one one for diesel. You are correct I have never thought this manual was the best to find information in. I may have to try to find something different . 

Thank you 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WF owner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 7:36am
Send me your email address and I will send you the page for the gas 180
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FREEDGUY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 5:34pm
Have you removed your "original" key switch yet ?? If not, take notes/pictures of where the wires are connected on the "original" switch WinkWink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote elmer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2020 at 7:46pm
Thank you wf guy cor the information you provided. Hooked it up and it spun over. I dont like the spades on the new switch. The old one had ring terminals with a screw. This one is spades and dont seem to be very tight even after crimping a little more with crimpers. Going to try to find a "stacon" type in the morning. Dont want to get out somewhere and have one slide off.
Thanks again for your help
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve in NJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Dec 2021 at 6:09pm
It's pretty scary the type of components the vendor(s) that built these wiring systems used for wire size and the Ignition switches. They put Garden Tractor Ignition switches in these big Tractors to keep the cost down and to get the Purchase order to make the harnesses for these Tractor companies. It wasn't just AC. All of em' did that. Anything that's mass produced $ add up when building the unit.  That's why you see so many cobbled up wiring harnesses in Tractors over the years. The components as well as the gauge wire were borderline at best for the loads run through them and components failed due to high resistance which makes heat, and eventually wire, components, & plugs burned up stopping the Tractor dead in its tracks, and also possibly starting a fire behind the dash area. Seems like the only ones that made it this long with an original system in it had low hours on the machine. The work horses had harnesses replaced and systems cobbled to keep em' in service.  That's why it took me so long to get a good OEM system to use as a pattern to build my new systems on some models of these Tractors. The other no,no that these vendors did was pile up wires on one terminal. In the electrical world we call that "stacking". Worst thing you could do to a switch that isn't rated for the current that flowed through it. It was only a matter of time and "POOF" up it went in smoke! A four bladed switch would have 10-11 wires to it instead of using a higher rated amperage switch with multiple blades to handle the load. Oh well, that's the way it was back then I guess....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FREEDGUY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Dec 2021 at 6:29pm
Originally posted by Steve in NJ Steve in NJ wrote:

It's pretty scary the type of components the vendor(s) that built these wiring systems used for wire size and the Ignition switches. They put Garden Tractor Ignition switches in these big Tractors to keep the cost down and to get the Purchase order to make the harnesses for these Tractor companies. It wasn't just AC. All of em' did that. Anything that's mass produced $ add up when building the unit.  That's why you see so many cobbled up wiring harnesses in Tractors over the years. The components as well as the gauge wire were borderline at best for the loads run through them and components failed due to high resistance which makes heat, and eventually wire, components, & plugs burned up stopping the Tractor dead in its tracks, and also possibly starting a fire behind the dash area. Seems like the only ones that made it this long with an original system in it had low hours on the machine. The work horses had harnesses replaced and systems cobbled to keep em' in service.  That's why it took me so long to get a good OEM system to use as a pattern to build my new systems on some models of these Tractors. The other no,no that these vendors did was pile up wires on one terminal. In the electrical world we call that "stacking". Worst thing you could do to a switch that isn't rated for the current that flowed through it. It was only a matter of time and "POOF" up it went in smoke! A four bladed switch would have 10-11 wires to it instead of using a higher rated amperage switch with multiple blades to handle the load. Oh well, that's the way it was back then I guess....
Steve@B&B
Awesome reply Steve ! Your "stacking" reminds me of the rocker headlight switch in the F2, seems like there were at least 4-5 wires daisy-chained off of that switch and would literally melt the rocker paddle plastic ConfusedOuch
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DMiller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2021 at 4:20am
Still occurs today, only now it is not the switches which are ever more junk or the 16-18 ga switch wiring but building switch controlled modules at big bucks to compensate for the low grade dash components over complicating simple machines with massive technologic diagnostics requirement bigger junk.
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