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bendts 
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Location: NW Wisconsin
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 Topic: Hydraulic Guru Question - D17
Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 2:44pm |
The Loader Hydraulic Rams on the D17 I bought are basically shot - Leak like a sieve, All the chrome is gone from the shafts. Seems like it would cost more to rebuild than to buy new rams.
As this is a Single Action system currently - And I would like to convert to a Live Dual Action system in the future, here is my Idea...
The retracted length of my current rams is about ~44 to 46 inches. The only rams I can find online to get real close to the same dimensions are all dual action.
Can i use a dual action ram on a single action system as long as I provide a "Breather" for the top chamber/hose connection? Thinking I would add a connection and an Inline Filter (fuel filter?) to keep out the crud and just use the bottom connection for the fluid to raise the loader. Maybe add an ounce or so of Hydraulic fluid to the top chamber to keep seals lubed.
Will this work? Or is there a better way thats already been figured out.
Just don't have the funds to go full Live-Dual Action yet.
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1960 D17 Gas # 28849
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DiyDave
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Gambrills, MD
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Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 5:36pm |
It'd work, as long as the cyls you use are correct for the tractor you have. Early tractors used low volume , high pressure (3500PSI, IIRR) hyd system. At series 4, they got low pressure, high volume pump. Good luck!
As for the breather, yes, get a hyd breather made of sintered bronze, about $5 at surplus center.
As for oil, in the top end, just give them each a shot of hyd fluid, from a trigger style oil can, before you mount them. Roll around the cyl, to distribute the oil, on the seal, and drain out any excess... 
Edited by DiyDave - 18 Aug 2020 at 5:40pm
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Source: Babylon Bee. Sponsored by BRAWNDO, its got what you need!
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bendts
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Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 5:58pm |
Great Thanks.
How do the cylinders differ? Sorry new to the Hydro world. Isn't fluid being pumped just fluid being pumped? I can only guess that.
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1960 D17 Gas # 28849
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DrAllis
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Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 5:58pm |
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It would work BUT, you could have two issues. If the pre-series 4 D-17 hydraulic pump is in great health, the max pressure is 3700 psi. I doubt that any cylinder you buy will be that high of pressure rating. This pressure would only be reached if you let the cylinders fully extend and let the pump hammer its way to relief. This same 3700 psi could also be reached if you loaded a large bucket very heavy as well. The second issue would be the diameter of the cylinders. A-C high pressure cylinders are probably a 2 inch diameter rod, so that is the size the 3700 psi is working with. Any 2-way cylinder will have a piston inside working in a 2 1/2" or larger barrel. This will make for slower lift speeds. With the larger diameter cylinders, unless you fully extend them and let the pump hit 3700 psi, they will probably lift your same loads under less pressure because they are larger diameter, but will be slower in doing so. Have you tried new V-cup seals in your cylinders?? And do your cylinders have the four 3/8" bolts on the end of the barrel that you can tighten up to reduce/stop leakage ?? New rods could be made for your cylinders and don't chrome them. Just keep the thing lowered and in the shed when not in use.
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bendts
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Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 6:28pm |
 DrAllis wrote:
It would work BUT, you could have two issues. If the pre-series 4 D-17 hydraulic pump is in great health, the max pressure is 3700 psi. I doubt that any cylinder you buy will be that high of pressure rating. This pressure would only be reached if you let the cylinders fully extend and let the pump hammer its way to relief. This same 3700 psi could also be reached if you loaded a large bucket very heavy as well. The second issue would be the diameter of the cylinders. A-C high pressure cylinders are probably a 2 inch diameter rod, so that is the size the 3700 psi is working with. Any 2-way cylinder will have a piston inside working in a 2 1/2" or larger barrel. This will make for slower lift speeds. With the larger diameter cylinders, unless you fully extend them and let the pump hit 3700 psi, they will probably lift your same loads under less pressure because they are larger diameter, but will be slower in doing so. Have you tried new V-cup seals in your cylinders?? And do your cylinders have the four 3/8" bolts on the end of the barrel that you can tighten up to reduce/stop leakage ?? New rods could be made for your cylinders and don't chrome them. Just keep the thing lowered and in the shed when not in use. |
OK I see the newer cylinders are made for lower pressure - Got it now.
The cylinders I have only have 1 large "cap that threads inside the tube and they are tight as can be.
No idea what type of seal they have inside - have not taken 1 apart yet.
These are what I was looking at - but just 3000 psi rated
and that is this line: http://www.princehyd.com/Products/Hydraulic-Cylinders/Welded/3000-PSI-2-1-2-4-1-2-Bore
Edited by bendts - 18 Aug 2020 at 6:33pm
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1960 D17 Gas # 28849
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bendts
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Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 6:41pm |
This looks like a better choice for new -
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1960 D17 Gas # 28849
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PaulB
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Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 7:29pm |
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I have a pair of good used AC loader cylinders available. Although shipping them will be costly.
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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DrAllis
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Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 7:56pm |
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I think either of those would work as long as you don't raise the loader fully extended. How are you using the loader ?? What weight are you lifting??
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bendts
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Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 7:59pm |
DrAllis wrote:
I think either of those would work as long as you don't raise the loader fully extended. How are you using the loader ?? What weight are you lifting?? |
Main use was for this winter pushing/moving snow. Lifting fence posts, hauling some dirt. Nothing real extreme, this is more of a food plot that a big farm operation. Right now it only has the small trip bucket - so the weight is limited.
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1960 D17 Gas # 28849
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MACK
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Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 8:43pm |
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put some eight on back. If pump is good, even with small cylinders, it will turn it's self over. Been there. MACK
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orangereborn
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Posted: 19 Aug 2020 at 10:11am |
Give me a call....I have cylinders....How close are you? Dale
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bendts
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Posted: 19 Aug 2020 at 2:25pm |
orangereborn wrote:
Give me a call....I have cylinders....How close are you? Dale
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I'm up in Cushing (just North of St Croix Falls) - Will call you this evening.
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1960 D17 Gas # 28849
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