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JohnCO 
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Location: Niwot Colo
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 Topic: Cat truck engine problem
Posted: 02 Nov 2018 at 1:18pm |
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A couple weeks ago I posted about the turbo on my Cat 3126 engine making a skreeching sound. I took it off and apart but couldn't see anything wrong with it but bought a new one for $375, Chinese of course. Put it on and still have the noise, thought it might be the water pump or idler on it but no, that's not it either. Noise seems to be coming from inside the engine on the turbo side. Really sounds like a alternator bearing sound but I can't imagine what could be inside the engine that makes that sound. Noise gets louder when accelerating, less when idling down. Oil pressure is fine, I changed the oil with the new turbo. I'm going to pull the valve cover and see if there is anything I can see, really got me buffaloed. Any ideas?
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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tadams(OH)
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Posted: 02 Nov 2018 at 1:37pm |
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Did you take the belt off the alternator and run it ?
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JohnCO
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Posted: 02 Nov 2018 at 2:16pm |
Yes, I ran it without the serpentine belt when the problem first appeared. Hoped it was a bearing on the alternator, AC compressor or idler, nope! The noise seems more in the right side of the engine, toward the middle of the block. In looking as pictures, I can't see anything in that area that could make that noise. Haven't pulled the valve cover yet, but maybe there is something rubbing on a valve system part, but can't imagine what. I'll post more if I learn something.
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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Michael V (NM)
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Posted: 02 Nov 2018 at 7:24pm |
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Ya might put a call in to your favorite truck shop and ask them too...might save ya some time....
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Dnoym N. S. Can.
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Posted: 02 Nov 2018 at 7:43pm |
exhaust manifold leak bad gasket
B:-) Dnoym
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JohnCO
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Posted: 02 Nov 2018 at 7:55pm |
Don't think so, brand new gasket on the brand new turbo. Pulled the valve cover and looked in, couldn't see anything strange. Pulled the air cleaner element and ran it, no difference. Seems be loudest between 1300 and 1700 RPM then quiets down at higher rpm. Not much noise at idle. I took a video of it and will visit with a couple diesel engine guys . One of those frustrating things. I need the truck but can get by hiring or borrowing another one with a hook lift like mine, but I'd rather just get mine fixed!
I appreciate all suggestions. Good thing it's not a Ferd and good that Shameless's computer is down.....
Edited by JohnCO - 02 Nov 2018 at 7:58pm
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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Mikez
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Posted: 02 Nov 2018 at 8:27pm |
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Does it maybe have a air boot leak. They squeal sometimes
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SteveM C/IL
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Posted: 02 Nov 2018 at 8:52pm |
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He said "exhaust manifold" not turbo gasket....look for soot marks where you cant see. Look for broken studs.Cat likes to do that and it matters how you place the manifold on the studs if you don't want to do it again soon.
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truckerfarmer
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Posted: 02 Nov 2018 at 10:26pm |
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You've got a pinhole in your air to air hose. The red one with the steel ring on each end. Makes the most noise when you're at full boost. When it finally gives up the ghost you'll swear you blew it up. Always seem to happen she you're fully loaded pulling a big hill. Done it twice pulling doubles loaded to 142,000#.
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Looking at the past to see the future.
'53 WD, '53 WD45, WD snap coupler field cultivator, #53 plow,'53 HD5B dozer
Duct tape.... Can't fix stupidity. But will muffle the sound of it!
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JohnCO
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Posted: 05 Nov 2018 at 12:21am |
Well, I've been messing around with it some more but don't have any good news. I took both the intake and output hoses off the turbo and ran it a bit, no difference in noise. Using the cruse control I can run the engine at more then idle and get out and listen at various places. A machinic friend came by the other day and listened and shook his head too. He did notice the manifold bolt at the front end of the engine is broke. Don't see any tell tail signs or feel any exhaust but will check again tomorrow. It seems to be loudest between 1300 and 1800 RPM then quieter above and at idle. My cousin mentioned that he had heard some JD tractors have a problem with the front pulley, vibration dampener going bad and causing a high pitched sound. Said JD suggests changing it at 4000 hr, $500 part. (another good reason to stay with Orange). Mine seems solid, no movement. Keep those suggestions coming, I do appreciate them! To add insult to injury, I was working on my AC G this evening, finally got the last broken head bolt out and started cleaning out all the bolt holes with a tap. Managed to break a tap in one of the holes. Quit for the evening, maybe things will go better on a new day!
Edited by JohnCO - 05 Nov 2018 at 12:24am
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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AC7060IL
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Posted: 05 Nov 2018 at 1:28am |
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Serpentine belt may be off one sheave groove on AC clutch, or alternator, or tensioner??? Had a similar sound on my VED12 after dealership replace it's fuel pump. When they got it done & I started it up to leave, it sounded fierce. I didn't leave their parking lot. After arguing with mechanic & shop foreman for 20 minutes about whether it was that way when I dropped it off(it wasn't) or that they demanded another full shop hour's wage to do anything about it.(which I firmly replied, "NO!") The shop foreman finally requested that the mechanic move the belt to the rear of it's AC clutch sheave grooves. Took less than a minute. Problem solved.
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Ray54
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Posted: 05 Nov 2018 at 11:39am |
Well John that what happen being a to hard on poor o'l Deere.  I have seen several vibration dampeners  on the 2900 in MH2 combine fail.
Hopefully your luck improves. I broke a tap this summer, it was a place I could heat with the torch. After a heat cycle or 3, there was a tip that a visegrip got a bit on it came out. Luck  beats skill any time. |
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im4racin
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Posted: 05 Nov 2018 at 11:46am |
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Walton tap extractor kit!!!!
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AC7060IL
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Posted: 05 Nov 2018 at 1:42pm |
[QUOTE=JohnCO] Yes, I ran it without the serpentine belt when the problem first appeared. Hoped it was a bearing on the alternator, AC compressor or idler, nope!
Now I see that you already isolated serpentine. My bad. Please disregard my earlier post about it.
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JohnCO
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Posted: 05 Nov 2018 at 11:34pm |
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Didn't do much with it today, needed to just think about it and work on something that I could start and finish. Did show it to a couple friends who came by, we keep thinking even though the turbo is new, maybe it it the problem. I'll probably pull it off and start it up, should be able to hear the noise over the exhaust, time will tell. Also, I recorded an minute or so of the sound and will stop at a truck shop where I know some of the machinics and see if anyone has a clue.
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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im4racin
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Posted: 06 Nov 2018 at 5:21am |
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Exhaust manifold gasket. You need to start with the broken bolt. If the bolt is missing the clamp load is gone and it will leak. Does it use a steel gasket between the head and manifold? If so the gasket will flutter like a reed and make a high pitch squeal. You probably won't see soot tracking for about 10k miles as the newer engines just don't smoke as much to make a soot track. You know you have an issue in the area that has been previously mentioned so start there.
Rh
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JohnCO
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Posted: 06 Nov 2018 at 11:02am |
Thanks im4, I'm heading to Longmont this morning to get some other parts and will get a new gasket. That does make sense, the bolt is broken at the head so with the manifold off it might just com out easily, I hope.
My project yesterday was putting in a larger door frame on a lean too greenhouse I haven't used for years so I could put a few smaller tractors in. Needed some barn door track holders, went to Lowes and HD, neither have them, only single track rail for interior doors. Have to go to a place that knows something about barns for the right stuff!
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Mikez
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Posted: 07 Nov 2018 at 7:22am |
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Does that cat have the little tin cone insert behind the gasket into the head, they break and rattle around in there
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JohnCO
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Posted: 07 Nov 2018 at 11:08pm |
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Got it apart early this afternoon, no tin cone, but the gasket was bad and there was signs of exhaust leakage. It is a thin metal gasket with some sort of aluminum seal on one side. Also some of the bolts weren't all that tight, the broken one came out easily with a vice grip. Went to Longmont to get the gasket, three individual ones, $25 bucks each. Still, if this fixes it, I'll be a happy camper. I wanted to get new bolt lock plates, or what ever they are called but they didn't come with the gaskets and the five needed cost $17 each and $9 for another smaller one. Decided I could make my own or use a lock washer. Hope to get it together tomorrow but it's supposed to snow and the truck doesn't fit in my shop. May have to wait until Friday. Really, really hope this is the fix.
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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Tbone95
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Posted: 08 Nov 2018 at 8:13am |
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I think your chances are good.
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darrel in ND
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Posted: 08 Nov 2018 at 9:18am |
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Bad muffler bearing. Darrel
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chaskaduo
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Posted: 08 Nov 2018 at 9:57am |
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Yes, the one that slides back and forth.
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1938 B, 79 Dynamark 11/36 6spd, 95 Weed-Eater 16hp, 2010 Bolens 14hp
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JohnCO
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Posted: 09 Nov 2018 at 10:20pm |
Success! Thanks im4! It was the manifold gasket. $500+ later, but it runs, quietly!!!
Or it could have been the Muffler bearing, but it seems OK to me, it slide's back and forth as it is supposed to. Someone here suggested it could be the canard shaft but according to the book, it only sings when it it's nuts are tightened too tight. They weren't blue so I thought they were alright.
Off to get the F2 tomorrow!
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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Dave H
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Posted: 10 Nov 2018 at 7:06am |
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to quote a famous person, whhhhhew. good news
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chaskaduo
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Posted: 10 Nov 2018 at 9:22am |
Manifold gasket job, $500 plus. Quiet running motor, priceless.
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1938 B, 79 Dynamark 11/36 6spd, 95 Weed-Eater 16hp, 2010 Bolens 14hp
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SteveM C/IL
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Posted: 10 Nov 2018 at 10:47am |
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Use all new nuts and studs? "They" say you are to every time. I always do just because.Cat is proud of their parts. If you can get the manifold holes centered on the studs,they don't break as often. Just my experience.
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JC-WI
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Posted: 10 Nov 2018 at 1:31pm |
John's a HAPPY CAMPER!!! Yippie!!!! Glad to hear you had success  If somebody sees an F2 goin down the road with a driver lookin like this  , that'll be John.
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He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself
The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that."
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JohnCO
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Posted: 10 Nov 2018 at 9:38pm |
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Yup, $16 bucks worth of new metric bolts, $75 worth of gaskets, $375 turbo, $44 serpentine belt, new oil and filter, probably closer to $600 but still I'm a happy Farmer! Hauled the combine trailer up to get the M2 but by the time it was ready to go, the sun was setting and the lights don't work on the trailer. The guy who farms the place helped me load and tie it down loaned me his pickup so I could go home and come back after the coming storm.
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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