200 - Oil in Coolant

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We have a 200 that appears to be putting oil in the coolant
(not coolant in the oil).  It does not seem
to be severe, but the coolant went from appearing clean to having an oil film
at the fill cap after a few hours use. 
At the same time, the engine oil level went down slightly.  What are the typical failure modes that may
cause this?  It was purchased on an
auction earlier this spring, so I do not have any history on it.  Judging by the RTV, I believe that the oil
cooler has been off recently.  I assume
this was done in an attempt to repair or investigate the issue.  Overall, the tractor appears to be well
maintained and in nice shape. It starts and runs well and other than this
issue, everything else seems to be functioning correctly.  Fortunately we assume things might crop up
with auction purchases, so we bid appropriately. 

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Dan (SE MI) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Bronze Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Points: 44	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dan (SE MI) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: 200 - Oil in Coolant Posted: 13 Jun 2017 at 11:36am
	We have a 200 that appears to be putting oil in the coolant (not coolant in the oil). It does not seem to be severe, but the coolant went from appearing clean to having an oil film at the fill cap after a few hours use. At the same time, the engine oil level went down slightly. What are the typical failure modes that may cause this? It was purchased on an auction earlier this spring, so I do not have any history on it. Judging by the RTV, I believe that the oil cooler has been off recently. I assume this was done in an attempt to repair or investigate the issue. Overall, the tractor appears to be well maintained and in nice shape. It starts and runs well and other than this issue, everything else seems to be functioning correctly. Fortunately we assume things might crop up with auction purchases, so we bid appropriately.

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DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21851	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 Jun 2017 at 12:23pm
	Out of the dozens I've ever fixed like this, it's never been the oil cooler, always sleeve O-rings or pin holes in the sleeves. For proper diagnosis, drop the oil pan and leave coolant (not straight water---50/50 antifreeze) in the engine and pressurize the cooling system to no more than 12 psi and let it sit overnite to see where it's coming from. Sometimes the block heater needs to be plugged in to warm things up to find the leak, but that is rare. Oil pan can be removed by swinging axle rear pivot block down or remove it while jacking up underneath the bell housing. Drop the oil pan and drop oil pump suction tube into the pan and worm them out of there. If engine needs sleeves you can then roll the front axle out from underneath it to work on engine, so PLAN AHEAD and park it where it can sit and be repaired.

Dan (SE MI) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Bronze Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Points: 44	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dan (SE MI) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 Jun 2017 at 2:56pm
	Thanks for the input. I have been through o-ring/liner issues in the past and those failures resulted in coolant in the oil, which is the opposite of what I am seeing. I guess I can’t picture how the oil would have enough pressure to get into the coolant at that interface. None the less, the oil and coolant are getting in contact somehow so your suggestion could certainly provide insight.

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21851	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 Jun 2017 at 4:05pm
	Let the tractor sit overnite and very slowly remove the drain plug to the oil pan. If there's coolant/antifreeze it will be on the bottom of the pan and will show up at the drain plug. Pull off the breather hose at the valve cover and see if there's any white shaving cream looking stuff. Both of these are signs of coolant in the oil even tho you don't think there is.

MACK Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Points: 7664	Post Options Post Reply Quote MACK Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 13 Jun 2017 at 10:32pm
	Dr. reread the post. He is getting oil in coolant not coolant in oil. Oil cooler is the only place that oil can get into coolant. MACK

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21851	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 Jun 2017 at 7:22am
	I have had a couple that did both oil in coolant and coolant in the oil (even tho customer didn't think it was in the oil) and it was sleeve O-rings. As with so many posts on here, the amount of oil in the coolant and whether or not there is coolant in the oil is the issue, and I'm not there looking at it. If the radiator cap is boiling oil out when being used, it's the oil cooler or a cracked block/cyl head. If it is slight oil residue in coolant, my money says there's coolant in the oil too. That's why I said to check for coolant in the oil as well. It's funny the oil cooler appears to have been worked on and there's oil in the coolant and it was for sale. Was the cooler removed and tested and was deemed to be OK ???

Dan (SE MI) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Bronze Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Points: 44	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dan (SE MI) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 14 Jun 2017 at 11:10am
	Thanks for the responses. I agree, with evidence of oil in the coolant, coolant in the oil is certainly a possibility. I will follow up on the Dr.’s suggestions to check for that. The fact that the oil cooler has been worked on recently and it was up for sale probably does indicate that the issue is elsewhere, but you never know. Fortunately we bought it right with no intention of relying on it as a primary tractor. If the investigation gets more involved it might have to wait until we have more time to work on it. Whatever happens I will try and provide an update on what we find. Thanks again Dr. and Mack. I greatly appreciate your input.

FREEDGUY Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 15 Apr 2017 Location: South West Mich Points: 5396	Post Options Post Reply Quote FREEDGUY Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 Jun 2017 at 9:53pm
	Dan,were you able to locate the coolant issue?

Dan (SE MI) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Bronze Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Points: 44	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dan (SE MI) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 28 Jun 2017 at 11:42am
	We pressure checked the oil cooler, from the oil side, with shop air and didn’t find anything. While still a possibility, I doubt it is the cooler. Most likely an issue in the block or head. Working from easiest to more involved, our next step will be to check the head gasket. Unfortunately I am not sure when we will be able to get to that. It is parked for now. Like everyone else, too many projects and too little time. I will report back when we find something.

DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 21851	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 28 Jun 2017 at 11:57am
	If you pull the head first, you'll not be able to pressurize the cooling system to check sleeve O-rings. When in doubt, I pull the pan, pressurize the cooling system and wait and see where it's coming from. If it's a sleeve O-ring, you'll see it. If it's a head gasket, it will be coming from somewhere else instead of the sleeve O-ring area.