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67-d10 
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 Topic: D10 engine speed question
Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 6:36pm |
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I recently got a D10, and i have some questions on the engine speed.
For the low idle speed, the low idle screw on the engine side of the carb needs to be screwed all the way in to get the engine to idle at a reasonable speed. I don't have a tach, but gut feeling says it's somewhere between 5 and 700rpm with it screwed in, maybe 200? amazingly slow with it out. This doesn't seem like it should have to be that screwed in?
For high idle, it sure doesn't seem like i am anywhere near 2000rpm. The rod from the throttle lever to the governor gets bottomed out before the throttle lever reaches the end of it's slot. I can push the governor rod on the carburetor and get it to speed up, but it slows back down when i let off. How can i get the high idle to be faster?
Sorry to be long winded, but where do i start to correct the engine speeds?
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Ed (Ont)
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 7:18pm |
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These and many tractor carbs have 3 adjustment screws. Idle mixture adjustment(on carb), Main load adjustment(on carb) and idle speed adjustment(on linkage). The last one is idle speed only. Turn screw and you will hear the idle change up or down as fast or as slow as you want. So make sure you figure out which one you are playing with.
Edited by Ed (Ont) - 19 Nov 2022 at 8:24pm
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DrAllis
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 7:45pm |
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The idle speed screw is the hardest one to get at. It is on the backside of the carb and takes a very short screwdriver. Screwing it in, speeds the engine up. Screwing it out slows it down. The idle MIXTURE screw is usually 1 1/2 turns out from clear it. I think that is the one you're messing with.
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67-d10
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 8:10pm |
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Yeah, it's a pain to get to, and it has to be screwed tight to get it to idle up a bit. I had read other posts about setting the air and gas needles after cleaning, so they are set 1 and 2 turns out.
It idles smooth, but it just seems to take the throttle plate opened a bit to get decent idle speed. Would a bad setting on the top or bottom jets cause slow low idle and slow high idle?
I seem to know just enough to be dangerous....
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 8:17pm |
The rod from the throttle lever to the governor gets bottomed out before the throttle lever reaches the end of it's slot. I can push the governor rod on the carburetor and get it to speed up, but it slows back down when i let off...
I have never worked on the D10 ... but on MOST engines, the throttle rod goes to the governor, the governor has an arm across the front of the motor, and the carburetor rod connects to that governor arm.... You disconnect the carburetor rod at the front where it connects to the governor arm... Then set the hand throttle to FULL OPEN position... The governor arm across the back of the radiator should now be at its MAX position.. pickup the carburetor rod and hold up to the governor arm.. PULL the carburetor rod FULL OPEN... see that the ROD alignes with the GOVERNOR ARM.. If the holes dont align, then BEND the GOV ARM forward or back until the carburetor rod fits.... reassemble and now you have FULL THROTTLE.
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 8:18pm |
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and i think Dr is right.. your turning the wrong screw to get the IDLE.
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67-d10
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 8:35pm |
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The one I screwed in all the way is on the linkage on the back of the carburetor. It wasn't a mixture screw. Your suggestion of bending the governor arm should work to get full throttle.
So back to idle speed, does all the way to one end of the adjustment seem correct?
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 9:11pm |
doesnt the idle screw just push the throttle plate / shaft open a little bit off of closed ? ... as you screw it in, it should just open the throttle plate / shaft a little more and increase engine speed... if you back it out all the way, the throttle closes completely ???
the throttle rod we were talking about that runs up to the governor arm, attaches to the throttle shaft and has the throttle plate inside the carburetor throat.. The ROD pulls the throttle shaft open... the IDLE screw should be on the other side of the rod and LIMIT how far the throttle shaft can close.... ( thats how most work)... your adjusting the screw that is pushing on the throttle shaft that has the ROD connected to it ???
Edited by steve(ill) - 19 Nov 2022 at 9:19pm
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DrAllis
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 9:20pm |
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Just because your idle speed adjusting screw may be screwed all the way "in", doesn't mean squat to me. If the idle speed is correct and idle is smooth, quit worrying about it. There's a chance the throttle shaft assembly is slightly mis-made or not orientated perfectly. If the speed is correct forget about it and move on to the high idle speed problem!!!
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67-d10
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 9:41pm |
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You are both correct, the screw i am adjusting opens the throttle plate to increase the idle speed.
My hangup was, if by opening it too far, i was pulling off the main jet and covering up an issue with the upper jet. If this is not a concern, then Dr is correct; i need to move on and check out the linkages to fix the high idle issue.
Sounds like i have a Sunday project, thanks for your insight!
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DrAllis
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Posted: 19 Nov 2022 at 10:16pm |
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How do you know if your ignition timing is correct ?? if it is waaay retarded the engine will labor and be slow on all speeds.
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Gary
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 8:51am |
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As 67 stated in his original post:
I can push the governor rod on the carburetor and get it to speed up, but it slows back down when i let off.
I think first he needs to follow SteveIL instructions and bend the Governor Rod until he gets that issue corrected.
Then work on adjusting the 'High Idle' / Full Throttle issue.
G
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Ed (Ont)
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 9:19am |
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As Doc said. Make sure your points are set properly and check timing!! Lots of these old units have not had timing checked for decades. Get that set correctly FIRST then play with carb settings.
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67-d10
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 4:37pm |
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Thanks guys!
I have checked the points, and got everything adjusted there, that didn't seem to help.
I plan to borrow a timing light to double check the timing, but my buddy had a date with a deer stand today, so i didn't bother him. I will get that done sometime this week.
Upon checking the carburetor rod length to the governor governor arm, it appears that my carburetor rod is about 3/8" to short. The proper way to correct this is to bend the governor arm back away from the radiator?
I also found a spring pulling from a bolt on the air cleaner mount back to the carburetor rod, when i took that off, i got more top end speed, but then i also got more surging from the governor. Looking at the i&t manual, it's not the correct spring.
I haven't bent anything, as i think the best place to start now is timing.
I am open to any and all advice, so if you have other thoughts throw them out!
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 4:56pm |
Look at the arm across the back of the radiator.. If there is room to bend it back away from the radiator without hitting the thermostat housing, then that is the plan... Some of the tractors had a small weak spring as you said.. it is for the surging.. has nothing to do with top rpm.
Timing is always a good thing to check, but you already know the throttle arm to carb rod is off. I would have thought it was too just the opposite.. You said with the throttle at MAX and GOV wide open, you could still push the carb rod FORWARD.... so if the GOV arm behind the radiator is FULL OPEN, how can the carb rod ( pulled forward) be too short ??
Something dont add up, but with the throttle lever at MAX and the governor arm as far toward the radiator as it will go.... the carb rod needs to fit into the GOV arm. ... maybe make sure your GOV arm / spring is moving freely on top of the GOV.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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DrAllis
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 5:33pm |
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Take some of the kinks out of the link rod to gain your 3/8". Much better than trying to bend the cross arm.
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67-d10
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 5:40pm |
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I agree with you Steve, i didn't think the carburetor rod was going to be too short, that's was a surprise. I think DA's suggestion on the rod might be okay, it does currently have two soft bends in it, maybe i can get that length back.
When i had said i could speed the engine up further, the engine was sitting and running wide open.
So when the tractor is off the governor arm will pivot further towards the radiator than when the tractor is running, if that makes sense.
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Gary
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 5:57pm |
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67
clarify your last statement.
when the tractor is off the governor arm ?
when the tractor is TURNED off, the governor arm will pivot further .......
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PaulB
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 6:08pm |
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The surge spring on a D10/12 should looped up around the top manifold stud forward of center. Seeing one rearward toward the air cleaner is a sure sign of someone that doesn't know where it goes.
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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
Real pullers don't have speed limits.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY
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67-d10
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 6:09pm |
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Yes, Gary, that could have been confusing.
With the tractor engine off, and the throttle lever at full throttle, the governor arm will pivot forward enough to be 3/8" too far forward for the carburetor rod to attach to it.
With the tractor engine running and the throttle lever by the dash all the way forward, the governor arm does not pivot forward enough to open the carburetor throttle valve up completely.
If that's still unclear, let me know. What i try to say doesn't seem to come out right, when written down.
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steve(ill)
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 6:37pm |
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the problem might be that you are 3/8 inch off.. Normally if it is off, it is about 1/8 inch.. Hard to tell what is going on when that far off............ I would bend the GOV arm, attach the carb rod and retest.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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67-d10
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Posted: 20 Nov 2022 at 6:56pm |
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Yes Paul, the story i got on the tractor was that it was owned by a collector, then sold to the guy i bought it from, and resold to me a couple years later.
The oil filter said 2008. So i am concerned that the collector did what he needed to, to get it to run. i don't know what is factory and what he had that was close enough. It runs decent enough to idle in a parade, I'd like to use it on the yard a bit, so i want it to be right.
The tractor is in pretty good shape, but that doesn't mean it wasn't cobbled along the way.
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