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G head bolts
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JohnCO View Drop Down
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Niwot Colo
Points: 8992 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JohnCO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: G head bolts
    Posted: 05 Jun 2018 at 11:40am
I am replacing some broken head bolts on a G and am wondering what grade should be used.  I'm thinking gd 5 but an existing one is an 8.  There sure are a lot of bolts for such a little head!
TIA, John
I think this is my post 7777, should be lucky, right?
"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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JohnCO View Drop Down
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Niwot Colo
Points: 8992 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JohnCO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 2018 at 11:41am
Nope, guess the last post was the lucky one, don't remember which one it was...
"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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Leon n/c AR. View Drop Down
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Joined: 19 Mar 2013
Location: Heber Springs A
Points: 175 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Leon n/c AR. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 2018 at 11:48am
I believe head bolts are normally a grade 8 bolt. I would want grade 8 myself. Leon
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Allis dave View Drop Down
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Joined: 10 May 2012
Location: Northern IN
Points: 3042 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Allis dave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 2018 at 1:52pm
I think the WD and WD45 head bolt were only grade 5. I might be wrong.
The right way to do it would be to replace all of them, so they'll stretch the same. Probably not a big deal though with a gas.
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SteveM C/IL View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Shelbyville IL
Points: 8611 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveM C/IL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 2018 at 11:18pm
I think the bolts in my 45 have no markings but I'd buy G8 if i was buying.
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Richardmo View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Rolla mo.
Points: 1746 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Richardmo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2018 at 5:39am
I used Grade 8 on my G's  when rebuilding them.
 
 
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Hamilton Co, IA
Points: 5636 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2018 at 10:47am
The Continental owner's manual I have in my library doesn't mention head bolts or studs. Pictures look like studs with nuts.

The Allis G Owners manual: http://geraldj.networkiowa.com/Trees/Allis%20Chalmers%20G%20Owners%20Manual%20(TM-4A)0001.pdf
 shows an assortment of short cap screws, long cap screws, and studs.

The Allis G shop manual: http://geraldj.networkiowa.com/Trees/Allis-Chalmers-G-B-C-CA-Service.pdf
shows only studs and has the diagram for the order of tightening them to 55 ft pds torque. The fasteners may have changed over the lifetime of that engine.

Grade 5 isn't as strong as grade 8 but is less brittle so grade 5 handles shock and impacts better than grade 8. I doubt the threads in the cast iron block are as strong as grade 8. Grade 5 is a lot better for most applications than grade 2.

Gerald J.
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JohnCO View Drop Down
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Niwot Colo
Points: 8992 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JohnCO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2018 at 12:59am
Thanks for your thoughts, Gerald.  I'm sure this engine has been apart before so who knows how long the bolts were in.  I think studs are a much better idea as the nuts are much less likely to seize and break the stud then a bolt right next to the exhaust manifold.  It's got 20 bolts/ studs in that little head!
"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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solidground View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Dec 2016
Location: Kingston, NY
Points: 21 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote solidground Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Feb 2020 at 3:19pm
Hey all,
I've got a related question re the G head bolts.  In taking the head off, one of the bolts - a corner bolt - sheared (just about flush at the block, if it matters).  I tried drilling a pilot hole and using a bolt extractor, but the extractor snapped.  Now I've got no chance of drilling it out.  So how terrible would it be to put everything back together with that bolt missing?  I know it's wrong, but like "no chance of working at all" wrong, or "might start to leak eventually" wrong?

I've been having a lot of problems with this tractor (hence the engine work!), and am at my wits end.  I know one answer is to bring the block to a machine shop and see if they can fix it, but I was hoping to get it rebuilt this weekend.  Any thoughts?

Thanks so much for any insight-
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Sugarmaker View Drop Down
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Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Location: Albion PA
Points: 8476 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sugarmaker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Feb 2020 at 7:00pm
Solid ground,
You might get more response to start your own thread,
Darn "easy-outs" never seem to work for me either. You wont like it but the right thing to do is get the remaining stud out. Not sure that the head will ever seal right without that stud in place?? Experts will be along shortly. 
If you could heat it and weld on a washer then a nut you might get it out? You might need to get the easy out broken part out first?? The machine shop may be the best safest way to go. Not quick, not cheap, but right!
Regards,
 Chris
D17 1958 (NFE), WD45 1954 (NFE), WD 1952 (NFE), WD 1950 (WFE), Allis F-40 forklift, Allis CA, Allis D14, Ford Jubilee, Many IH Cub Cadets, 32 Ford Dump, 65 Comet.
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K-Mo View Drop Down
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Joined: 09 Feb 2013
Location: Atlantic, IA
Points: 91 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote K-Mo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 2020 at 5:37am
I used bolts from ZORO-- https://www.zoro.com/Grade 8
G9050867 2-1/4" G1409301 2-1/2" Can't guarantee suitability. Just saying that's what I used.
K-Mo
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Dusty MI View Drop Down
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Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Charlotte, Mi
Points: 5059 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dusty MI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 2020 at 8:46am
Originally posted by solidground solidground wrote:

Hey all,
I've got a related question re the G head bolts.  In taking the head off, one of the bolts - a corner bolt - sheared (just about flush at the block, if it matters).  I tried drilling a pilot hole and using a bolt extractor, but the extractor snapped.  Now I've got no chance of drilling it out.  So how terrible would it be to put everything back together with that bolt missing?  I know it's wrong, but like "no chance of working at all" wrong, or "might start to leak eventually" wrong?

I've been having a lot of problems with this tractor (hence the engine work!), and am at my wits end.  I know one answer is to bring the block to a machine shop and see if they can fix it, but I was hoping to get it rebuilt this weekend.  Any thoughts?

Thanks so much for any insight-

DrAllis View Drop Down 


Replies: 23 
Views: 1238 

View Post View Post		Removing broken manifold stud 
Posted: 20 Jan 2020 at 7:44am
A flat washer usually works better on the 3/8" bolts and smaller. Welding thru a small nut makes it hard to always get a good bead stuck to the broken off stud. Once the flat washer is stuck good, you can then weld a larger diameter (and easier to weld) nut to the flat washer. Letting things cool down allows the weld to shrink the broken off stud. Torching in this case bothers me because some of the studs are close to the head gasket surface. View Post
917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express"
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