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Johnwilson_osf 
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Joined: 29 Jul 2012
Location: Mount Bethel PA
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 Topic: F2 Engine loss of power
Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 6:57pm |
Gleaner experts, I have a new one that is stumping me. I was running oats today, and all of a sudden I lost power. I first felt the cylinder slow, like it was plugging, but I was in clean grain, so I was perplexed. I tried to increase the throttle, but it would not go up. Instead, the engine RPM would just steadily decrease until the machine quit.
My first instinct was that I had a loss of fuel, so I checked the sediment filter, and the glass bowl was clean, and the screen was clean. The canister filter was just replaced at the beginning of the season, so I assume that it is not the problem. After I let it rest for a while, the machine started right up, and ran for a little while, and then the same thing happened. I then thought that the tank might have an obstruction, but the glass bowl was full, with no air pockets. I let the machine rest, and then walked home, and got my wife to bring me back to the machine, and follow me home. Sure enough, it started right up, and then partway through the field (read 1000 feet), it started to lose power, and then shut down. My wife who was behind me said that she saw lots of white smoke coming out of the stack at the same point where I was beginning to lose power.
What is happening? Any thoughts?
Thank you John
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Allis Express: Eastern PA on Rt 80
8050, 8010, 6080, 190, D14, DA 6035, AA 6690, 5650, Gleaner F2
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DennisA (IL)
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Ridott IL.
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Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 7:00pm |
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Gas or diesel?
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Thanks & God Bless
Dennis
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Johnwilson_osf
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Joined: 29 Jul 2012
Location: Mount Bethel PA
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Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 7:01pm |
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Diesel, sorry. It has the 4 cylinder engine
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Allis Express: Eastern PA on Rt 80
8050, 8010, 6080, 190, D14, DA 6035, AA 6690, 5650, Gleaner F2
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Spelt Farmer
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Joined: 10 Jun 2013
Location: Ohio
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Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 7:37pm |
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Did you take a peek at the coolant level? White smoke makes me think it could be burning antifreeze.
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Johnwilson_osf
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Joined: 29 Jul 2012
Location: Mount Bethel PA
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Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 8:11pm |
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Oil and coolant are full. My thoughts were coolant as well, but when I let it cool, I opened it up, and it was right to the cap.
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Allis Express: Eastern PA on Rt 80
8050, 8010, 6080, 190, D14, DA 6035, AA 6690, 5650, Gleaner F2
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TramwayGuy
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Joined: 19 Jan 2010
Location: Northern NY
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Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 8:23pm |
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White smoke can also indicate plugged air intake system.
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Calvin Schmidt
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Ontario Can.
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Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 8:45pm |
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Maybe the governor ring plugging the return check valve in the injection pump. Have had it happen to a D-21. Common with RoosaMaster pumps.
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Nothing is impossible if it is properly financed
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Johnwilson_osf
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Location: Mount Bethel PA
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Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 8:50pm |
Calvin, Is this what I have seen InjPumpEd mention before as well? I can take some piece out, and it will run, but it needs to be rebuilt after that? I don't recall the posts, but I do recall something about this.
John
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Allis Express: Eastern PA on Rt 80
8050, 8010, 6080, 190, D14, DA 6035, AA 6690, 5650, Gleaner F2
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bradley6874
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Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 9:03pm |
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on the side of the pump there is a small plate with two screws when she lose s power loosen them up and try starting it up if your power is back its probably is the govner ring on the top of the pump is the return fuel fitting (should be 1/8 pipe ) barb fitting take it out and put in a regular one finish cutting oats and then take the pump off and send it along with the original fitting to injpump ed before you start corn this fall as the pump needs to be rebuilt
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You can wash the dirt off the body but you can’t wash the farmer out of the heart and soul
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Calvin Schmidt
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Location: Ontario Can.
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Posted: 08 Aug 2015 at 9:03pm |
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The is a little ceramic check valve ball on the T on the fuel return line. If you knock out that little check valve ball you will be OK. When plugged, it will build pressure inside the pump until the plungers don't function and the engine stops. Pressure will drop after a few minutes and the engine will restart. Can also bleed pressure out of the side of the pump. Without the check valve it will run fine but you are looking at a pump rebuild soon.
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Nothing is impossible if it is properly financed
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Johnwilson_osf
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 11:05am |
Bradley and Calvin, I opened the little access panel (two screws, and fuel came bubbling out). Inside I saw two metal items, with a vertical space between them. Otherwise it was all clear. In the return line, I pulled the fitting out, and could see the glass ball, and it was clean and clear. I used a coffee stirrer, and the spring moved when I pushed on the ball.
So if I remove that piece for the last on my oats, I should be able to run, with out the engine dying?
Thank you, John
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Allis Express: Eastern PA on Rt 80
8050, 8010, 6080, 190, D14, DA 6035, AA 6690, 5650, Gleaner F2
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injpumpEd
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Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Walnut IL
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 11:47am |
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Calvin and Bradley are spot on. Also, the advance goes to full retard when the housing pressure gets high enough to make it lose power, so that is why the white smoke. Gut the fitting that has the glass ball by grinding the inside end down enough to pry out the washer that holds the ball and spring in. Then, finish the job you're doing. Then in the off season, get the pump rebuilt. While the fitting is off, make sure you can blow air back to the tank through the return line. You may have a blocked retun line somewhere on the machine.
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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dkattau
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Location: Nebraska
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 12:29pm |
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Did you check the air filter?
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wheatbreeder
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 12:47pm |
Air filters are a funny thing this spring we sold our f2 the new owner started home got 40 minutes away it cut out replace the fuel filter started up ran for 10 min stalled A buddy with the new owner was persistent about the air filter to it off and the machine ran fine they drove it home four hours away with out the air filter The point is I would never thought the air filter was plugged so for a easy quick check pull out the air filter Morley
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Farm stuff 8050,6690,175,F2,5050,WD
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CALEBnOK
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Location: Oklahoma
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 4:49pm |
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I make service calls to all our drilling rigs.
Mostly caterpillars. I'll always tell them to change fuel filters first and check air filters. 9/10 times it fixes problem. Our diesel tanks have big filters then each engine has a fuel water separator filter, then has the factory primary and secondary fuel filters. We get a load of 8,000 gallons and it stirs the tank up plugging filters. These electronic cat smoke whit with the loss of fuel pressure. I'm sure it's probably your pump but I would change filters first. It's cheap to try.
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DanD
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 5:59pm |
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My dad's 185 did the governor ring thing quite a few years ago already. Had the classic symptoms. Got it rebuilt in Sun Prairie and it has operated flawlessly since.
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SHAMELESS
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 6:14pm |
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yep...check/replace the air filters! and fuel filter(s)
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Johnwilson_osf
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 8:26pm |
Thanks for the help everyone. The air filter was clean. I am pretty vigilant with those, as combining is dusty work. I took the return tank line off, and blew through it, with no problems. Then I removed the check valve, and sure enough, when I got the snap ring out, the glass ball was surrounded by black grit (kind of crunchy, but could break apart between my fingers). Once that was clear, the combine ran great. Finished my last oats, and got them unloaded. Tomorrow I will take the head off, get the combine into the barn, and start the removal process, and send the pump off to be rebuilt.
Thanks again for everyones help.
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Allis Express: Eastern PA on Rt 80
8050, 8010, 6080, 190, D14, DA 6035, AA 6690, 5650, Gleaner F2
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Big Orange
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 8:36pm |
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The rubber elbow to the air cleaner sometimes suck in & cut the air off.
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bradley6874
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Posted: 09 Aug 2015 at 9:04pm |
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if you have any question contact injpump ed you will get great service on a rebuild from him also consider pulling the injectors once the pump and injectors have been redone you will be set to go for a long time
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You can wash the dirt off the body but you can’t wash the farmer out of the heart and soul
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wheatbreeder
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Posted: 10 Aug 2015 at 11:07am |
did you try running it with out the air filter in if not how do you know that it definitively not the air filter The only reason I am persistent about this is that like you i was certain about the air filter not being a problem as it was always cleaned out changing crops from soybeans to corn Regardless when the new owner checked the filter it look clean until it was taped on the ground and it was full of small mould spores from the mould black corn. Once it was removed the f2 ran fine Morley
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Farm stuff 8050,6690,175,F2,5050,WD
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injpumpEd
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Posted: 10 Aug 2015 at 11:14am |
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did you guys not read his update? He knocked the ball out of the return, and it ran great so he could finish.
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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wheatbreeder
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Posted: 10 Aug 2015 at 11:21am |
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sorry Ed
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Farm stuff 8050,6690,175,F2,5050,WD
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injpumpEd
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Posted: 10 Aug 2015 at 11:34am |
 wheatbreeder wrote:
sorry Ed |
lol! no prob!
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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
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