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Cordless 1/2" drill for starting a handcrank B |
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kenbow56 ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 26 Oct 2022 Location: Lk. George, CO. Points: 22 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 04 Nov 2022 at 7:13pm |
I was thinking of trying a battery operated 1/2" drill to start a handcrank only model B , or any other model/brand with handcrank starting . make like a drive apex bit , with the crank end that goes into crank socket on tractor. Has anyone tried this, before I spend the $ on the drill and cut a crank handle up, any other ideas about this ? Thanks, Ken
Edited by kenbow56 - 04 Nov 2022 at 7:24pm |
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85476 |
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"IMPACT" might not be the best .... might need a CONSTANT ROTATION like an electric motor ?
how about a starter motor or electric motor belt driving the PTO shaft to start ? ... when it starts, push in the clutch and disengage PTO... you would need to gear it down since the PTO turns about 1/3 as fast as the engine.
Edited by steve(ill) - 04 Nov 2022 at 7:22pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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kenbow56 ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 26 Oct 2022 Location: Lk. George, CO. Points: 22 |
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Yes your right, what was I thinking, ok then a 1/2" chuck cordless drill...... has anyone tried this? What do you think Steve ill ?
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85476 |
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I think if you could turn the PTO shaft at 20- 30 RPM it would start... I would work from the back....im just thinking a BIG REDUCTION would fit in the back... If you had a big enough drill you could do the front... Think how hard it is to crank by hand .. Do you really want to be holding that drill ?
In the back, a 12 inch pulley ( sprocket/ chain) on the PTO.. a 1 inch pulley down below near the draw bar.. belt running between them... 12 :1 reduction for your drill.... ??
Edited by steve(ill) - 04 Nov 2022 at 7:30pm |
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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TMiller/NC ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Lenoir, NC Points: 1776 |
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I have used a !/2" corded electric drill to start a 39 B. Turned down end and machined flats on drill end, used a solid pin cut from grade 5 bolt on end to engage engine.
Edit, tractor does not have a pto.
Edited by TMiller/NC - 04 Nov 2022 at 7:38pm |
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kenbow56 ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 26 Oct 2022 Location: Lk. George, CO. Points: 22 |
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OK good it has been thought of and done before, good idea on rear PTO reduction Steve, Mine has a PTO cover plate on my 38 B, no PTO available at present time. Yes was thinking holding drill to crank may be tuff on my arm hand as well.... Thinking drill with clutch ! ? It is hard to crank over with hand crank, I aint a weenie but have severe pain it my right shoulder and arm, elbow from twisting wrenches most my life, arthritis has set in. Thanks for your ideas, TMiller and Steve ill, I will think on it a bit more. For now parking on a hill , poppin the clutch is working OK. Good thing for hills. I like this B since it is old and handcrank only !!! I'm weird I guess.
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truckerfarmer ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 26 Jan 2013 Location: Watertown, SD Points: 3232 |
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Ok, just gonna throw out a wild thought here. Would it be possible to start it with the generator? Like the old Briggs and Stratton engines did with the starter/generator.
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Looking at the past to see the future.
'53 WD, '53 WD45, WD snap coupler field cultivator, #53 plow,'53 HD5B dozer Duct tape.... Can't fix stupidity. But will muffle the sound of it! |
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kenbow56 ![]() Bronze Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 26 Oct 2022 Location: Lk. George, CO. Points: 22 |
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Good thought on Generator start, have seen them on older Cub Cadet's, not sure how strong they are? It might work. This 1938 B has no generator though nor starter! Magneto Ignition only on this Lil B. I was thinking something just for cranking it, not to install or detract from it's original no accessories originality. possibly one could make a generator bracket and run it to the crankshaft pully and add a battery.... not sure it might work out??? If it had a belt pulley PTO I could also try that off one of my Farmall A's belt pulley PTO, they are newer though 1944 and 45 models. thanks truckerfarmer for idea.
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DiyDave ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gambrills, MD Points: 53254 |
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park it on a hill and pop start it, or jack up the rear and start it by turning a wheel... Just be careful and have an assistant.
![]() Edited by DiyDave - 05 Nov 2022 at 4:38am |
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truckerfarmer ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 26 Jan 2013 Location: Watertown, SD Points: 3232 |
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My bad, Kenbow. Thought never crossed my mind that you didn't have a generator on there. Totally understand your desire to keep the clean look.
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Looking at the past to see the future.
'53 WD, '53 WD45, WD snap coupler field cultivator, #53 plow,'53 HD5B dozer Duct tape.... Can't fix stupidity. But will muffle the sound of it! |
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WF owner ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 May 2013 Location: Bombay NY Points: 4889 |
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I would be hesitant to use the PTO, especially when starting it alone. What happens after it starts, before you can get to the clutch?
At least by using some sort of adaptor on the crank pulley, the starter would be disengaged when the tractor starts. If someone isn't physically capable of crank starting a B, I would be hesitant of cobbling up something that may end up leading to an injury or worse.
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jaybmiller ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Greensville,Ont Points: 24335 |
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My first thought was .. 10-15HP B&S engine, 6:1 reduction, some kind of 'clutch-grabby' thing, on a 2 wheeled cart ,then thought about the units some drag cars have to start them but.... now... I'm thinking you could buy a 'newer' B, with electric starter and a genny for less or equal what you'll spend trying to 'replace the crank'. Buy a 'newB', fix it up, use it..keep your 'pride and joy' in a nice dry,clean shed NONE of us are getting any younger ,the older we get.... ok one link... Edited by jaybmiller - 05 Nov 2022 at 7:07am |
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor) Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water |
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Dusty MI ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Charlotte, Mi Points: 5058 |
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Or a couple of ramps.
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917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express"
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steve(ill) ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85476 |
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the BEST long term plan is park at the top of a small hill.... you can always pull start if needed.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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TMiller/NC ![]() Orange Level Access ![]() Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Lenoir, NC Points: 1776 |
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My B is hard to turn with hand crank as engine is recently rebuilt, I extended the length of crank giving me more leverage to turn engine, also repositioned the pin angle so when engaged in engine it is about 11:00 position so pull crank over the top, rather than pulling up on it.
Edited by TMiller/NC - 05 Nov 2022 at 9:13am |
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mdm1 ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Onalaska, WI Points: 2665 |
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I have a couple of 1/2 Milwaukee drills. Trust me the last think you want to do is have ahold of one if something catches. You would need some kind of clutch. I like TMiller's idea. May try that.
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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Dakota Dave ![]() Orange Level ![]() ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: ND Points: 3964 |
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My 1/2 cordless drill wouldn't start a 6 HP brigg's I don't believe it would start a B. how about you just rebuild Mag and tune the B My wife she's not a big woman could crank start my C after getting the timing and carb set it would start with just an easy single pull on the crank. there was a lot of twisting force on the drill when trying to start the briggs it was a two handed hold when it kicked back it was as bad a a crank kickback.
Edited by Dakota Dave - 05 Nov 2022 at 10:38am |
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Les Kerf ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 08 May 2020 Location: Idaho Points: 1050 |
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This proves that it can be done with a corded drill, some of the new cordless drills are pretty potent. I would want a physical stop to prevent the drill torque from being too much to hang on to. A simple bolt screwed into the front cultivator mount hole should suffice. |
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Les Kerf ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 08 May 2020 Location: Idaho Points: 1050 |
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I truly wish I could find one of those inexpensive B's within a day's drive from here... ![]() |
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Leon B MO ![]() Orange Level ![]() Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Old Monroe, Mo Points: 2178 |
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I have a 3/4 hp black and decker drill, 5/8 chuck, that we used to raise silo unloaders years ago, the drill can be a wrist breaker if you don't hold on tight. Yes, I have a 5/8 rod about a foot long with a roll pin at one end. I have actually used it on the 37 U. Roll engine with hand crank just past last fire, that gives a little time for drill to get some momentum before next compression. But be careful. After ignition, only pull crank out an inch until drill comes to a complete stop to remove from pedestal. I'm not telling you to do it but yes it can be done.
Leon B MO
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Uncle always said "Fill the back of the shovel and the front will take care of itself".
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acken ![]() Bronze Level ![]() Joined: 02 Jan 2014 Location: Minnesota Points: 93 |
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I use an 18 volt, 1/2" Dewalt drill to bench test spark on cast iron B&S single cylinder engines (spark plug removed). I learned the hard way how quick the drill needs to be disengaged from the crank when flywheel momentum wants to keep it spinning. I can't imagine how anyones wrist will take the torque from a 4 cylinder when it comes up on compression. The starter generator idea has merit even if you just use the starter half of the equation. Plus you have the added benefit of adding charging if you want. You will need a pulley on the B much larger diameter than the front crank pulley. I am guessing the pulley on the garden tractor engines is in the 8" range.
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Transaxial ![]() Bronze Level ![]() Joined: 19 Apr 2014 Location: Tofield,Alberta Points: 96 |
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Bosch makes a hydraulic 42MT starter with 11 tooth Bendix drive that will fit most Cat, Cummins, Detroit 14ish liter engines. I have run it off 30 gpm hydraulic from 325 hp 4wd and has lots of torque and power. It would be too big for your B but they might have a smaller version. Just a thought but it would require a power source and a way to attach it to your tractor??? Maybe a temporary mount on the front where the crank goes that just lifts off after it is running. Electric motor powered hydraulic power pack at the shop!
I have all the parts you would need! Would be a cool project for us retired guys! |
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