CA Clutch Shaft problem

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   I had to install a new starting ring gear on the flywheel and I'm having a dickens of a time getting the tractor back together.  I now suspect that the shaft as come loose from something on the rear end of it.

What happened when I split the tractor was that I noticed that the shaft pulled forward about 8 inches.  I turned an alignment tool on the wood lathe and I am pretty sure that the shaft was all the way forward into the bushing on the flywheel but when I had got the tractor to within an inch of together,  everything locked up and I could no longer turn the engine with the crank.

What do all of you experts say about what's happening?

Thanks
Dave

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davefullmer Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 21 Nov 2009 Location: West Tennessee Points: 62	Post Options Post Reply Quote davefullmer Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: CA Clutch Shaft problem Posted: 19 Jan 2012 at 8:59pm
	I had to install a new starting ring gear on the flywheel and I'm having a dickens of a time getting the tractor back together. I now suspect that the shaft as come loose from something on the rear end of it. What happened when I split the tractor was that I noticed that the shaft pulled forward about 8 inches. I turned an alignment tool on the wood lathe and I am pretty sure that the shaft was all the way forward into the bushing on the flywheel but when I had got the tractor to within an inch of together, everything locked up and I could no longer turn the engine with the crank. What do all of you experts say about what's happening? Thanks Dave

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davefullmer Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 21 Nov 2009 Location: West Tennessee Points: 62	Post Options Post Reply Quote davefullmer Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2012 at 9:01pm
	I should have mentioned that when I pulled it apart again, that shaft moved about 12 inches forward. This doesn't seem right at all.

pumpkinman Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 20 Jul 2011 Location: S.E. Michigan Points: 252	Post Options Post Reply Quote pumpkinman Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2012 at 9:28pm
	Sounds like the shaft came off the trans shaft you may have to take the torque tube off the trans. to get it coupled up should be a large cotter key that holds it together may be its been apart before and they forgot to put the key back in.

DennisA (IL) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Ridott IL. Points: 2075	Post Options Post Reply Quote DennisA (IL) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2012 at 9:37pm
	The shaft should not move. If I remember correctly, the back of the shaft is held in place by a cotter pin. Over time, the trans shaft and drive shaft wear so much that the pin also wears down and breaks. This allows the drive shaft to move forward.
	Thanks & God Bless Dennis

Chalmersbob Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 2122	Post Options Post Reply Quote Chalmersbob Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2012 at 9:45pm
	You have to insert the end by the transmission first, then install the engine. It is splined together at the trans end and the cotter key holds the parts together. Once the engine is installed the shaft will stay in place. I had that happen with a C several years ago. It has never been a problem. Bob

davefullmer Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 21 Nov 2009 Location: West Tennessee Points: 62	Post Options Post Reply Quote davefullmer Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2012 at 10:19pm
	Well, I think I found a clue in my ITT manual. I see that the B, C, and CA all have a clutch shaft that is connected to the main transmission shaft with a universal joint or on later models with a splined coupling and cotter pin. It seems likely that the shaft has pulled out of the coupling and thus I will have to remove the torque tube and reconnect it. Might be a good time to install those new brake linings I bought some time ago too.

Chalmersbob Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 2122	Post Options Post Reply Quote Chalmersbob Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2012 at 10:50pm
	you don't need to remove the torque tube to reinsert it. The cotter pin only prevents the shaft from pull out as it did for you. The spline drives the tractor. It's just like the PTO shaft and the size of screw that is used to keep it coupled, it's not used to drive it. Bob

GregLawlerMinn Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Lawler, Mn Points: 1226	Post Options Post Reply Quote GregLawlerMinn Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 Jan 2012 at 8:03am
	Been there done that several times. Seems like the cotter pin will disintegrate after 60 +/- years. Most of the time; the coupler stays on the shaft and will re-engage the tranny input shaft spline (takes a little effort since you are working from the opposite end of a long shaft). Once the coupler came off, after fishing out of the torque tube and re-installing it (with a few tack welds), was able to re-insert it. Never did try to reinstall the cotter pin.
	What this country needs is more unemployed politicians-and lawyers. Currently have: 1 D14 and a D15S2. With new owners: 2Bs,9CAs,1WD,2 D12s,5D14s,3D15S2s, 2D17SIVs,D17D,1D19D;1 Unstyled WC

davefullmer Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 21 Nov 2009 Location: West Tennessee Points: 62	Post Options Post Reply Quote davefullmer Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 Jan 2012 at 1:05pm
	Thanks guys, I have been in the process of taking the torque tube of but if ChalmersBob can tell me how to push the shaft back into the coupler, I would agree that the cotter pin is not needed once the tractor is back together.

Bud(WI) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Bronze Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Wisconsin Points: 69	Post Options Post Reply Quote Bud(WI) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 Jan 2012 at 6:56pm
	I would recommend splitting it at the transmission and replace the cotter pin. If the clutch ever binds on the shaft that pin will keep the shaft from binding on the engine flywheel resulting in gear grinding while trying to shift. (At least that's what i hope was wrong with my B - haven't had a chance to verify that was the problem after replacing the pin.)

Chalmersbob Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 2122	Post Options Post Reply Quote Chalmersbob Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 Jan 2012 at 9:09pm
	I just worked the shaft until it went together. It didn't take much effort. Bob

Chalmersbob Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Pennsylvania Points: 2122	Post Options Post Reply Quote Chalmersbob Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 Jan 2012 at 9:11pm
	I might add, put it in gear so the tranny shaft doesn't turn. Bob

davefullmer Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 21 Nov 2009 Location: West Tennessee Points: 62	Post Options Post Reply Quote davefullmer Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 Jan 2012 at 8:14pm
	Well, I didn't have any luck getting the shaft back in the coupling, so I removed the torque tube. I had to drive the shaft into the coupling with a light stroke of a brass hammer but I got it back together and then the tractor mated up with the engine just as slick as you please. I really wasn't a wasted move because I had to remove all the stuff with the fender brackets anyway to replace the brakes. Boy, it was no surprise why I had no brakes. One set was rusted completely in two and the other broke bringing it out from rusting almost in two. Ordered new brakes and installed them today. Now all I have to do is start reassembling the fender mounts, platform, and hydraulic lift arms. Once I get it back together I should have a all my problems resolved and I can go back in the woods and cut out the logging tops. Wow! New brakes, a new starter ring for reliable starting, and charging on the battery. I won't know what to do with all that operating.