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1951 AC B - Any idea what model this is? |
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miketothesteve
Bronze Level Joined: 27 Sep 2019 Location: Nova Scotia Points: 41 |
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Posted: 27 Sep 2019 at 5:42am |
I assume if there are enthusiasts and experts around, the answer will be yes. From some digging online, it looks like it could be a model B. I didn't know where to look for a model # until I was already back home, which was annoying because I was so close to the spot, even have the "Tractor No" imprint in one of the photos. I also didn't know it was an AC until I saw the name on the oil pressure gauge (think that's what it is). This was all last night.
Here's the short story I have for this tractor. It is/was my wife's grand fathers. He passed a few years ago. The guess in the family, is the tractor has been sitting in the barn for ~10 years. The barn is now being torn down. No one wants the tractor. I've never owned a tractor, but would love to. That bucket would be very handy. And think it would be fun to work on with my son (when he's older). I also do not have a mechanical background, but I also don't think I'm an idiot on the matter. The left rear wheel is rusted through in some spots, and the tire is rotten, so it needs to be replaced. The other 3 seem ok. There is a definite oil leak. Hard to say if it's from the gasket around what looks to be an oil pan, or elsewhere. Didn't see any visible cracks in the engine. Also wondering what the bolts are for? (picture with arrows) There are two on either side. All backed partly out and loose. I assume to connect something to. But it looks like when they are out, you can see right into the transmission?? I'm guessing even if this thing cost me $0 to buy, the investment to get it working might not be worth it? Thoughts? Edited by miketothesteve - 21 Oct 2019 at 7:02am |
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Charlie175
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Shenandoah, VA Points: 6351 |
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Model B
Have fun!
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Charlie
'48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD |
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Charlie175
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Shenandoah, VA Points: 6351 |
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The bolts are the locations for mounting implements. Be careful, if nothing is attached don't screw them all the wall in as they might hit the flywheel if they are long bolts.
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Charlie
'48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD |
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Charlie175
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Shenandoah, VA Points: 6351 |
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Yes you can see the flywheel when they are removed. Most of the time they are removed. I would leave the tractor as is, use it and have fun. You will learn a lot with this tractor. The hydraulics will only work with the clutch released. If you press the clutch, they stop (Thus the loader will not rise)
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Charlie
'48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD |
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miketothesteve
Bronze Level Joined: 27 Sep 2019 Location: Nova Scotia Points: 41 |
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I know pricing and availability with vary across the continent, but any idea what a wheel and tire would cost? (rear)
Having never used a tractor, I'm quite unfamiliar with which pedals and levers are which. For the time being, if I'm going to move this thing, I figure I should know how to operate the brakes. Is that pedal controlled? If I recall, there was one pedal on the left and 2 on the right.
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Rhoadesy_65
Bronze Level Joined: 28 Jul 2019 Location: Versailles, OH Points: 147 |
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You should buy an owners manual, they detail out how to operate the tractor and take care of it. The one on the left is your clutch, the two on the right are the breaks. there is two because one controls right side and the controls left side. pressing both will brake like you would normally expect. i typically leave the two brake pedals coupled together.
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Farmin' with 1981 7010 PD, Great Grandpas 1947 Farmall H, JD 7000 planter, JD model B drill, NH 316 Baler, NH 1411 Discbine ,JD 100 8 Shank Chisel. Darke County OH
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miketothesteve
Bronze Level Joined: 27 Sep 2019 Location: Nova Scotia Points: 41 |
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If I decide to take it, I'll most definitely get a manual. But I'm in a bit of a time crunch at the moment. It has to at least be moved out of the barn tonight. I figure I'll at least go do that, and see what she looks like when it moves.
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mdm1
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Onalaska, WI Points: 2592 |
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By all means get it. My first tractor was my DIL's Grandpa's tractor. Keep it in the family. Tires and rims can be spendy but you have 0$ in it to start. Look for a used tire and rim maybe. Good luck.
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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Rhoadesy_65
Bronze Level Joined: 28 Jul 2019 Location: Versailles, OH Points: 147 |
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if its free, worst case is you will sell it, best case is youll have a good tractor and learn a lot. Either way a free tractor isnt much of a problem.
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Farmin' with 1981 7010 PD, Great Grandpas 1947 Farmall H, JD 7000 planter, JD model B drill, NH 316 Baler, NH 1411 Discbine ,JD 100 8 Shank Chisel. Darke County OH
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miketothesteve
Bronze Level Joined: 27 Sep 2019 Location: Nova Scotia Points: 41 |
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Well I figure if I decide to take it, I'm deciding to drop a couple hundred just to see if it will turn over. That's fluids, filters, gas, and likely a gasket.
Should I bother looking to replace the wheel before I've done all that? Like I mentioned, it's done. When this thing gets hauled out, it'll be on a flat tire. I've read that this has a magneto that'll power everything once up and running. Would this mean I don't necessarily need a battery, and a jumper/booster pack would work? When/if i get to that point
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Dakota Dave
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: ND Points: 3893 |
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A B is a great model to start with, they are very simple parts are plentiful and relatively cheep. I like to put all new Tires on a tractor once I get it running. its a light enough tractor that you can haul on a low car hauler trailer I've winched one with flat tires on with just a comealong. make sure you tie it down well. you can get new loop style replacement rims cheep and do away with the troublesome wedges. replace both together. put on new tires and you'll never have to mess with it again.
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Grayray
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Ambridge PA Points: 3800 |
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First, welcome to our orange family. You have come to the right place for advice and encouragement when owning/working of that nice model B. Congrats on your new acquisition (DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT PASSING THIS UP. ).
Yes, this is a magneto, so it will run and function very well without a battery. You will need to crank start it though. Make sure you learn the proper way to use the crank, if you don't, you may end up seeing your favorite doctor. If done properly, it is easy. Congrats, and have fun.
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Gary Burnett
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Virginia Points: 2851 |
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Do the simple/cheap stuff like getting it started then replace the rim.Farmall 4 lug rim will bolt right on and sell cheap on ebay.Up and running with the loader easily a $1000 outfit.
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ac hunter
Orange Level Joined: 05 Jan 2011 Location: OHIO Points: 948 |
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A good cleaning will go a long way to make the tractor look a lot more appealing and not cost much. It may have 50 years of leaks and dirt on it. Getting it to run may not be that much of a deal either. Clean the tank, fuel lines, etc. Since it has a magneto you won't have to buy a battery. For not a lot of money you can probably at least get it started. It's a very good thing that it has been stored inside. As far as operating it it's just a bit of learning. You learned to drive a car I bet and you didn't know how to do that at first either. Good luck with your project and keep us posted as to the progress.
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chaskaduo
Orange Level Joined: 26 Nov 2016 Location: Twin Cities Points: 5203 |
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YouTube vids on crank starting your B.
Cold [TUBE]N43_dWx8Yrs[/TUBE] Hot [TUBE]uOMBzGhteHU[/TUBE] HTH
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1938 B, 79 Dynamark 11/36 6spd, 95 Weed-Eater 16hp, 2010 Bolens 14hp
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Gerald J.
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Hamilton Co, IA Points: 5636 |
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I don't have an operator's manual, but in years past I have found several manuals at:
http://grandpas-tractor-site.s3.amazonaws.com/manuals/ac but they may not be there now. Try google or ebay. I do have a shop manual that will help with many details: http://geraldj.networkiowa.com/Trees/Allis-Chalmers-G-B-C-CA-Service.pdf Gerald J. |
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Alberta Phil
Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Alberta, Canada Points: 3650 |
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Looks like it has a starter as I can see the starter bulge on the bellhousing in the last two pics. You could use a battery and jumper cables to start it or one of those booster packs. The starter is a 6 volt, but will handle a 12 volt boot for a while. It's obviously been used with 12 volts for a while as it has been fitted with an alternator. Good luck with at and have fun. I have 3 of those 'B's. Great little tractor and still capable of a good amount of work.
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Charlie175
Orange Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Shenandoah, VA Points: 6351 |
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Make sure you check to see which is grounded, the positive or the negative.
Positive is the default grounding for these, but due to the alternator it may have been changed over to Negative grounding. |
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Charlie
'48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD |
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Dusty MI
Orange Level Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Charlotte, Mi Points: 5053 |
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When you put it outdoors, cover the exhaust with a can or something, to keep rain out of the engine.
Good Luck, Dusty
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917 H, '48 G, '65 D-10 series III "Allis Express"
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tadams(OH)
Orange Level Access Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Location: Jeromesville, O Points: 9638 |
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It's got a alternator on it so it's been converted to 12 volts
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DaveKamp
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Location: LeClaire, Ia Points: 5637 |
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yep, that's a B. Alternator means it's been updated, probably to 12v negative ground, and a 12v battery will whip that engine into action in a heartbeat. Magneto means it'll hand start with a dead battery. Front end loader means you will stay younger, longer, and stronger. No power steering means that when the bucket is full, you'll need to be rolling either forward or backward to turn the wheel. Tractor brakes... on 'serious' tractors, have two pedals- one for each wheel. Usually, you'll only use brakes for steering tight, or to make forward progress when one wheel is slipping massively. A spinning tire needs only a little brake pressure to pull it's partner into operation. You might stomp on both brakes in the event that you need to stop, but most of the time, to slow down, just reduce the throttle. Since this is a B, you'll find that any other tractor of similar size and weight, will be a sissy... that's normal, because the B was an extremely powerful machine in comparison to it's competition. You'll also find that it's rather tedious to climb up onto when you're walking with a catch in your giddyup... but once in position, you'll be okay. The seating position might seem a little odd at first, but operate a WC or WD for a while, and you'll really enjoy the B. The bolts on the sides of the bellhousing are there to hold spare washers, just in case you'll need them. One of those bolts is an extremely rare, and commensurately expensive one, as it is wearing green paint. Green paint on tractors is ghastly expensive, and reserved only for those who bleed money. Because of the green paint on that bolt, it is automatically rated to five times' normal strength, and it's replacement cost is ten times' that of an ordinary fastener. I suggest you carefully remove, clean, and put that one on Ebay, and replace it, and the washer, with a plain Grade 5 fastener, and torque it to zero inch-pounds with first finger and thumb, and put the difference in a long-term investment. The two most expensive parts of an antique tractor restoration (regardless of the intended use) are engine and tires. If yours has bad tires, put good rubber and a good set of rims on it all the way around at your first fiscal opportunity. as for making it run, put the crank in it, and turn it by hand a few turns, just to see how it feels. If it turns over with consistent feel, then you've got a really good chance that it'll start up without any effort. Open the radiator cap for a look. See coolant? That's a good thing. Pull the dipstick... Is there oil? A little low wouldn't be surprising... but if the oil level is HIGHER than the FULL mark, then pull the pan plug, drain it, and observe for water or coolant running out with the oil. Grab a spare sparkplug, pull off one of the plug leads, connect the spare, and set it on the engine somewhere within sight of the crank. Open up the magneto grounding switch (that's the wire coming off side of the magneto going to one of the switches on the small console)... and pull the crank past TDC four times. ONE of those times, you SHOULD see a nice, white hot, snappy spark when the magneto coupler goes CLACK. If not, move the kill switch to the other position and repeat. If you have consistent compression and a hot spark, spray a shot of something flammable into the carb throat (you'll hafta pull off the air cleaner boot) and pull the hand crank a few times, see if it'll pop and vroom for a moment. Under the steering wheel, small looped handle on right by throttle is the choke. Loopy pedal-thing under your foot is the starter switch... press it, and the battery energizes the starter motor, cranking the engine. Doesn't matter if the magneto is on, or not, the engine will crank. Once you have that, it's time to clean out the fuel tank and sediment bowl. That picture shows yours as being deep reddish brown, so it's nasty. The fuel filter is probably there for a reason... so you'll be cleaning it a bit. If it were me, I'd nix that extra filter, replace the hoses (eventually, replace them with proper metal lines) and unthread the sediment bowl from the tank to get it ALL rinsed really well. I'd probably also drop the carb bowl and clean out any crud in there, and on the carbeurator fuel inlet, unthread that fitting and clean out the little catch-screen in the fitting (if there IS one). After that, add a little fresh fuel, make sure the carb bowl fills (and hopefully, doesn't overflow), and then fire it up. Left hand pedal is the engine clutch. There's a small looped-end lever down there... controls the
Power Takeoff. You'll probably need to press the foot clutch in, and
lift this lever to engage the power takeoff, in order to make the
hydraulic pump operate. You'll know when PTO is engaged, because the PTO shaft under the seat will start spinning. Keep your trousers away from it. Lever with loop to the right of your right leg is the hydraulic control valve. With engine running, and clutch released (but leave trans in neutral for testing), lift the lever... after a moment or three, the bucket should start to raise. Move lever to middle, it should hold. Down should drop it. Bit lever up on the loader arm releases the bucket. it's a 'trip bucket'... that means gravity makes it dump. To reset it, lower bucket to the ground, and back up... bucket will roll to horizontal position, and the trip latch SHOULD reset. Oil and cussing may be required to make it operate well.
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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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Bill Long
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Bel Air, MD Points: 4556 |
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First, Welcome to the Unofficial Allis-Chalmers Forum. As you have seen you will get outstanding advice and information here.
I sincerely hope you will keep the B. With my father I was fortunate to be there for the lifetime of the B. It is my favorite Allis Chalmers tractor. As said above you will find it to be a very basic, easy to work on. I sincerely hope you will be able to keep it. First, being a "family" tractor makes it much more desirable as a remembrance of your wife's Grandfather, second, if you have room it could be very helpful on your home grounds, thirdly it could bring you and your son closer together. We all hope you will keep it and get it operating again. You will be keeping history alive. We will all be available for any information you need. Let us know how it goes. Good Luck! Bill Long
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DiyDave
Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Gambrills, MD Points: 50523 |
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Additions or subtractions in red...
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Source: Babylon Bee. Sponsored by BRAWNDO, its got what you need!
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miketothesteve
Bronze Level Joined: 27 Sep 2019 Location: Nova Scotia Points: 41 |
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So the tractor # I pulled off is B115302. Does that seem right? What year would this be?
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miketothesteve
Bronze Level Joined: 27 Sep 2019 Location: Nova Scotia Points: 41 |
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What size would the rim be? the tires on it have this for sizes:
10-24 on 9" rim, 11.2-24 on 10" rim |
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mdm1
Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Onalaska, WI Points: 2592 |
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According to Tractordata that would be a 1951
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Everything is impossible until someone does it! WD45-trip loader 1947 c w/woods belly mower, 1939 B, #3 sickle mower 1944 B, 2 1948 G's. Misc other equipment that my wife calls JUNK!
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miketothesteve
Bronze Level Joined: 27 Sep 2019 Location: Nova Scotia Points: 41 |
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I was even on that site. Didn't realize the B was a clickable link. I see it now. Thank you |
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miketothesteve
Bronze Level Joined: 27 Sep 2019 Location: Nova Scotia Points: 41 |
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Also, as an update, I was there last night to move it out. The left rear wheel basically disintegrated when it moved. We dragged it out of the bar with the excavator, then lifted the whole tractor into the air with chains on the front and rear, and the excavator, and moved it out of the way.
This will make getting it on a trailer much harder... |
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Boss Man
Orange Level Joined: 03 Mar 2018 Location: Greenleaf, WI Points: 608 |
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Nice looking unit. I've put a 2 x 10 down and used a floor jack under a tractor to get it up on a trailer. Takes time an patients but for what you paid I'd do it again.
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DaveKamp
Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Location: LeClaire, Ia Points: 5637 |
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Actually, if the tire disintegrated, that makes life easier... you don't hafta fight them off. Use a sawzall with a metal-cutting blade to cut the bead enough to remove whatever's left, and it'll roll nicely on just the rim. Back a trailer up to the REAR of the tractor. Place a 4x4 on the ground behind the tractor's 'bad' wheel, and atop the trailer deck. Place a ramp behind the OTHER tire. use a come-along to winch it up onto the trailer. The 4x4 will serve as a 'rail' for the tire-less wheel... it'll climb on fine.
Edited by DaveKamp - 29 Sep 2019 at 12:49am |
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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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