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Demandred 
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Location: MO
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 Topic: Allis 190 lift arms adjustment
Posted: 17 Jun 2021 at 8:23pm |
Hey there, I searched the forums but didn't find a answer on this. I recently bought a really large 3 point blade for my 190, but after unloading it from the trailer realized that it's hitch points were so high, I don't have enough arm travel to get the blade more than a couple of inches off the ground at full lift.. I cranked both sides up as far as they would go, but that didn't make that much difference. I see that the arm shaft is splined though... Can I take them off the shaft, and clock them upwards several notches to get the lift I need? Or would that cause some kind of problem? Thanks in advance!
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DrAllis
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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Posted: 17 Jun 2021 at 9:06pm |
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Place the top link in the LOWEST hole on the tractor (and highest hole on the implement if there is a choice) and make it shorter if it isn't rusted tight stuck. What you want to do won't work.
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AC720Man
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Posted: 17 Jun 2021 at 9:25pm |
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It’s a problem I have on my XT. I noticed it when I was loading my AC sod planter onto a trailer backwards. I couldn’t get it high enough and ended up putting it on our 6060 to load it. Now with that being said it would handle the planter under normal circumstances in a field but it doesn’t lift as high as our 6060. I’m not sure how to resolve it. Will have to study this on my lift arms to see if there is a solution. I don’t use my lift arms often so it really hasn’t been an issue other than trying to load the planter.
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1968 B-208, 1976 720 (2 of them)Danco brush hog, single bottom plow,52" snow thrower, belly mower,rear tine tiller, rear blade, front blade, 57"sickle bar,1983 917 hydro, 1968 7hp sno-bee, 1968 190XTD
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DSeries4
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Location: Ontario, Canada
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Posted: 17 Jun 2021 at 9:41pm |
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Clocking the splines won't do anything. The lift cylinders determine the arm height.
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'49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '63 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080
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DrAllis
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Posted: 17 Jun 2021 at 9:58pm |
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The mighty One-Ninety has a couple of issues that cause this lower hitch lifting scenario. Too large of front tires is a start. Keep 7.50 x 16 or 9.5L x 15 front tires and the hitch will lift higher. 10.00 x 16's lift the nose up too much. Worn out or small sized rear 34 inch (16.9's ) tires are the next area to address. Change the top link like I said costs you nothing. Also, the top link anchor bracket could be installed upside down. Correct installation places it right on top of the PTO shield. Upside down raises the lower hole 2 inches. Adding a taller/higher hole on the implement for the top link will also improve the lift height. Might cost a little to fabricate.
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shameless dude
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Posted: 17 Jun 2021 at 11:30pm |
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you adjust the height of your blade lift with the middle arm. adjust it short, you'll hafta have your lower arms up too if you wanna use the blade with the middle arm shortened.
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Demandred
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 5:36am |
I haven't tried that yet, but my top link is shortened up as far as it can go. I will see if farm and home has one that is shorter to start with.
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Demandred
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 5:40am |
I assumed they had more stroke that wasn't being used, because the arms were coming up against a stop or something. So if I changed out those cylinders for ones with more stroke (if possible) or fab a extension link between the cylinders and the arm mount point that should fix the problem right?
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Demandred
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 5:44am |
 DrAllis wrote:
The mighty One-Ninety has a couple of issues that cause this lower hitch lifting scenario. Too large of front tires is a start. Keep 7.50 x 16 or 9.5L x 15 front tires and the hitch will lift higher. 10.00 x 16's lift the nose up too much. Worn out or small sized rear 34 inch (16.9's ) tires are the next area to address. Change the top link like I said costs you nothing. Also, the top link anchor bracket could be installed upside down. Correct installation places it right on top of the PTO shield. Upside down raises the lower hole 2 inches. Adding a taller/higher hole on the implement for the top link will also improve the lift height. Might cost a little to fabricate. |
Yeah, I have new stock size rubber all the way around. Will check the top link mount when I get home tonight. Yep, might cost a LOT to fab a adapter. Guy I work with drew up a complete mount adapter that would give me 12" more lift all around, but $800.00 in steel, plus $500.00 in labor seems a bit much for this problem. Might end up selling the blade NIB..
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Demandred
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 5:48am |
AC720Man wrote:
It’s a problem I have on my XT. I noticed it when I was loading my AC sod planter onto a trailer backwards. I couldn’t get it high enough and ended up putting it on our 6060 to load it. Now with that being said it would handle the planter under normal circumstances in a field but it doesn’t lift as high as our 6060. I’m not sure how to resolve it. Will have to study this on my lift arms to see if there is a solution. I don’t use my lift arms often so it really hasn’t been an issue other than trying to load the planter.
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Yeah, I don't know why the arms were ever made to be that low.. Mine come to rest about 6" off the ground. What implement was ever made that was that close to the ground? lol Let me know if you find anything out.
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DrAllis
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 6:16am |
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Pictures can really help. I'm working under the assumption that you have a factory OEM 3-point hitch,,?? because if you have most any brand of an add-on 3-point hitch, that may be your problem. $800 to fabricate a different hitch to make it lift higher?? Changing the top link attachment point to be a couple of inches higher and farther back on the implement will do the same thing and be far cheaper. Lowering the lifting pins on the blade would be another way to help offset your lifting height issue. Making drastic redesign changes to a factory AC 3-point hitch isn't the way to go. To do so may cause it to then not work right with other "normal" sized implements on that tractor. The lift arms can only lift up soo high and they will then contact the fuel tank. I hope you are using the tall outside middle lever to lift the hitch ?? because using one of the very rear levers may not be lifting the arms 100%.
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MACK
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 7:31am |
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Worn out cylinder bushings will also affect lift height. MACK
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Demandred
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 7:33am |
DrAllis wrote:
Pictures can really help. I'm working under the assumption that you have a factory OEM 3-point hitch,,?? because if you have most any brand of an add-on 3-point hitch, that may be your problem. $800 to fabricate a different hitch to make it lift higher?? Changing the top link attachment point to be a couple of inches higher and farther back on the implement will do the same thing and be far cheaper. Lowering the lifting pins on the blade would be another way to help offset your lifting height issue. Making drastic redesign changes to a factory AC 3-point hitch isn't the way to go. To do so may cause it to then not work right with other "normal" sized implements on that tractor. The lift arms can only lift up soo high and they will then contact the fuel tank. I hope you are using the tall outside middle lever to lift the hitch ?? because using one of the very rear levers may not be lifting the arms 100%. |
Yeah, using the factory 3 point, and the right lever to raise/lower the hitch. What he came up with is a framework that would mount to the blade, not the tractor, to drop it's hitch points by a foot. No modification to the tractor at all When I left for work this morning I walked out there to check about the top link mount on the tractor, and sure enough, like a previous person had stated the mount IS upside down... And I had the thought that I could also machine out a couple of extensions for the lift cylinders mount on the arms to cause them to push out farther, and thus change how much they will travel up. No chance of hitting the fuel tank currently. At max lift they dont even come up to level. Maybe 28" from the ground tops.
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DanWi
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 4:40pm |
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I think the factory top link for the 100 series is shorter then aftermarket and other brands of top link, I know the ones I have can be quit short if turned all the way in.
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Demandred
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 6:05pm |
DanWi wrote:
I think the factory top link for the 100 series is shorter then aftermarket and other brands of top link, I know the ones I have can be quit short if turned all the way in. |
100 series? is that a cat 2? so far all I have found in cat 2 is the same length as the one I got.
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DrAllis
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 7:12pm |
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The lift arms (connected to the lift cylinders) should come up waaaaay higher than level. !!!! I'm going to say almost 45 degrees !!!!!! If the lifting links are correct and shortened clear up they too should have the nearly the same 45 degree angle when 100% fully UP.
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Demandred
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 8:06pm |
DrAllis wrote:
The lift arms (connected to the lift cylinders) should come up waaaaay higher than level. !!!! I'm going to say almost 45 degrees !!!!!! If the lifting links are correct and shortened clear up they too should have the nearly the same 45 degree angle when 100% fully UP. |
Oops. Yes, you are exactly right. Just went out and checked. Somehow I was getting their lift height associated with "level" because they end up a little lower than waist high to me. (haven't gotten much sleep in the last few days).. Anyway, in the light of day, the arms could come up another several inches before touching the body panel under the gas tank, but now I wonder if that would help any..
I replaced one of the arm lift links a few years back with a junkyard part that may be the answer.
The old one was fine thread, and had only a little bit of take up available, because it was so long to begin with, the replacement was coarse thread and much shorter. Think I just need to replace the other one with this same short coarse thread one, and that will give me almost 4" more lift right off the bat. That and turn the top link mount right side up, and use the shortest top link I can find or make may be enough.
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DrAllis
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 8:27pm |
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Draft arms (lower arms) should be able to be adjusted to stay parallel (or higher) to the lift arms.
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DanWi
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Posted: 18 Jun 2021 at 9:25pm |
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190's are part of the 100 series of tractors 170 175 180 196 190 200
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Dakota Dave
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Posted: 19 Jun 2021 at 9:01am |
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My 190 the 3pt arms are within 5" of the ground when down. I mover the 3pt pins on my snowblower down to the bottom of the blower frame they were at the top I couldn't lift very high. my 3pt mower has cat one pins with bushings on it they are already about 6" from the ground with the mower sitting on the ground. I have a snap coupler with an adapter 3pt. the mower I just use a chain instead of a top link. I couldn't find a top link short enough.
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