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AC WD45 
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Joined: 28 Sep 2009
Location: Mid Michigan
Points: 2060
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 Topic: 8 volt battery
Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 2:42pm |
1. Would it be enough to turn over the WD45 with the D17 compression kit? right now i'm running dual 6 volt. 2. would the stock genny charge it as it does the 6? 3. would I need to change the lights? 4. would I need to change the coil? 5. where can I get one?
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German Shepherd dad
1957 Allis Chalmers WD45
#WD234847
1951 Allis Chalmers WD
#WD88193
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CAL(KS)
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Joined: 18 Sep 2009
Location: Chapman, KS
Points: 3789
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Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 2:59pm |
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i dont have any experience with 8 volt batteries, however, IF you have to change the items you listed when going to 8 volt (i dont think you wil have to) then why not just make it 12 volt. much more common and i in my opinion better anyway.
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Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20
Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15
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Gerald J.
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Hamilton Co, IA
Points: 5636
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Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 6:27pm |
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The 8 volt battery is a stopgap to avoid a bit of the care a 6 volt system demands. In their day a 6 volt care required cleaning battery posts about twice a year and some attention to brushes in starter and generator.
A 6 volt generator with two brushes and a voltage regulator will not charge an 8 volt battery. A 3 brush 6 volt generator with just a cutout will usually charge the 8 volt battery. It will also overcharge any battery connected unless current is diverted by running headlights during the day when the battery starts to bubble, its not nice to a battery.
Whether the 8 volt battery will crank the enhanced engine depends on the quality and cranking amps of the 8 volt battery. Likely you can find several 6 volt of better quality than the 8 volt and using 2 6 volt in parallel gets you more cranking amps, but you can loose them in starter cables that are skinny.
Many 6 volt era automotive lamps were rated 6-8 volts, but its certain lamp life will be shorter on an 8 volt system. There weren't many 8 volt lamps ever made. Ditto coil.
Get thee some 00 starter cables, plus a heavy duty 6 volt battery, and the 6 volt will probably crank your big engine just fine.
Gerald J.
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Steve in NJ
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Andover, NJ
Points: 11926
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Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 10:25pm |
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A 901 Deka 6V Battery with the correct size cables (1 gauge or larger) hooked to a correctly rebuilt starter motor will turn that engine over. The Gennie will charge the Battery normally without any trouble. The key here is to have a stout Starter motor to do the job.
I can rebuild your starter motor to do the job without a problem if interested...
Steve@B&B
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DaveKamp
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Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Location: LeClaire, Ia
Points: 5971
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Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 10:30pm |
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+1 on cables. A 6-volt system, particularly at high CCA, will be EXTREMELY sensitive to ANY resistance in the heavy wiring and connections.
+1 on skipping the 8v and going to 12... primarily because it's an easy changeover, with bulbs and coil readily available, and allows use of common battery sizes, typical battery chargers, and a modern alternator. While it IS possible to modify the generator, or even swap with a different unit of same form-factor, i would only suggest it if you wanted everything to look stock. A modern alternator will solve many issues with one swoop.
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steve(ill)
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: illinois
Points: 85654
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Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 10:31pm |
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why would anyone buy a 8 volt battery ? 12 volt is the standard these days... Yea, the tractor came with 6 volts, but so what. Put a good 12 volt battery and go with a good generator / regulator or an alternator with internal voltage regulator and be similar to all trucks and tractors.
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Like them all, but love the "B"s.
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Dave in il
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Joined: 22 Sep 2009
Location: Manville Il
Points: 1748
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Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 10:31pm |
Not to disagree with Gerald, but an 8 volt battery IS a stop gap measure, to keep an outdated wore out 6 volt system starting a tractor without spending a fortune replacing cables and rebuilding the generator and starter. You don't have to replace the bulbs or coil and if your generator is charging it will keep the battery up. I purchased a WD with an 8 volt battery about two years ago. In a pinch we have swapped the 8 volt into a WC with charging problems and used the WD to recharge the 6 volt WC battery. After the 6 volt is charged we swap them back. The WD starts ok with the 8 volt, but barley starts with the fully charged 6 volt. It probably needs the starter rebuilt and new cables but the previous owner decided it was cheaper and easier to put the 8 volt in instead. When the time comes that the 8 volt will no longer start the tractor I'll upgrade to a 12 volt system rather than rebuilding the 6 volt. There is a reason the D17 and newer tractors came with a 12 volt system. I would have changed it already if it wasn't still working. The WC will get converted soon.
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AGCO My Allis Gleaner Company
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Gerald J.
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Hamilton Co, IA
Points: 5636
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Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 11:45pm |
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Applying 8 volts to a worn out starter with wimpy cables is kicking a dead horse to make it move. its abusive so some extent and at best a stop gap temporary solution to the problems of bad cables and connections.
Gerald J.
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SHAMELESS
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Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: EAST NE
Points: 29486
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 12:43am |
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all my neighbors used 8-volt batteries in all their 6 volt vehs and equipment for years! dunno if they changed anything or not, but they said they sure started better in the winter time!
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DrAllis
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Points: 21393
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 6:09am |
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Making sure the healthy Delco starter has a CENTER BEARING on the armature is imperative !! A big heavy ground cable going to the starter mounting setscrew is also sometimes helpful.
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MACK
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Joined: 17 Nov 2009
Points: 7664
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 6:30am |
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8V battery is a short life battery. Just like putting a bandade on a cut that needs stitches. Go to 12V and forget the old system of 6 & 8V. MACK
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Richard
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Springfield, IL
Points: 198
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 7:36am |
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Back in the day we put an 8V battery in our 45 but didn't see any difference in how it started. I don't remember having any charging issues. That engine had been rebuilt with big pistons and it had quite a bit of compression. My current 45 has been converted to 12V and it start easily in the coldest weather.
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AC WD45
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Joined: 28 Sep 2009
Location: Mid Michigan
Points: 2060
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 8:24am |
I would go to 12 volt, but I don't want an ugly alternator. I'm trying to get around that some how
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German Shepherd dad
1957 Allis Chalmers WD45
#WD234847
1951 Allis Chalmers WD
#WD88193
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Chuck(ONT)
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Ontario
Points: 1055
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 8:33am |
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Pick up a12v delco generator and regulator, or have your 6v genny updated to 12v.
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Never take life too seriously.
Nobody gets out alive anyway!
1C 1 WD45 1 AC180
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jaybmiller
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Greensville,Ont
Points: 24350
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 9:15am |
'Ugly alternator' ? Get a Nippon-Denso alternator, real common on 'off shore ' cars,forklifts, etc. About the size of a G generator, so no ugly brackets or hacked up sheet metal !I was going to put one on the '53 G but just sold it..
Even the CS-130 Delco alternators are a good fit.
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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)
Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water
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Gerald J.
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Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Hamilton Co, IA
Points: 5636
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 10:32am |
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I had an 8N that started poorly. I took the starter to an automotive electric shop (now closed) and insisted on new bushings. They didn't want to, but did. It started much better because under heavy load the armature was dragging on a file pole piece wasting most of its torque. It has to have good bushings to keep that from happening.
Gerald J.
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DougS
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Joined: 03 Nov 2011
Location: Iowa
Points: 2490
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 11:34am |
 jaybmiller wrote:
'Ugly alternator' ? Get a Nippon-Denso alternator, real common on 'off shore ' cars,forklifts, etc. About the size of a G generator, so no ugly brackets or hacked up sheet metal !I was going to put one on the '53 G but just sold it..
Even the CS-130 Delco alternators are a good fit. |
Don't overlook an alternator for a small Kobota tractor. They are only rated at about 30 amps, but that is plenty unless you plan on pulling some electrically powered implements. If a Kobota alternator won't fit, nothing will. I've seen them on the internet for $79. They are very easy to wire.
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Skyhighballoon(MO)
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Pilot Grove, MO
Points: 3115
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 12:10pm |
I converted my WD45 to a 12 volt negative ground system with a generator. I posted this on another topic recently but will show the pics again. Wasn't hard at all. Don Bradley gave me the used working 12v generator off his AII Gleaner when he converted to an alternator. Turned out it needed bearings but I had about 5 or 6 parts generators laying around including a matching one with good bearings so I pulled the armature assembly out of a parts one and made a good 12V generator out of the two. I believe it's the same size as a D17 generator. I had to swap pulleys but that wasn't hard either. Cost = free. The mount is the factory 6 volt generator mount with a thick walled bushing for the rear mounting bolt. Cost = a few bucks from a farm supply store. I bought a D17 12 volt regulator from DJS Tractor Parts and mounted it to the front of the batter box and made up my own simple wiring harness. Regulator = about $40. I also bought a key switch (Cost = $10 or so) from Tony's Tractors. I had a spare ammeter that I put in but the 60 amp range is too big so I plan to acquire a 20 amp one to replace it this year. Works GREAT and the conversion was simple. Mike    
Edited by Skyhighballoon(MO) - 18 Mar 2012 at 12:13pm
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1981 Gleaner F2 Corn Plus w 13' flex
1968 Gleaner EIII w 10' & 330
1969 180 gas
1965 D17 S-IV gas
1963 D17 S-III gas
1956 WD45 gas NF PS
1956 All-Crop 66 Big Bin
303 wire baler, 716H, 712H mowers
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Dave in il
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Joined: 22 Sep 2009
Location: Manville Il
Points: 1748
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 10:57pm |
I converted my WD45 with a one wire Delco years ago, it's a huge improvement over the 6 volt system. It starts better, the ignition works better and since it's negative ground now I can use modern electrical accessories, like a powerport (cigarette lighter) or even a radio. I just finished a Massey 44 last summer and I wanted it to look original. I had the 6 volt generator converted and the 12 volt regulator looks identical to the 6 volt externally. It's also a negative ground. You would have to look close to know it's not factory. I had the starter gone through but nothing is needed to change to 12 volt. My WC and WD are next. There is no good reason not to go 12 volt unless you're restoring a museum piece.
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AGCO My Allis Gleaner Company
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79fordblake
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Joined: 01 Jul 2010
Location: West Kentucky
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Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 10:57pm |
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I like seeing tractors that still have generators but it is so easy to convert to alternator. The alternator on my WD45 looks factory with the correct bracket used. Alternators are cheap...smaller...and way less wiring.
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