| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
allisrutledge 
Orange Level
Joined: 30 Mar 2010
Location: SurgoinsvilleTN
Points: 1360
|
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote  Reply
 Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 7:27am |
|
All single rodded cylinders have more force on extend (Piston) than on retract (rod end) with equal psi applied. More gpm is required on extend to achieve the same stroke speed due to the rod. Given the same psi and gpm on both extend and retract. If that is a 3 inch cyl and a 1.5 rod it is about 25% less force the way they are installed. By the way I still love that tractor. Calvin , is yours going to be at Forest? Trying to decide whether to come early or stay the week after.
|
|
Allis Chalmers still exist in my mind and barns
|
 |
|
Sponsored Links
|
|
|
SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Shelbyville IL
Points: 8612
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 10:10am |
 allisrutledge wrote:
All single rodded cylinders have more force on extend (Piston) than on retract (rod end) with equal psi applied. More gpm is required on extend to achieve the same stroke speed due to the rod. Given the same psi and gpm on both extend and retract. If that is a 3 inch cyl and a 1.5 rod it is about 25% less force the way they are installed. By the way I still love that tractor. Calvin , is yours going to be at Forest? Trying to decide whether to come early or stay the week after. |
WHAT??? You lost me when you got to the part about 25% less force because of install. It's pushing apart.Don't matter which end is up. Down force yes but that's not what loaders are for.
|
|
allisrutledge
Orange Level
Joined: 30 Mar 2010
Location: SurgoinsvilleTN
Points: 1360
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 11:02am |
|
The lift capacity is apx 25% less due too the rod on the lift side.
|
|
Allis Chalmers still exist in my mind and barns
|
|
allisrutledge
Orange Level
Joined: 30 Mar 2010
Location: SurgoinsvilleTN
Points: 1360
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 11:51am |
|
Depends on how its plumbed, I'm assuming the pressure up is on the rod side( bottom) to speed it up. Sorry for the confusion
|
|
Allis Chalmers still exist in my mind and barns
|
|
SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Shelbyville IL
Points: 8612
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 12:11pm |
|
It's gotta be plumbed to push the rod out of the barrel where it has larger area to push against,period.
|
|
allisrutledge
Orange Level
Joined: 30 Mar 2010
Location: SurgoinsvilleTN
Points: 1360
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 12:51pm |
|
For max lift,yes but for speed plumb the lift pressure to the rod side. Not saying it's that way but anything is possible. Heck if the owner could put that cab on it I'm sure he could have built the loader. Probably that way to keep the dirt off the wiper. I'm just curious. I still like the tractor.
|
|
Allis Chalmers still exist in my mind and barns
|
|
injpumpEd
Orange Level Access
Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Walnut IL
Points: 5095
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 2:13pm |
|
Either way you put the cylinder, it's still extending to raise. Scott does bring up a valid point, but not really applicable here. You could flip it the other way, but it still will need to extend to raise the boom.
|
|
210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
|
|
Tbone95
Orange Level Access
Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Location: Michigan
Points: 12157
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 2:22pm |
injpumpEd wrote:
Either way you put the cylinder, it's still extending to raise. Scott does bring up a valid point, but not really applicable here. You could flip it the other way, but it still will need to extend to raise the boom. |
What he said. (and I said earlier in different words)
|
|
JohnCO
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Niwot Colo
Points: 8992
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 7:13pm |
|
Looks to be about 250 miles north of Harve, Montana. Only 127 people in the town so might not be too hard to find the owner.
|
|
"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
Allis Express participant
|
|
SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Shelbyville IL
Points: 8612
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 9:09pm |
|
I admit I don't know everything but how would plumbing in the rod side of a double action cyl make it push the out? That's how you retract the rod.No?
|
|
CTuckerNWIL
Orange Level
Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: NW Illinois
Points: 22825
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 9:27pm |
SteveM C/IL wrote:
I admit I don't know everything but how would plumbing in the rod side of a double action cyl make it push the out? That's how you retract the rod.No? |
 Ya don't have to know everything bout plumbing a cylinder, to know you can't extend the rod, by putting pressure to the rod side of the cylinder. Extending the rod is the ONLY way to raise the loader and pressure HAS to be applied to the piston side to extend it. Therefore, the 25% loss is on the DOWN stroke, not lifting. 
|
|
|
|
SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Shelbyville IL
Points: 8612
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 9:29pm |
|
Thanks Charlie. I thought CRS was gettin me.
|
|
allisrutledge
Orange Level
Joined: 30 Mar 2010
Location: SurgoinsvilleTN
Points: 1360
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 31 Jan 2019 at 9:50pm |
|
Now I know what it looks like up my butt, had my blinders on. The only reason that makes sense to me is to keep the trash off the rod ,i'll hush now
|
|
Allis Chalmers still exist in my mind and barns
|
|
Tbone95
Orange Level Access
Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Location: Michigan
Points: 12157
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 01 Feb 2019 at 8:47am |
allisrutledge wrote:
Now I know what it looks like up my butt, had my blinders on. The only reason that makes sense to me is to keep the trash off the rod ,i'll hush now |
We knew you had to get it sooner or later! Sometimes a guy gets stuck on somethin', and all reason takes a coffee break! Welcome back.
|
|
allisrutledge
Orange Level
Joined: 30 Mar 2010
Location: SurgoinsvilleTN
Points: 1360
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 01 Feb 2019 at 9:01am |
|
Thanks tbone, ifn ya ain't ever been there it's pretty scary out there and humbling on return. By the way I still like the 220 if I've not already said it. Haha. I'm gonna quit wondering for a few minutes!!!
|
|
Allis Chalmers still exist in my mind and barns
|
|
Brian F(IL)
Orange Level Access
Joined: 14 Sep 2009
Location: Paxton, IL
Points: 2715
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 01 Feb 2019 at 9:05am |
Well, gentlemen, it has been entertaining anyway! 
|
|
injpumpEd
Orange Level Access
Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Location: Walnut IL
Points: 5095
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 01 Feb 2019 at 10:17am |
Tbone95 wrote:
allisrutledge wrote:
Now I know what it looks like up my butt, had my blinders on. The only reason that makes sense to me is to keep the trash off the rod ,i'll hush now |
We knew you had to get it sooner or later! Sometimes a guy gets stuck on somethin', and all reason takes a coffee break! Welcome back. |
|
|
210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!
|
|
SteveM C/IL
Orange Level Access
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Shelbyville IL
Points: 8612
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 01 Feb 2019 at 12:15pm |
|
As an aside....the quarry haul trucks have been installing dump cylinders upside down for years.Guessing it's to keep crap from building up on ram stages.
|
|
