Unofficial Allis Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Allis Chalmers > Farm Equipment
  New Posts New Posts
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

#1 fuel

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
HD6GTOM View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 30 Nov 2009
Location: MADISON CO IA
Points: 4997
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HD6GTOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: #1 fuel
    Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 12:12pm
I heard today one of the local fuel suppliers is telling his customers that #1 fuel will be no longer available in the state of Iowa. I spoke to the guys that took over my fuel business. They said that is not true, the pipeline terminal in Des Moines is out of it but they are pulling semi loads of it out of Council Bluffs.
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
KJCHRIS View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 21 Dec 2015
Location: WC Iowa
Points: 246
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KJCHRIS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 4:30pm
That "TALL TALE" from some fuel dealers has been going on in Western, Iowa for over a decade. Every few years it pops up. Strange thing is, supplier suddenly finds some in a few days. BUT wants a premium price for it, like 35 - 75cents a gallon.
But with temps like we're having, I'd sure not want to have untreated #2 in a tractor or truck that I need to have running. Fuel that won't drip out of the tank is not much fun!! Was -18 Tuesday, below 0 will be the highs tomorrow to next Tuesday with Sunday to be -22 to -26 low, depending on weather predictor..  
AC 200, CAH, AC185D bareback, AC 180D bareback, AC 7000 CAH, D17 III, WF. D17 Blackbar grill, NF. D15 SFW. Case 1175 CAH, Bobcat 543B,
Back to Top
Ted J View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 05 Jul 2010
Location: La Crosse, WI
Points: 16568
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ted J Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 9:42pm
Used to be the only thing that really needed it was home fuel/ furnaces.  Plug in a tractor or diesel truck and let it warm up and you never needed #1.  BUT, that was YEARS ago...
"Allis-Express"
19?? WC / 1941 C / 1952 CA / 1956 WD45 / 1957 WD45 / 1958 D-17
Back to Top
DougS View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 03 Nov 2011
Location: Iowa
Points: 2490
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DougS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 10:08pm
When I lived in Kneebraskee years ago there was a stretch of HWY 81 where the truckers would turn north on those ultra cold days and presto, two miles later the fuel would be jelled up in the filter.  My BMW had a heater in the fuel filter chamber and I never had problems in Iowa, even on a -18 degree morning three winters ago. I ran winter blend from the pump which is I dunno... 35/65 #1 to #2 or something.
Back to Top
Gary Burnett View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Virginia
Points: 2188
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary Burnett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 7:34am
I never run anything but diesel fuel from the auto diesel pumps,supposedly its supposed to be #1.Figure they aren't going to put any bad fuel in those tanks for diesel cars to run.
Back to Top
DougS View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 03 Nov 2011
Location: Iowa
Points: 2490
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DougS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 8:49am
The oil companies call it “blended diesel.” I’ve heard it’s a blend of #1 and #2.
Back to Top
Jwmac7060 View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 04 Jan 2014
Location: Indiana
Points: 920
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jwmac7060 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 10:58am
Number#1 is just kerosene. All of the diesel from Marathon and other fuel distributors right now is cut about 70% number 1 and 30% number 2....they don't want to sell just #1 so they have plenty to blend that's why they say there is a shortage
Back to Top
DougS View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 03 Nov 2011
Location: Iowa
Points: 2490
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DougS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 1:23pm
I'd rather have as little #1 in the blend as needed anyway.  #2 gives better economy and has better lubricating properties.
Back to Top
HD6GTOM View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 30 Nov 2009
Location: MADISON CO IA
Points: 4997
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HD6GTOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 7:32pm
Guys #1 fuel is not kerosene. Kerosene is refined more than #1 fuel. Doug you are right farm fuel is blended at the bulk plant, this cold the more #1 the better.

Edited by HD6GTOM - 30 Dec 2017 at 7:35pm
Back to Top
shameless dude View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 10 Apr 2017
Location: east NE
Points: 9464
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shameless dude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 9:06pm
there hasn't been a single semi go past our house for the last 2 days/nights. and what diesel pickups that are driving past don't sound very good. my diesel is tucked away in the car port til this extreme cold goes away. it has #2 in it. as do all my tractors.
Back to Top
Jwmac7060 View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 04 Jan 2014
Location: Indiana
Points: 920
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jwmac7060 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 9:13pm
Kerosene is #1..I hauled fuel for 10 years there is absolutely no difference. When #1 or kerosene is more refined it becomes jet fuel but there is no difference between #1 and kerosene..one is called number 1 for road take reasons kerosene is not road taxed..only difference
Back to Top
KJCHRIS View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 21 Dec 2015
Location: WC Iowa
Points: 246
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KJCHRIS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 2017 at 9:59pm
Always tried to have fuel for farm at 30% #1 and 70% #2 by Nov 1, just to be sure all tractors, trucks and combine got a little blended in case early cold snap. Only got jinxed once, Halloween 1991, blended fuel was in barrels, but hadn't filled equipment, then it went below zero for 3-4 days.
 
AC 200, CAH, AC185D bareback, AC 180D bareback, AC 7000 CAH, D17 III, WF. D17 Blackbar grill, NF. D15 SFW. Case 1175 CAH, Bobcat 543B,
Back to Top
DougS View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 03 Nov 2011
Location: Iowa
Points: 2490
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DougS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 4:56am
I remember that Halloween.  I believe it hit -15 in Omaha, beating an old record by 15 degrees.  I had just taken a new job and was responsible for snow removal.  What a rude awakening.  You weren't the only one with the wrong fuel in your tanks.
Back to Top
Dave H View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Central IL
Points: 2926
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dave H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 5:22am
Semi's are running by here at 2 degrees.

Way back when I was beating one of those critters down the road, it had some sort of heater in the tank that was run by the coolant.

Also the fuel at the pump was blended to prevent jelling.  Filled up once in the middle of the winter in central FL and headed for the north land.  No problems.

Big problem is the straight #2 that is left over in seldom used tanks from the summer.  I added anti gel to the JD but am not going out to try my luck today.  Ouch
Back to Top
DougS View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 03 Nov 2011
Location: Iowa
Points: 2490
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DougS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 6:22am
Actually diesel doesn't "gel" so much as the wax begins to form in clumps.  These wax particles clog the small passages, including the fuel filters.  I believe I read somewhere that #2 has to drop to somewhere a little below zero before it begins to gel. You can get by using additives to somewhere below zero, but you better know what you are doing.  Kerosene is more foolproof.
Back to Top
Coke-in-MN View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Afton MN
Points: 38995
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Coke-in-MN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 11:31am
Cut #2 with unleaded gas to get it to flow but it seems once WAX forms on the filters it does not break down easily and changing out filters is necessary . 
 Bought fuel for pickup and 20 gallons for the backhoe  went out plowing and truck barley ran and the Perkins quit - had to tow it back to shop and warm and drain fuel - was partially bio-fuel that supplier had switched over to as was not suppose to go below ZERO - their signs on pump said blended but they had went to #2 in tanks as cheaper than the blend - they ended up giving me credit for the fuel and the tow 
 The old fuel treatment additives don't work well on the new fuels either , formulation does little on the ultra low sulfur fuels - had couple cases from 10 years back and it doesn't work  
Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
Back to Top
Coke-in-MN View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Afton MN
Points: 38995
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Coke-in-MN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 11:35am
Those blends are figured out at the refinery loading station - when you go to load a tanker the codes for the load and amounts are programmed into loading ticket codes , you enter the numbers , amount you want to load into each compartment , and what customer it's for - the computer then either adds the right dye for on or off road , Canadian shipment, heating oil or transport use . You stand by the truck and the computer does the rest . 
Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
Back to Top
HD6GTOM View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 30 Nov 2009
Location: MADISON CO IA
Points: 4997
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HD6GTOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 3:10pm
Jwmac I owned a fuel business for 15 years and I will argue with you all day long, been in the fuel labs for hours testing fuels. Kerosene is not #1 fuel. They don't even smell the same. Kero is in between #1 and jet fuel. Been there, seen it, smelled it.
Back to Top
DaveKamp View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Location: LeClaire, Ia
Points: 4129
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveKamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 7:03pm
The locomotives I've worked on all ran on #2, and had engine coolant lines that circulated into the fuel tank to increase fuel temperature specifically to prevent the fuel from coagulating in extreme cold.  In my opinion, it's always been a wise plan to do that, even for road trucks and cars, but manufacturers, particularly those whos' products are sitting out here along the interstate with flashing lights, do not agree... Pinch  Apparently, they figure that since the trucks run about 2000 hours a year, and are only shut down by this circumstance an average of 36 hours or so at an incidence, that the loss circumstances incurred by their customers are insignificant.

But it's important to realize from an engineering standpoint that adding the complexity of fuel heating takes additional materials and plumbing, which adds weight and complexity.  The seven-or-so pounds it'd require would be catastrophic in comparison to the 260lbs of lights, chrome, and fasteners of air-cleaner accent kits, dual 14" diameter exhaust stacks, lug nut covers and such.  The DEF tank, exhaust particulate filter system, and an APU to keep everything warm (rather than idling the engine) being absolutely necessary, every ounce and every dollar counts, right?

But really... Bio fuel mixes were the biggest fuel-related issues I ever ran into with my diesel-burning company truck...  it's great to feel good about the environment, and I'd not think twice about having my own grease-burning pickup truck to beat errands around town in during the summer, but I wouldn't expect a tub of bacon-fat to crawl through a 3/8" fuel line on it's own accord at -4F.  I'd expect to have a four-gallon nurse tank of #1 fuel to get it started up, and a good-sized can of STERNO under the belly of the tank to get the french-fryer to flow.
Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
Back to Top
Brian Jasper co. Ia View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level


Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Prairie City Ia
Points: 10232
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brian Jasper co. Ia Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 2:29pm
Originally posted by Jwmac7060 Jwmac7060 wrote:

Kerosene is #1..I hauled fuel for 10 years there is absolutely no difference. When #1 or kerosene is more refined it becomes jet fuel but there is no difference between #1 and kerosene..one is called number 1 for road take reasons kerosene is not road taxed..only difference
No, #1 diesel and kerosene are not the same. #1 diesel in a space heater will smoke you out while kerosene burns clean. Like Tom says, kerosene is more refined. The specific gravity for #1 is lower than kerosene.
"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford
Back to Top
darrel in ND View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Location: Hebron, ND
Points: 7687
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote darrel in ND Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 5:20pm
Well, since after tonight, the cold weather is supposed to be behind us, I can safely say this: By now I usually have 50-50 fuel plus conditioner in any diesel tractor that I plan on using in the winter. Somehow I got behind this year, and have nothing but straight number two with conditioner in em. Since it got REALLY cold, the only diesel tractor we've used is the 185 with a loader on it, and it hasn't gelled up. And it's been used every day, including today, when we woke up to minus 35, and hit a high of minus 10. And it sits outside. Outside of the fact that Howes diesel conditioner must be some good , I do have the engine compartment double wrapped with bubble foil insulation, and we have the block heater plugged in, plus a magnetic block heater on the oil pan. Darrel
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.10
Copyright ©2001-2017 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.109 seconds.


Help Support the
Unofficial Allis Forum