Allis Chalmers C Oil Filter housing upgrade

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   Hello
Has anyone ever changed the oil filter housing of the model C or B , to replace it with a more common model on current vehicles, with the thread in the center?

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John426 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 14 Aug 2012 Location: France Points: 304	Post Options Post Reply Quote John426 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: Allis Chalmers C Oil Filter housing upgrade Posted: 12 Oct 2020 at 4:44am
	Hello Has anyone ever changed the oil filter housing of the model C or B , to replace it with a more common model on current vehicles, with the thread in the center?

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jaybmiller Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Greensville,Ont Points: 24386	Post Options Post Reply Quote jaybmiller Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 12 Oct 2020 at 5:17am
	Don't think you can as they're different type of system and filter material. the 'mason jar' ones ( B,C,CA, D-14, ?) are 'bypass' systems , the 'car' style are 'full flow'. It'd be interesting to know IF it's possible( and 100% reliable)... might be a niche market. I have access to CNC so making 1000s is easy AFTER the first one. Just might not be worthwhile though, one of those.. 'if it ain't broke, don't need to fix it' things. Jay
	3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112 Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor) Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water

SteveM C/IL Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Shelbyville IL Points: 8500	Post Options Post Reply Quote SteveM C/IL Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 12 Oct 2020 at 7:47am
	It won't work because of design of system.

Gary Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 13 Sep 2009 Location: Peterborough,On Points: 5884	Post Options Post Reply Quote Gary Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 12 Oct 2020 at 7:48am
	Jay What are the differences between a D-14 149 using a Fram C-159 by-pass and a D-15 Series II 160 using a Fram PH-8A full flow. Gary

steve(ill) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85814	Post Options Post Reply Quote steve(ill) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 12 Oct 2020 at 8:41am
	On the B-C- small D series with the C159, the pump pushes oil down a hollow cam shaft to feed the inside of the motor... there is a small tube that comes out of the pump thru the top back corner of the motor and goes to the FILTER... The FILTER gets about 15% of the oil, cleans it and DUMPS BACK TO SUMP.. Oil from the filter does nothing.. about 85% of the PUMP OIL goes straight thru the hollow cam and sprays lube to the insides of the motor ... bearings/ pistons/ lobes.. etc. On a full flow system that uses the PH8 filter, the pump feeds ALL of the oil thru the filter and is cleaned, then it feeds to the motor oil passages to lube the bearings.
	Like them all, but love the "B"s.

John426 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 14 Aug 2012 Location: France Points: 304	Post Options Post Reply Quote John426 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 04 Nov 2020 at 5:13am
	I understand the principle of operation between bypass and full filter filters. But what is changing in the design of the filter? I think the bypass is before the filter. The filter would therefore not be in the bypass process, just have more or less oil to filter?

jaybmiller Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Greensville,Ont Points: 24386	Post Options Post Reply Quote jaybmiller Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 04 Nov 2020 at 5:45am
	one problem I can see would be the actual oil pump itself. I consider my D-14 very good and it registers about 15PSI. To use a 'full flow' style filter, you'd probably need to incease the pump pressure. My A-C forklift has a Buda BD153 engine and it's at least 30PSI(40 when you rev the engine). Modern cars/trucks are 50-70PSI ?? I don't know if you could easily 'replumb' the system with an external pump/filter unit but my 'gut' says it'd be pricey and not worth the effort. The 'bypass' system has worked for several decades and billions of hours so one of those ' it ain't broke, no need to fix'. That being said...it'd be an interesting project, if I had a 'stationary' engine to work on. It'd be a fun Winter project... edit. Ok I got curious.... https://www.summitracing.com/parts/til-40-527 is one style of 'addon' pump that might work, though I don't know if 2GPM is good.. there's a LOT of talk/info about EOP( Electric Oil Pumps) for hybrids/electrics for trannys... but now the sun's up, gotta make room in garaeg for more stuff from next door... Jay Edited by jaybmiller - 04 Nov 2020 at 6:04am
	3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112 Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor) Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water

Dick L Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Location: Edon Ohio Points: 5087	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dick L Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 04 Nov 2020 at 7:07am
	Most people do not under the B, C, CA, and RC oil system. I have posted is every way I know how to explain how it works. Steve just posted the basics and I fear very few will grasp it. The D 14 posted above has the same design vane pump to increase the pressure with a solid hollow camshaft with the pressure relief ball at the front of the camshaft to have a full pressure to the mains and rods. To have full pressure to the bearings you still need the filter resistance as you do in the C and other like engines engine. Without the oil being pumped down the center of the camshaft you do not have oil to the mains or rods.

steve(ill) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: illinois Points: 85814	Post Options Post Reply Quote steve(ill) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 04 Nov 2020 at 8:30am
	I understand the principle of operation between bypass and full filter filters. But what is changing in the design of the filter? I think the bypass is before the filter. The filter would therefore not be in the bypass process, just have more or less oil to filter? John, the BYPASS is AFTER the filter, and the filter DETERMINES the RESTRICTION... WIX made a filter several years ago out of paper that was similar to a car filter on restriction, and it caused many ALLIS Bypass systems to have motor failures... If you dont like the filter, then plug the tube and blank flange the filter mount.. That way NO FILTER and NO BYPASS... If you want a filter is HAS to be a PACKED COTTON design. not a spin on auto.
	Like them all, but love the "B"s.