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welding/rod recommendations

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CAL(KS) View Drop Down
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    Posted: 23 Aug 2012 at 2:47pm
Im looking at welding up my cutting bits on my HD16.  The center bit i can turn over but the two outside bits will then be shorter than the center.  @ $500 each bit last i checked, I would like to try welding.  probably looking at 1/2 inch or so.  i have some cutting edge from a newer cat loader i can weld on also.  what # rod should i be using.  will welding on 1/2 inch of cutting bit to the bottom be a waste of time?  i have put about 175 hrs on in 2 years so not using every day, mainly cleanig ponds, terraces, dirt work annd tree removal.  it is a cable blade and does not go into the ground well, especially in hard dry material like everywhere this year. i have done quite a bit of welding but really only on mild steel.  any advice welcome. 
 
thank you


Edited by CAL(KS) - 23 Aug 2012 at 2:56pm
Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20

Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15
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Ian Beale View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ian Beale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 2012 at 4:39pm
Cal,
 
I did this on our FA 10 for similar reasons with what are known here as "hockey sticks".
 
These are pre-formed sections shaped like the lower edge of the bit which you trim and weld on.  I've just used a low hydrogen rod (WIA 16TC) which seems to be standing up to my use so far without any hard facing over the top. 
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Coke-in-MN View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Coke-in-MN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 2012 at 5:14pm
Might have to pre-heat the parts your welding and depending on your welder if you have a AC or DC unit . Use a 7018 low hydrogen rod . If AC - look for that rod rated for both AC/DC rev polarity as some rod will not run good on AC.
 You can finish up using a Hard surfacing rod to weld stringers into the bits to stand up to the abrasion factor of the material . This also comes in AC or DC rod. 
 If your using wire feed  then a 70E wire in diameter you use like .035 or .
Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."
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Mactractor View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mactractor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 2012 at 7:09pm
Always preheat that quenched and tempered steel. I use 7016 rods for the root runs, then 7018 to fill the big vees. I always post heat after welding to stress relieve and minimise the chance of any cracking later
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CAL(KS) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CAL(KS) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 2012 at 8:36pm
exactly the kind of feedback i was looking for
thank you guys
Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20

Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ian Beale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Aug 2012 at 2:51am
After some more looking I find that 16TC is 7016 in the language here.
 
Other welding finds have been
 
Cast manifolds - Lincoln Ferroweld
 
Other interesting things - Castolin Eutectic 185 XFC work hardening brazing rod
 
Dodgers on both on the net
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LoggerLee View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LoggerLee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 2012 at 8:27am
Yeah, I'd just use 7018 and hardface the weld a little, not that I'm an expert or anything.

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mlpankey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlpankey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 2012 at 8:54am
I second that 60-10 for deep penetratio. 7018 for hot pass case hardening rod the final.
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Rawleigh View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rawleigh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 2012 at 10:35am
6011 for the root pass followed by FRESH 7018 rod.  Then cross hatch with hard face.
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Butch(OH) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Butch(OH) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 2012 at 10:44am

Hate to see time and effort wasted when it comes to such things. How many times do you want to weld them back on? What you propose can be done but is no place for 60xx series rods, cold joints and non full depth welds. The alloys used for cutting edges and corner bits vary a lot but at the least they will be T-1, sometimes sold as AR 360. More likely they are 400 hardox or better.   You need to full depth vee the joint (yes, to a point) and also spread the parts a bit, we alwys use rod stubs with the flux knocked off. Properly done there will be weld all the way through, not just laid on top.  Like Coke said heat the parts first. Lacking experiance or a temple stick to guide you if the heat from the parts isn't a bit uncomfortable  while welding they are not hot enough. As for rod I like 11018 although 7018 will work if the particular alloys involved are not too tough. If AC is all you have then you are stuck with the AC variant of 7018,  You will sometimes see 60XX series rod recomended for root passes but I have never seen them used in the field, low hydrogen all the way up. When welding if you hear the "tink" of cracking you might as well stop because the are going to break off at the first rock. Have not found cooling to be critical or any post welding treatment except one time on a drag bucket lip that I suspect was some type of casting. Good luck.



Edited by Butch(OH) - 28 Aug 2012 at 10:46am
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LoggerLee View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LoggerLee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 2012 at 11:42am
Originally posted by Butch(OH) Butch(OH) wrote:

Hate to see time and effort wasted when it comes to such things. How many times do you want to weld them back on? What you propose can be done but is no place for 60xx series rods, cold joints and non full depth welds. The alloys used for cutting edges and corner bits vary a lot but at the least they will be T-1, sometimes sold as AR 360. More likely they are 400 hardox or better.   You need to full depth vee the joint (yes, to a point) and also spread the parts a bit, we alwys use rod stubs with the flux knocked off. Properly done there will be weld all the way through, not just laid on top.  Like Coke said heat the parts first. Lacking experiance or a temple stick to guide you if the heat from the parts isn't a bit uncomfortable  while welding they are not hot enough. As for rod I like 11018 although 7018 will work if the particular alloys involved are not too tough. If AC is all you have then you are stuck with the AC variant of 7018,  You will sometimes see 60XX series rod recomended for root passes but I have never seen them used in the field, low hydrogen all the way up. When welding if you hear the "tink" of cracking you might as well stop because the are going to break off at the first rock. Have not found cooling to be critical or any post welding treatment except one time on a drag bucket lip that I suspect was some type of casting. Good luck.


My bad, I assumed that he'd know it had to be veed clear back. I guess I could have been more thorough. I'd just drop the coin on the right bits, but sometimes money is worth a lot more than time.
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CAL(KS) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CAL(KS) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2012 at 7:20am
yes, these pieces are V'd and welded all the way through.  I finished up one side yesterday.  Used nearly 5lbs of rod just on RH side.  7018 DC reverse polarity all the way through, worked well.  Ill have to post a picture of my before and after results. And for about $30 for 10lbs of rod and some time i think it was worth it.  If if doesnt hold up i can always purchase bits later if i have to.  thanks

Edited by CAL(KS) - 02 Sep 2012 at 7:24am
Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20

Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15
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