190 and hydraulic loader ???

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   I had an all hydraulic  Westendorf loader mounted on my 190, now having problems getting the hydraulic rams to work. at First i had i think the wrong couplers on the hoses, now it will work some on the rear outlets, but not well. Is there some special way to set the tractor hydraulic controls so i can work the hydraulic controls on the loader valve controler?   Help thanks Tman

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tractorman Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 22 Sep 2009 Location: west central wi Points: 1046	Post Options Post Reply Quote tractorman Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: 190 and hydraulic loader ??? Posted: 25 Nov 2011 at 8:41pm
	I had an all hydraulic Westendorf loader mounted on my 190, now having problems getting the hydraulic rams to work. at First i had i think the wrong couplers on the hoses, now it will work some on the rear outlets, but not well. Is there some special way to set the tractor hydraulic controls so i can work the hydraulic controls on the loader valve controler? Help thanks Tman
	Play on 38 B 49 WF , working on D14, D15 B10, Bee 12 B110. use 185 and 190

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darrel in ND Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 22 Nov 2009 Location: Hebron, ND Points: 8694	Post Options Post Reply Quote darrel in ND Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 Nov 2011 at 9:23pm
	If I understand you correctly, Tman, you want to run the loader control valve off of one of the tractor hydraulic outlets at the back of the tractor? If you do this, first and foremost, make sure that the loader control valve is an open center valve. Make sure that the tractor outlet works by trying it on some other hydraulic implement. Also, it will make a difference which direction the oil is flowing, thus you may have to stroke the tractor hydraulic lever in the other direction. And are you holding the hydraulic lever in with a tarp strap or something of that nature?

MACK Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Points: 7664	Post Options Post Reply Quote MACK Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 Nov 2011 at 9:35pm
	Your 3 Pt and other remote will not work much (if at all) when the other remote is tied back. MACK

m16ty Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 28 Jan 2011 Location: TN Points: 1474	Post Options Post Reply Quote m16ty Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 25 Nov 2011 at 9:48pm
	Most AC tractors with loaders I've seen use the tractor remotes instead of a separate valve. They work fine like that and as Mack said, the other outlets and 3 point will be useless while the loader is hooked up using the loader valve. Check and make sure the valve on your loader is set up for open center operation (most loader valves can be converted from closed center to open center). Also make sure you have the oil flow going in the right direction and you'll have to tie the remote lever back. You can plumb in the main pressure line going to the tractor valves if you want use of your rear remotes and loader. You have to do this in series. Meaning, the line coming from your pump goes to your loader valve inlet and the line will go from your loader valve outlet and tie back in to your line going to the tractor remote valves. Edited by m16ty - 25 Nov 2011 at 9:50pm

tbran Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Paris Tn Points: 3504	Post Options Post Reply Quote tbran Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 Nov 2011 at 8:35am
	This is the easiest way we have found - locate the main outlet from the pump and remove line fabricate a minimum 5/8" hose and run to the inlet of an open center valve WITH RELIEF VALVE INSTALLED - valve needs to have a power beyond sleeve and out of this run another same size hose BACK to the line you just disconnected to power the hydraulics as before. Connect a 1/2" line from the outlet port or tank port on the valve to the 1/2" pipe plug drain directly under the belly of the tractor where the suction and return tubes are. This 3 line setup using power beyound will prevent blowing the orings on the loader valve when the tractor remote service vavles are used after a few hours of operation. Loader valve needs to be 20 gpm or larger to prevent hyd heating on long term usage.

m16ty Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 28 Jan 2011 Location: TN Points: 1474	Post Options Post Reply Quote m16ty Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 Nov 2011 at 5:54pm
	Tbran, I've hooked them up before with just in and out (no third line to the tank) without any foreseen problems. What causes the valve o-rings to blow? Back pressure on the outlet line?

MACK Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 17 Nov 2009 Points: 7664	Post Options Post Reply Quote MACK Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 Nov 2011 at 10:15pm
	m16ty, you are lucky. If there is no return line, then there is no relief valve for the loader. Lucky it is just oring not a $$$$$$ pump. MACK

m16ty Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 28 Jan 2011 Location: TN Points: 1474	Post Options Post Reply Quote m16ty Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 Nov 2011 at 11:37pm
	Mack, I see what you are saying but if the loader is being used (and not the rear remotes) The relief valve in the loader valve should work as designed because there will be no restriction in the outlet through the tractor remote valve (open center). When the loader is not used and the rear remotes are used, the relief valve in the remote valves should work. Even if you do operate the loader and rear remotes at the same time the tractor relief valve should open if there is a overpressure. I just don't see how the loader valve is not protected. There is a return line in a two line (in and out) setup. It just flows freely through the tractor valve before it dumps back into the sump. I'm not doubting what Tbran said. I'm thinking it has something to do with back pressure on the valve outlet line and not a system over pressure problem. Maybe some brands of valves require a third line for the relief to work but all the ones I've dealt with relief into the valve outlet line.